rec.autos.simulators

ON-LINE complaints with VROC/SPYBOY/GPL

Ron Ayto

ON-LINE complaints with VROC/SPYBOY/GPL

by Ron Ayto » Sun, 18 Apr 1999 04:00:00

Firstly, i apologise to those of you who are already aware of the
topics in this post, but there are a lot of new on-line drivers out
there who might find something of interest here.

There has been a lot of blame placed on GPL SpyBoy for poor connection
problems, loss of connection, high pings etc. etc.
These problems are NOT generated by SpyBoy or by VROC for that matter,
but are simply becoming more wide spread now that SpyBoy has made
on-line racing through VROC a much more common  pastime.  
The number of new on-line racers has trebled in the last couple of
weeks with the introduction of SpyBoy and this has caused a few
overloading problems to VROC and the on-line *** community as a
whole.  Not through faulty software as some of you would like to
believe, but simply through added popularity
I am always seeing someone blame SpyBoy for their poor on-line ***
connection and to be totally frank, you don't know what you are talking
about.  
Sure, connections have not been as good lately as they have been in the
past, but that is due mainly to Internet problems.  
The release of IE5 put a large load on the internet, with people world
wide downloading it, and recently with all the hullaboo about the new
Star Wars, (no pun intended to you Ymenard)  :) ,  the Internet has
simply been run raggard, then to top it all off, Larry Holbert goes and
releases a brilliant little program called SpyBoy which has added to
the already overtaxed Internet and lo and behold we wonder why we
slowed down a bit.   sheesh !!!
Both VROC and SpyBoy are simply victims of excessive use.  
There are a lot of new names appearing on VROC and also on RAS that
have not been here before and a lot of the problems that are being
generated now are simply USER based, and are NOT in any way
VROC/SPYBOY/GPL related, unless you class popularity as a major bug
bear..
There are numerous FAQ's available for the new on-line sim racer to
peruse over, but i will go through a few of the simple things to try on
your own computer, before you decide to blame the software that brings
on-line racing to us all.
Alison, Nate and John brought us VROC to start with and we owe them a
huge favour for the time and effort they have put into it. Recently
Larry Holbert has given us SpyBoy, which simply speaking, is a user
friendly front end to access the VROC data base, with added chat
support, amongst other things.  All these people have given their time
and effort for FREE, just so we can enjoy the on-line racing
experiences we now do, and what's more all this software is FREE.!!
So let's try to sort out our own systems first for OPTIMAL on-line
play.
Most of us are not blessed with Cable etc. so we have to make the most
of dial-up modem connections, so this is a brief idea on how to improve
yours...  and i mean brief.    This is simply to give you some idea of
where to begin and what to play with to try to improve your on-line
*** connections.

Firstly, the DUN you use for the Internet is NOT suitable for on-line
***.  It most likely would be using Data Compression, Error
Correction, Maximum FIFO Buffers and probably going as hard as your
poor little modem can peddle, or harder if i believe half of the tales
i hear about....
All of the above is VERY bad news for on-line ***.

You should make up another DUN for on-line ***, with Data
Compression and Error Correction turned OFF.  Also if you don't intend
hosting, and let's face it, it is hardly worth it with a dial-up
connection anyway, turn down the maximum connect speed of your modem to
24000, 26400 or 28800 at a maximum. The quality of the lines in your
area, will dictate the best speed for you.  
This can be done in the Modem Properties tab of your DUN for the
designated Modem. Read the booklet that comes with your modem  for the
initialization strings you need.
To make more than one DUN with different modem initialization strings,
you will need to go to the MODEMS in the control panel and ADD another
modem.  This will not overwrite your present modem settings, but will
add another modem to the modems you have listed in the modem list.  As
you add more modems to the list, Windows will simply add a #2  #3  #4
etc etc to the end of the modem name.  That way you can set up as many
DUN's as you have modem names, each one with different initialization
strings.
Once you have your on-line DUNS set up, you will actually find
disconnections and high latency's will be greatly reduced.

Note: the FIFO buffers should be set no higher than the 2nd mark from
the left, unfortunately these are global settings, so if you set them
at the 2nd setting from the left, that is where they will remain
regardless of which DUN you are using.  I have not noticed any lesser
performance in surfing or downloading with the buffers set there
anyway, so i just leave them there all the time.

