Ryk Penfold's 6 mile 22 turn track Isla la Tortuga was released as a
full race track about two weeks ago. I'm very surprised so few have
added ratings to it at the Track Database compared to many other new
tracks.
It's not that it gets bad ratings - actually it's *very* much the
other way around, it gets fantastic ratings - but why so few???? Very
odd!
http://www.racesimcentral.net/
Cheers!!
/Magnus T
There are simply too many tracks to keep up with. I think I stopped
downloading at about 110...
Eldred
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Homepage - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~epickett
Thanks to those of you who made a donation for *** cancer research. The
walkathon is over, but donations are still being accepted. Details on my
webpage.
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.
Achim
I would like to see Papyrus get back into supporting the mod guys.
Opening up the physics and tracks...wouldn't an N2 k2 Touring car mod be
great?(provided you could alter the car parameters so you had a virtual V8
supercar rather than a repainted winston cup behemoth)
I look at the interest generated in F1 2001, which without the mods
would be all but forgotten by now, since it's multiplay is so weak. But
many of us will be running down and buying F1 2002 even with those DAMNED
chicaned tracks and lousy multi because of what the Mod guys are doing.
I agree N2k2 is better in almost every respect to GPL and that alone
makes it a great title...but man! What good word of mouth Papyrus could
generate if only they'd open up their architechture(sp?)
dave henrie
yes, I also wish Papy's physics could be used in a wider variety of
simulated car types. Oh man, a Porsche 917, a Chaparall, a Ferrari Dino, a
Lola T70, a Shelby Cobra...
Achim
> > My opinion is, GPL is great but N2002 is better. Not that I particularly
> > like Nascars, but the sim is simply a few years younger, newer, more
> modern.
> > Better physics, better sound, better graphics. I'd like to see more
tracks
> > made for N2002, not for GPL.
> > Achim
> I would like to see Papyrus get back into supporting the mod guys.
> Opening up the physics and tracks...wouldn't an N2 k2 Touring car mod be
> great?(provided you could alter the car parameters so you had a virtual V8
> supercar rather than a repainted winston cup behemoth)
> I look at the interest generated in F1 2001, which without the
mods
> would be all but forgotten by now, since it's multiplay is so weak. But
> many of us will be running down and buying F1 2002 even with those DAMNED
> chicaned tracks and lousy multi because of what the Mod guys are doing.
> I agree N2k2 is better in almost every respect to GPL and that
alone
> makes it a great title...but man! What good word of mouth Papyrus could
> generate if only they'd open up their architechture(sp?)
> dave henrie
I recently bought NR2002 having run GPL for years now, and my first thought
was:
"This is great! If only it could use the GPL cars & tracks!".
More tracks = better. I'll race any car type, but I can only turn left so
much before it loses it's appeal, sorry.
Malc.
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Achim
> I recently bought NR2002 having run GPL for years now, and my first
thought
> was:
> "This is great! If only it could use the GPL cars & tracks!".
> More tracks = better. I'll race any car type, but I can only turn left so
> much before it loses it's appeal, sorry.
> Malc.
I'll have a look at that, thanks!
Malc.
For that matter, the longer I play, the more I'm finding even the
damage model to still be incredibly understated. I just ran over 60
laps in the RASCAR pocono race with my hood in my face and still ran
in the mid to low 55's with fresh tires and clean air.
I'm not saying the game isn't better and it's certainly miles above
any non-Papy sim that's ever been produced, I guess I'm just not
seeing a lot of the things people are praising it for, in terms of it
being an upgrade and making GPL or N4 obsolete. Granted, it would be
nice if you rip the tires apart in GPL when you locked the brakes or
insisted on drifting at each and every corner, but other than that I
don't see what it's missing. The sound is still very good, and the
high-resolution textures that have been released for the original
tracks are great, not to mention the nice cars the GPLEA has put
together.
I guess what I'm wondering, to get to the point, is...if GPL were made
today, using the N2002 engine, what would be better about it? Out of
the box it would have better graphics, and we'd have the new tire
sounds which are fantastic, but what would change handling or tire
model wise?
