rec.autos.simulators

                                                Don Scurlock

I agree, I love the wheel. A little alarming how it seems to
disintigrate on to my keyboard tho!

The two foot question has also been plaguing me- do Indy or F1 drivers
us two feet for accell/decell, or just one? I don't even know if they
use a pedal clutch- if so, I would assume they must use right foot
only for accell/decell. If anyone can answer that for me, I'll be
thankful. Slow or fast, I'd like to do it the way they do it. I
originally drove 2 foot, now with my T2 I'm driving one foot.

Fact is, I've finally gotten my times to where they were before I
bought the T2- I did a 52.677 on long beach today, my all time best.
The irony is that I know I am driving so much better now  than I ever
have (I worked very hard after seeing my times go back up with the
T2)- one wonders what the new  times would be on my old setup! Fact
is, I can race at 100% and win now, so I am more than happy to lvie
with the T2.

Thanks for the response

Ah, well, this seems to be true for _most_ tracks, but there is
at least one track where driving without steering help
( with a wheel ) is superior to driving with steering-assistance.
Just a few days ago the HOF-pole in Mexico went to a driver
who drives without any aids at all.
It seems that driving without SA ( steering assistance )
is faster at tracks which feature lots of fast left-right
sweeps ( Esses in Mexico ) because you can choose
your driving line freely and don't have to stick to
the line that steering-help "suggests" you to use...

However, driving through chicanes without SA is much harder on the
other hand....

Hmm, THAT is very weird indeed because AFAIK most of the records in ICR2
were driven with a wheel and with analogue throttle/brake control ( pedals ).
Laguna Seca : 1:04.751
Long Beach : 0:50.xyz
and so on....

Personally I find it to be exactly the other way round. :-)  
I've been driving with a joystick and acc/braked with the buttons
and although it wasn't too bad, when I tried it with a wheel
at a friends place, acceleration and especially braking seemed
to have improved noticeably ..

Besides, I found that you can be more creative when driving with
pedals. Driving style affects the car behaviour much more than
when driving "digitally".
Whatever... when GP2 ships, I'll most certainly get myself
a wheel/pedal combo anyway. :-)

Regards.
                                        IV

___________________________________________________________________________

 Ivanhoe 'Tacho' Vasiljevich            Student of Technical Physics at the  

  - http://stud1.tuwien.ac.at/~e8925403                                      
___________________________________________________________________________

Regards,
Paul.

   The game can't distinguish between a joystick on the X axis, and a
steering wheel. It can however tell digital gas/brake from analog when
you set your controls, and that is where it seems to make a change in
the traction/acceleration settings.
  But since your doing 52's and I'm doing 56's,  I'll have to conceed that
what's really slowing ME down is my driving!  I also don't enjoy chasing
setups, so I just use the qualifing setup and add fuel for just about
everything in ICR2 and Nascar.  

  Many realworld drivers in F1, Indy, Nascar, World Rally, and any class
you care to mention use the left foot braking technique.  F1 and Indy
drivers only need to use the clutch from a standing start,  once moving
all up/down shifting is done clutchless,  so yes,  it is the most realistic
way to drive the sims.  Be aware that gas and brake when applied at the
same time will react differently depending on whether your pedals are
linked(on the same axis) or on seperate axes. Seperate axes will react
realistically and is the way to go if your pedals support it.

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   That's great to know and is certainly motivating,  unfortunately it
has yet to be my experience.  But as I mentioned above, my driving has
room to improve as do my setups.  
   I do seem to remember Rick Genter acknowledging the digital traction/
acceleration advantage in a recent post, am I'm wrong ?

  I couldn't agree more, not to mention the increase in the fun factor.
I highly recommend a system that supports seperate axes for gas/brake,
it really adds to the realism.
                                                Don Scurlock

Please excuse the extreme snipping.... but here's an open question
for Rick Genter or anyone else with an inside scoop at Papyrus.

" I s   t h i s   t r u e ? "

C'mon, don't leave us hangin'

If so, then if I wish to compete with one of the virtual race scenarios, I should only
race against others with a T2 or other wheel/pedal combo and not against a joystick
player.   The odds would be against me for having a better input system.

[Possible scenario?]  A joystick is a "single joystick" input device, and the T2 is setup
as a "dual joystick" device.   Could this make a difference?   ...and if it did, could I
use the adaptor to make the T2 act as a single joystick and gain back that lost "edge"?

BTW, Rick, I've tried not to flood you with questions on the newsgroups, I think you're
probably insane for getting your nose in here.   Quite a few people seem to like to use
you for a punching bag-or at least a focal point for frustration.   I won't.   But since
you're here, I can't think of a better place to get the truth.

..if you dare to tell.  :-)

thanks
Mike

Rick Genter
Technical Lead, IndyCar Racing II
Sierra On-Line, Inc.

          I remember hearing somewhere that in some kind of car racing
(completely forget which), they use double-clutching (?), meaning that
the drivers engage the clutch to first shift into neutral where the
RPMs are raised to a desired level, and then again to shift into their
desired gear.  That all sounds rather difficult.  But I can't for the
life of me remember which racing sport this technique was used in (or
if it was false to being with).  Any ideas?  Thanks!

--Evan

However, the ability to use half throttle around a corner instead of cycling
"on - off" with a button *should* more than make up for it.  
Maybe we just need to get out of "game mode" and into "sim mode" and
learn to drive again???  :-)

Mike

Rick Genter
Technical Lead, IndyCar Racing II
Sierra On-Line, Inc.

...

Would you then advise us to "short calibrate" our brake and throttle limits? This would guarantee reaching the
limits but does the sim freak if the limits are exceeded?  I know, I should/will test it myself :) This might
be a good tip because I know that my values vary during the calibration step.

Jeff Haas

the whole thing boils down to preferrence.  some of the very fastest
guys around are  using wheels.  some of them are using sticks.  some
folks go faster with sticks than wheels, but i can assure you that
for MY preferrence, i'm almost 1 sec faster with a wheel than a stick,
and i have mulitples of each.

Brian Wong                              Systems Engineering Group (Servers)

...

How's the T2 rate amongst your multiples, and do you prefer 2 foot or
one foot "pedalling"?