Make sure you turn off Error Correction, also turn off the Data
Compression and select Hardware Flow Control in you modem's properties
tab for the On-Line *** DUN.  If you are a paranoid type, as i am,
you could also add those commands to the extra settings in the modem
initialization string, just in case you don't trust windows to carry
out your wishes and let's face it, who trusts windows to do anything
right when it comes to *** anyway..
I have included the following line for my US Robotics 33.6k in my
On-Line *** DUN..
&F1&K0&M0&U10&N13
&F1  Resets modem to standard, in case windows messed it up.
&K0  Disables  Data Compression, in case windows forgot.
&M0  Disables Error Correction, as per above scenario..
&U10  Sets the floor connect speed to 19200.
&N13  Sets the ceiling connect speed to 26400.

The above is an example for the US Robotics modem, different modems
will vary slightly in the initialization strings, so read your manual
for further details to achieve similiar results.

Secondly..   WIndows in it's infinite wisdom sets up the Port settings
on the extra conservative side by default.  
This needs to be changed manually.
To do this:
Go to the Control Panel, go to System, go to  Device Manager, go to
Ports (com & lpt).
Select Com1 ,  go to Port Settings, and adjust the following to read as
follows:
Bits per second   115200
Data   8
Parity   none
Stop Bits   1
Flow Control   Hardware
Go to Advanced   and adjust the FIFO Buffers so they are 1 mark from
the left side.
Do the same for Com Port 2.
Get out and save it all...   and go and have a beer, or a diet coke.

Finally, why do people insist on having to run at 1024x768 with all the
eye candy on for on-line racing.  Frame rates DO matter as far as
warping and good on-line play go.
If you are not seeing 36fps in on-line play, then your CPU is being
taxed. Give your CPU a rest and turn down the resolution a bit, turn
off some eye candy untill you are seeing 36 fps or as close to it as
you can.  You might be surprised at the difference it makes.
Amother thing to keep in mind as well is to not have back ground
programs running when you intend to play on-line.
Just to finish this novel off, Windows 98 is superior to Windows 95
when it comes to Networking, Serial Control, Internet functionability
DUN protocols and on-line ***, so if all else fails, consider that
much dreaded upgrade.  It may just make that final difference to having
a good connection or a so so connection..
If all of the above fails, i don't want to know about it. :)
I'm going to bed, goodnight. <G>
Cheers,
Ron  

SteveBla

ON-LINE complaints with VROC/SPYBOY/GPL

by SteveBla » Sun, 18 Apr 1999 04:00:00

A hearty second to all Ron's comments!  I would add only the following.
Definitely read and act on the advice and directions for new racers on VROC,
primarily with respect to the core.ini file and making graphic adjustments to
ensure you're getting 36FPS.  Also, check your latency when you first join a
race.  If it's over .400, you should probably look for another race, as the
warping will just make you a hazard to everyone else in the race.  At the
least, inform the host and compare it to the others'.  If everyone agrees to
sub-par conditions, fine.  But don't impose them unilaterally.  Online's far
from perfect, but if we all play by the "rules", it's quite liveable.

Happy racing,

Steve B.

remove "edy" from address for email

Hans

ON-LINE complaints with VROC/SPYBOY/GPL

by Hans » Sun, 18 Apr 1999 04:00:00

  Yes I have to say that you guys w/ bad connections are making it horrible
for those of us who pay for decent connections.. I think some of us have to
realize it is impossible to pass a car or be passed by a car which is
warping left to right by almost double the width the car. Doesnt make racing
online very fun..
  Just another point, at the start of a race expect that those infront of
you are going to brake early so that they dont rearend those infront.. If
someone else is willing to loose a position why wouldnt you? Finishing a
race is definetly more important that winning, especially if your a rookie.
You can always make it up if your fast enough.. Respect your fellow drivers.

Charles Buscher
Guru_Hans
Team Guru NROS Racing sponsored by Guru *** Systems.
http://www.racesimcentral.net/***.com
http://www.racesimcentral.net/
http://www.racesimcentral.net/
http://www.racesimcentral.net/

Markus Stiepe

ON-LINE complaints with VROC/SPYBOY/GPL

by Markus Stiepe » Mon, 19 Apr 1999 04:00:00

Hi Ron!
I thought my recent post was long  :-))
Maybe we should take turns reposting this stuff on a weekly basis,
brain-washing works like that, I think!  :-)

with a dial-up >connection anyway
Only point I'm not sure you're right: I have a ISDN-internal using DUN and
no problems with ppl getting disco'd, as long as they obbey the technical
rules you are decribing and I don't invite more than 5 players to join.

