Thanks for your comments. Actually, the first thing I did was to try to
make the Logitech wheel fit in the Hyper, but it doesn't work out. All I
can say about Force Feedback is that we will do it when the software
technology is where we want it to be. Again, the Hyper Stimulator is
designed to be upgradeable so it in no way is it a disadvantage to own a
Hyper. Hyper Stimulator customers will be able to add Force Feedback later
on. I do think implied or expressed in Pat's message what offered the best
overall racing simulation experience and frankly, I truly believe we offer
that. I hope get the chance to spend some time behind a Hyper Stimulator
Historic Model some day. Thanks for your comments. They are always
appreciated. Now answer the trivial question I posted today. Don't answer
it too quickly if you know the answer. Let the group guess awhile. You
could email me if you want your answer.
--
Rory S. Brown
Canadian Distributor for Hyper Stimulator
"The World's Best Racing Car Simulators"
Visit www.hyperstimcanada.com
Home Designed Computers by Rory
"Custom Computers for your needs!"
Visit www.directcomputers.com
Unit 7 - 9947 - 151 Street
Surrey, BC Canada V3R 9A1
Phone 604-671-5997
Fax 604-930-9983
Official Supplier of Computers & Hyper Stimulators to:
the Players Racing Simulator Challenge Tour and
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Visit www.players-racing.com
> I have to agree with Pat on this one. A good FF wheel (I use the
> Logitech) is far better than a passive wheel. I'm faster and more
> consistent in GPL with a well set up Logitech FF wheel than with a
> passive wheel, even a passive wheel which is much better in basic
> quality than the Logitech (I've tried many passive wheels, including
> ECCI, TSW, and my own custom wheel).
> I've been racing GPL for almost two years now, and with a passive wheel
> I'd reached a plateau in terms of speed. After going to a FF wheel, I'm
> going faster everywhere, and my ability to develop setups, and detect
> the quality of a setup change, is much improved. I get better race
> results too.
> It took some time (about two weeks) to adjust to the FF wheel, but after
> that, there's no going back. I tried going back to my (carefully
> crafted, very precise, very high quality) custom passive wheel recently,
> and it absolutely sucked compared to the LogiFF.
> BTW, your LWFF to Hyper Stim comparison is not really valid; you're
> comparing apples to oranges. Along with a topnotch passive wheel,
> you're comparing great pedals and an ensemble of components which
> creates a very immersive environment against a FF wheel operating in the
> context of a much less immersive environment.
> Why don't you bolt a Logitech FF wheel to a Hyper Stimulator in place of
> its HS-built wheel? Keep the Hyper Stim's pedals (they are sure to be
> better than the Logitech's) and just configure in GPL to use the Logi
> wheel instead of the HS's. (Details on my FF page at
> http://www.racesimcentral.net/)
> (BTW, this is a minor point, but note that Logitech's software allows
> you to assign a shift function to one of the six paddles and buttons, so
> you can have, in effect, 11 buttons on the LogiFF.)
> Now drive GPL in this setup (and only this setup) every day for an hour,
> for two weeks. Then put the HS wheel back in place of the LogiFF.
> Yes, the LogiFF wheel is a cheapo plastic piece of ***compared to the
> HS wheel. Yes, it uses (yuck!) nylon bearings. Yes, its wheel wobbles
> because the shaft is too short and because of the play in the nylon
> bearings. Yes, its pot probably cost 10% of the cost of the pot in the
> HS.
> But I'm betting that you will want to put it back onto the HS after
> spending two weeks with it, and then comparing the passive wheel
> experience to the Force-enabled experience.
> Better still, I'm hoping that you'll want to develop your own FF wheel
> to put in the HS. If the HS experience is so great - and I'm sure it is
> - then imagine how great it would be when enhanced with a really good FF
> implementation.
> I'm sure that with not a whole lot of effort, you could work up an
> adaptation for the Immersion unit used in the Act Labs Force RS that
> would absolutely rock. The Immersion unit used in the Force RS is much
> better than the one used in the Logitech Wingman FF. It has a much
> larger, more powerful motor, toothed belt reduction (vs. cables in the
> Logi), and ball bearings.
> As far as I can tell, there's only one thing wrong with that Immersion
> unit (excessive friction induced by belts that are too tight). A
> company with your resources could surely develop a fix (adjustable or
> spring-loaded tensioning idlers).
> I bet you could do it in a couple of days. Pick up a Force RS for $70
> and take it apart and you'll see what I mean. You might even use the
> RS's internal and electronic bits for your prototype.
> About a year ago, I wrote to a very high-end wheel manufacturer (let's
> call them "Acme") asking why they didn't provide paddles on their
> wheels. They explained that they were committed to providing the
> absolute best racing experience for their customers, and they said
> paddles aren't as good or as fast as thumb buttons (conveniently
> ignoring the fact that real F1 teams had been using paddle shifters for
> years).
> I wrote back and pointed out that I had put $5 microswitches on the back
> of my TM wheel, and these worked just as fast as the thumb buttons on my
> friend's "Acme" wheel and were ergonomically far superior.
> I don't know if my email had any impact, but a few months later, "Acme"
> began offering paddles on their wheels.
> The m***of that story is that sometimes the people who make the very
> best stuff can be temporarily blinded to the significance of worthwhile
> innovations by the position of technical superiority in which their own
> lofty talents and commitment to excellence have placed them.
> I say it's time for you and Hyper Stimulator to move into the 21st
> century, Rory. <grin>
> Alison
> On Thu, 30 Dec 1999 09:18:01 GMT, "Rory S. Brown"
> >Pat,
> >I appreciate your reply and respectfully disagree, though you make some
> >valid points. I have driven GPL with force feedback with the Logitech
Wheel
> >and it doesn't even come close to the feeling I get from sitting in the
> >Hyper Stimulator with the chassis shaker, 12 programmable button steering
> >wheel, form fitted seat, and firm brake pedal. I hope that some day you
> >will have the opportunity to use your obvious skills to work (checked
your
> >web site) by driving a Hyper Stimulator for a whole week or so. It is
> >unfortunate the pricing of the Hyper Stimulator means that few people
will
> >get the opportunity to own a Hyper Stimulator. There is a reason it is
> >priced like it is: Quality. Just ask any owner of a Hyper Stimulator if
it
> >is worth the price. You can't make a mistake investing in Quality!
> >We will do force feedback when we determine it is at the correct stage of
> >development. Please remember, the Hyper Stimulator is designed to be
> >upgradeable so the investment is never lost. We even had a H Box shifter
> >ready to go for GPL but since Papyrus didn't include this feature in the
> >patch, as they where supposed to do, no point in doing it yet.
> >Again, Thanks for your input.
> Alison
> Remove the spam blocker NOSPAM to email me.
> http://www.racesimcentral.net/