Jason
I didn't try N4 so I can't really compare it with N2002, but the important
thing to remember is that with a real car of any type, the tyres are the
single most important parts. Every component in a racecar is designed to
maximise the grip of the tyres since, barring accidents, all the physical
forces are transferred through them.
For me the difference between the way the N2002 cars feel and the GPL cars
(in terms of grip etc) is like the difference between a good arcade racer
like Motorhead and GPL. It just feels more realistic.
I assume the new tyre model is making a difference, but maybe better sounds,
force feedback & so on affect it too.
I'd just like to try a GPL car on a GPL track using the N2002 physics coz
I'll bet it'd be really, really good to drive.
Malc.
N2002 BTW simulates harder tires than N4, that's where I think the tire
heating time diff comes from (I'm being told Nascar switched to harder tires
and N2002 followed).
As for the physics - from GPL, changes were probably made to many aspects,
like the tire model, and the suspension. I think changes were also made to
the differential. What they changed in detail is Papy's business secret, but
the N4 and N2k2 cars feel even more real to me than the GPL cars.
The damage model doesn't really interest me, as I hardly ever have
accidents.
As for how GPL would feel different if it were using the 2002 technology -
who can know that. I can only guess - maybe the reactions of the car would
be felt in more detail. Traction transitions around the limit could be more
detailed. The suspension could be softer and you'd need higher ride heights.
Maybe the effects of a/r bars would be more detailed. I assume the cars
would roll and pitch more, which would increase the effects of weight
transfers to each of the wheels and axles. Maybe these effects would be more
detailed. Throttle and brakes could have more of an effect on the steering.
The FF could be more detailed as well. Who knows :-)
Achim
...
The problem applying that change to GPL, tho, is that GPL would use a
different tire model regardless, because those cars didn't use slicks.
I'm assuming Papyrus changed something else in the physics model in
N2002, otherwise I don't think GPL would be any different from that
point of view. Better graphics/sound/multiplayer would be in there,
no question, I'm just trying to figure out how advancements in Papy
sims would make the driving experience in GPL better. From what I can
tell, in my limited experience, the heat/grip ratio in GPL seems fine.
A wear model would be nice, but I don't know if any data exists to
model that accurately, since teams generally just used the same tires
for multiple races. Whether this is because the tires didn't
noticeably wear or because the teams didn't know any better, I
honestly don't know.
Hm. No offense meant, but I just can't buy that. You can't compare
the grip between GPL and N2002 because of the differences in weight
distribution, tires and aero. Modern stock cars have tons of grip
compared to a 67 F1 car. They're front-engined, which means the line
between being on the edge and losing it is wider (just as it was in
the days of front-engined F1 cars). I think GPL does a fantastic job
of translating the lack of grip and the weight distribution into a
driving experience that kicks you square in the pants. It's
significantly different than N2k2, but it should be - there are more
differences between a 67 F1 car and a 2002 stock car than there are
similarities.
No question. I'm not hung up on graphics/sound (altho I think GPL's
sound is fantastic, and the graphics can be brought up to par easily
by replacing a few textures and grabbing the GPLEA car models) and I
haven't found a force feedback wheel that made the experience more
real to me, so I'm not factoring those things in as much as most
people probably do. At the end of the day, for me, it comes down to
how close I am to sitting in a real car and turning laps on a track.
Good racing is nice too, but I end up spending more time driving solo
than I do with other people or AI.
I don't know if that's possible. I have a feeling that the changes
that were made to N2k2 were specifically applied to the modelling of a
stock car, as opposed to being general upgrades to the engine itself.
I do sort of remember Dave Kaemmer or someone saying that the camber
modelling was changed somehow, which would make a difference in GPL,
but for the life of me I can't find that interview and I might just be
making it up. =)
Jason
You're right of course, The old Crossplyed tyres would have a more
progressive transition from grip to slide than modern (radial I assume with
NASCAR) Slicks.
Simulating a later season might be achievable though.
I think the main problem in GPL that was overcome for me in N2002 was the
feeling of grip before a slide. GPL feels like you're driving on ice
sometimes, and it can make it hard to judge entry points etc on a fresh
circuit.
But it might be possible to simulate a lightweight, chuckable front-engined
car like a Caterham (Lotus) 7.
Malc.