Keep it up!
Markus

Mike Buckle

ON-LINE complaints with VROC/SPYBOY/GPL

by Mike Buckle » Wed, 21 Apr 1999 04:00:00

Ron

Thanks for the informative post on Spyboy. However I'm still not
convinced as to Spyboys stability. I've only been online racing GPL
since about February but I have had VERY few disconnects in that time -
maybe one in every 6 hours racing (lucky me!), but when I downloaded
SPyboy I now get disconnected about 3 times a night. I've tried and
tried with Spyboy because its a wonderful program and I love it but it
just isn't stable enough for me to use. I would like to believe that it
is caused by general loading on the internet but if this is the case
then why do i not get the same level of disconnects with netscape/VROC??
Spyboy is also causing other problems -*** GPL when it tries to
start it etc. I'm sure this is down to some weird incompatibility with
some driver or application i have installed on my PC, but i have a VERY
clean install of Win95.

I think i'll shortly be going to Win98/Directx6 so maybe this will help.

Thanks for producing the great program anyway, i'm still using it for
the chat - i'm just closing it down and using netscape when i want to
join a race - hey it works for me!

but what do i know? I "don't know what i'm talking about" ;)
--
Mike Buckley    
Cotswold Pig Development Co Ltd
Tel: +44 (0)1472 371591  Fax: +44 (0)1472 371208

Mickey Kerk

ON-LINE complaints with VROC/SPYBOY/GPL

by Mickey Kerk » Wed, 21 Apr 1999 04:00:00

On Tue, 20 Apr 1999 15:47:50 +0100, Mike Buckley


>Thanks for the informative post on Spyboy. However I'm still not
>convinced as to Spyboys stability. I've only been online racing GPL
>since about February but I have had VERY few disconnects in that time -
>maybe one in every 6 hours racing (lucky me!), but when I downloaded
>SPyboy I now get disconnected about 3 times a night.

Well GSB isn't even loaded while your logged on to VROC but if you
still want to blame GSB for your disconnects from VROC have at it.

                                Mick

Ron Ayto

ON-LINE complaints with VROC/SPYBOY/GPL

by Ron Ayto » Wed, 21 Apr 1999 04:00:00

Hi Mike, i'm not saying your not having problems on your specific
computer, but i do know that SpyBoy is not causing your disconnection
problems through on-line *** and VROC.
By all means, believe what you would like to believe, but as Mickey
basically said, SpyBoy does nothing on your computer when you attempt
to join a race, or are even in a race..
It is simply a front end program to launch GPL, nothing more, nothing
less.
Do you know what a dos batch file is ?  
The easiest way to think of what SpyBoy does for you is to think of it
as a batch file, which when run, starts GPL and when GPL finishes it
resumes it's intended program loop.
This does not effect connections and promote disconnections in any way
possible.
If you take the time to stop and think about it a bit, you will realise
Netscape puts a lot more load on your computer than a batch file, which
is basically what SpyBoy is.
Regards Win98, i think you will find that it will be a more stable
platform for your on-line *** needs, as long as you take a few
minutes to fine tune your DUN connections and serial/modem
configurations like i suggested in my previous post.
My connections have been degraded a bit as well since a lot more people
have had access to VROC, but i know what is causing my problems, and
that is probably the very same thing that is causing yours.
These problems are caused by three major things.

1: Popularity, which had created a lot more sim drivers trying to get
on-line, resulting in occasional band flooding.

2: Lack of understanding regarding what is needed/necessary for on-line
*** regarding DUNS, serial setups etc.  This has created a new set
of on-line gamers whose previous experience with on-line *** may
have been an occasional modem hook-up with a friend.  They are the
cause of most of our problems regarding disconnections, and untill we
can educate them on the basics of on-line tuning, our problems will
continue whenever one of these individuals try joining a race through
VROC.

3: Too many people are trying to join races at one time.  This of
course depends on the host's link to the net and his/her available
bandwidth specifications. This problem will be alleviated with the
release of GPL 1.1 as it has the ability for the host to limit the
number of clients to join his/her race.

