rec.autos.simulators

1 - Of all of the reviews I've read, only one was anything but totally
positive.  At simhq
 http://www.racesimcentral.net/) the
reviewer thought that the stitching in the belts that control the wheel
cause one to oversteer in a game like GPL that requires small precise
movements.  He also mentions a similar problem in the brake pedal.  This, to
me, seems like enough of an issue to cause me to look elsewhere for a wheel,
but I've not heard of the problem anywhere else, so I'm hoping some owners
here might be able to shed some light on whether this is really much of an
issue.

2 - I'm planning on buying the RS shifter, but I may not get it immediately
and I'm curious as to how usable the paddle shifters are.  I've heard some
comments that they're somewhat uncomfortable/difficult to use.  Any
thoughts?

3 - I've got a small desk area on which to fit this setup (about 20 inches
wide due to the shape of my desk, although depth is not an issue.)
Act-labs.com says that the width of the wheel is 15 inches, but didn't
mention the width of the shifter, so I don't know if I'll be able to fit the
2 side by side.  Does anyone know the width of either just the shifter, or
the shifter and the wheel together?

4 - Finally, how easy is it to remove and replace the wheel when not in use?
I've read that the desktop clamp system is somewhat clumsy.  How bad does
this make it to constantly remove and re-install the wheel as often as twice
a day?

Thanks in advance for any advice.  I really want to get this wheel, I just
want to make sure it's the right wheel for me.  If I don't go with the RS,
I'll probably have to go with the MS FFB wheel, and I'd rather not put more
money into Microsoft's pocket.  Thanks again!

Tex

Yeah, the wheel movement is notchy, even after hours of break-in time (on
mine). I have become more aggressive with the wheel when driving GPL,
using arm strength to over come this, putting the wheel where *I* want it
to be. Not where the little notches want it. Works somewhat. Arms were
sore at first. :)

THE PEDALS SUCK. Take them off and rewire something, anything else up to
the wheel.

I haven't used them much, but they seem alright. Just be gentle and
caring with your goods and they ought to do.

21 1/2" wide with the shifter snugged up against the wheel. The shifter
uses a metal bar that slides under the wheel and when you clamp the wheel
to the desk, it is clamped along with it. An inch or two of the shifter
*** off the side of your desk ought to be no problem. Unless there is
a wall there. ;)

It's cumbersome. All the wires come up to the wheel (unlike my old Logi,
one wire came up to the desk with it). That's three sets, plus the
shifter I need to get up off the floor and guide all the wires around my
computer case and onto the desk, shuffling mousepad and keyboard around.

I like the RS, I think. I am giving it a lot of time. The shifter is the
main thing, it adds so much to the experience. I don't want to go back to
paddle shifting in GPL.

MRSisson

--
LOAD "GPL",8,1
RUN

I can't agree with the oversteering thing due to the dents in the belt, that
is utter rubbish, the reveiwer should have more control over his right foot
and that's all, because if you keep the wheel turned at the same angle but
accelerate earlier you will UNDERSTEER, do it has nothign to do with the
belt, besides that there is also a tweak on GTX's page to make the wheel
smoother.

www.slottweak.com

--
Chris "Ambulater" Lee
"Don't Bother Running.........You'll Just Die Tired."
Reviews at www.sim-arena.com

The feel of the wheel does not have to be notchy.  You mainly see people
complaining about this in GPL and I would argue it's largely because of
their core.ini settings.  I know know, this opens a can of worms,
but..............   A lot of people run the "damping" setting in the
core.ini way too high which results in very strong grass and guard rail
effects, but also tends to make the wheel feel more notchy then it needs to.
Granted you can feel the belts in the FRS a bit more than some other wheels
(especially when new), but I don't see it as a major control issue.  On the
other hand, the pedals are a mixed bag to be sure.  On the upside the pedals
are design very smartly so they don't slide during use.  This is done by
orienting the pedals to require downward force instead of forward force that
pushes the pedals away.  Unfortunately, they both have a real sticking point
in them (more noticable when new) that makes fine throttle control a bit
tricky and fine brake control frustrating.  Fortunately RS Labs is at work
on a high-end hard-core pedal system with a clutch that is supposed to
adress these issues sometime this year.  The new pedals will NOT come with
the wheel but will be sold seperately so you're not losing anything by
buying now.  It sounds like the price range they are shooting at for the
pedals should be pretty moderate, maybe as low as $80!  The current pedals
get much better with use and many do the www.slottweak.com revision to
improve responsiveness.

Not usre what all the hub-bub is here.  I know the original paddles were
pretty flimsy, but the current paddles seem just fine to me.  I used them
for a about a month before i got my shifter and had no problems...........of
course after getting the shifter with the 5 speed GPL plate I'll never go
back.

You might have a problem here.  I just measured and the wheel and shifter
side by side our 21 3/4".  However, they don't have to be mounted side by
side as the shifter comes with a fairly long cord.  I've seen some guys
mount the shifter low on the arm rest of their chair for a more natural
position.

I'm not sure why anyone would complain about the clamping system.  You want
to see a pain in the ***just check out the TM NASCAR Pro I was using prior
to the RS.  I find the system for clamping the RS to be comparitviely
ingenious and easy.  I take it off every night when I'm done with it so the
kids don't mess with it, and I switch back and forth btween the RS and my TM
HOTAS constantly.

It's a great wheel, the shifter experience is outstanding, and it's only
going to get better when the new high end pedal system with the clutch comes
out.

There are a couple things to consider. First, you don't have to run the
Overall Device Gain at 100%. Turning it down to 60% or so in many games will
almost eliminate the notches and still provide plenty of FF strength. That's
what the setting is there for.

Second, in  GPL you'll get more pull on the wheel (notchiness) with lower
Torques values in core.ini. A simple test for this is to set your Damping in
core.ini to any reasonable value, then try different values for the torque
setting. You'll notice that the higher the value, the less notchiness you'll
feel.

Many of the core.ini settings were established when the LWFF was the
*** wheel and the Force RS wasn't yet introduced.  Given the huge
differences between these two wheels, ask yourself if it really makes sense
that the settings for the LWFF (like torque=225 and damping=40) would also
work well for the RS. If you're happy with these settings, fine. But don't
use them just because they were recommended for the LWFF a year and a half
ago.

--
Slot

Tweaks & Reviews
www.slottweak.com

Thanks again!

Tex