Some people i have spoken to in chat, do not even know what a core.ini
file is, not to mention where it should go and then turn around and
complain about clock smashes, disconnections and how bad GPL on-line
is.  The simple truth of the matter regarding successful on-line ***
is education.

I hope you have success with Win98, as there is nothing wrong with the
batch file you are using to join GPL on-line...   :)
Cheers,
Ron



> Thanks for the informative post on Spyboy. However I'm still not
> convinced as to Spyboys stability. I've only been online racing GPL
> since about February but I have had VERY few disconnects in that time
-
> maybe one in every 6 hours racing (lucky me!), but when I downloaded
> SPyboy I now get disconnected about 3 times a night. I've tried and
> tried with Spyboy because its a wonderful program and I love it but
it
> just isn't stable enough for me to use. I would like to believe that
it
> is caused by general loading on the internet but if this is the case
> then why do i not get the same level of disconnects with
netscape/VROC??
> Spyboy is also causing other problems -*** GPL when it tries to
> start it etc. I'm sure this is down to some weird incompatibility
with
> some driver or application i have installed on my PC, but i have a
VERY
> clean install of Win95.

> I think i'll shortly be going to Win98/Directx6 so maybe this will
help.

> Thanks for producing the great program anyway, i'm still using it for
> the chat - i'm just closing it down and using netscape when i want to
> join a race - hey it works for me!

> but what do i know? I "don't know what i'm talking about" ;)
> --
> Mike Buckley    
> Cotswold Pig Development Co Ltd
> Tel: +44 (0)1472 371591  Fax: +44 (0)1472 371208


Mike Buckle

ON-LINE complaints with VROC/SPYBOY/GPL

by Mike Buckle » Thu, 22 Apr 1999 04:00:00

fx:bangs head against brick wall

I accept that SpyBoy is not loaded in memory when it launches GPL, but I
still don't accept that its not causing some problems with my setup.
When I run SpyBoy my PC is much more prone to crashes/hangups then when
I don't run it.

Put simply:

Run with SpyBoy - more crashes, frequent disco's

Run with VROC/Netscape - no crashes, odd disco's

ok ok it may not be SpyBoy causing the problem but I'm getting such a
consistent pattern I don't know what else it can be. Maybe SpyBoy is
causing some instability in my system that only becomes apparent when
I'm running GPL after SpyBoy has unloaded itself? I'm guessing here!
I am familiar with DOS batch files (unfortunately) and I was aware
(having read various bits on the website) how SpyBoy operates, pity it
just doesn't work for me.
As my ISP is fond of saying 'it must be your setup' ;)
And as no one else has chipped in here saying they're having similar
problems to me I guess it MUST be my setup!! (Yes, I've tuned
DUN/core.ini etc)

Thanks for the posts anyway and I hope my move to Win 98 will cure it

--
Mike Buckley    
Cotswold Pig Development Co Ltd
Tel: +44 (0)1472 371591  Fax: +44 (0)1472 371208

http://www.toastyhamster.freeserve.co.uk

c0ldfusi0

ON-LINE complaints with VROC/SPYBOY/GPL

by c0ldfusi0 » Thu, 22 Apr 1999 04:00:00


>Thanks for the informative post on Spyboy. However I'm still not
>convinced as to Spyboys stability. I've only been online racing GPL
>since about February but I have had VERY few disconnects in that time -
>maybe one in every 6 hours racing (lucky me!), but when I downloaded
>SPyboy I now get disconnected about 3 times a night

Just to add my $.02, I have been having disco problems since last December.
I haven't completed many online races since then because of a 90% disconnect
rate.  Since running GSB, I haven't discoed AT ALL.   While it may seem to
be causing problems for you, I tend to doubt your claims of the program's
instability.  If it weren't for GSB, I wouldn't be finishing any races at
all.

I actually run GSB even when I am not connecting to a VROC server for the
added stability.  It may sound strange but GSB has totally cured my disco
problem!

J.

Mike Buckle

ON-LINE complaints with VROC/SPYBOY/GPL

by Mike Buckle » Thu, 22 Apr 1999 04:00:00

hahaha might have known!! good on ya!
--
Mike Buckley    
Cotswold Pig Development Co Ltd
Tel: +44 (0)1472 371591  Fax: +44 (0)1472 371208

http://www.toastyhamster.freeserve.co.uk


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