rec.autos.simulators

by **Eldre** » Mon, 29 Apr 2002 22:24:27

>Some leagues have a minimum speed. If you cannot achieve the minimum speed
>in practice, you should not qual and race. The minimum can be posted prior
>to the event. The F2 screen will show during practice who has learned the
>track and can run the minimum speed. Minimum can be whatever you decide.
>Would 37.xxx seconds have been a good minimum for Homestead at 70 degrees?

>On the other hand, to keep the "fun level" up, maybe everyone should be
>allowed to race everywhere regardless of proficiency.

That's the problem. If someone can't keep the car on the track, it ruins the
races for OTHERS. I'm still trying to understand the crashes under the yellow
flags. Barring a hardware error with your computer, that's ***ing STUPID...
How the hell do you crash on a PACE lap?!?

Eldred
--
Homepage - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~epickett
A friend of mine is involved in a fund-raiser walk-a-thon for research to cure
*** cancer. If you can, please go to my homepage and see how to make a
donation. Thank you.

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by **Eldre** » Mon, 29 Apr 2002 23:10:27

>But I do agree with you on not stopping this, of course it's Eldred's server
>and he can do what he wants - I think it is wonderful Eldred is taking the
>time and effort to put these on - many thanks!!
>But no doubt, if the field size stays the same as Saturday or even grows
>larger, many cautions will just be something we will have to deal with.
>Let's just make the best of it and have as much fun as we can. I am
>convinced from what I have seen that with field sizes at 25 and above it is
>just very difficult to have a good race without multiple cautions. That many
>cars with this physics model and a sensitive collision detection along with
>warping , it's just going to happen..

One idea that I just had while reading your message is this: On the races
likely to draw large fields, I may have to make it 'invitation only'. People
would be 'evaluated' by their performance in the open races. We'll see... I
haven't watched the replay from Talladega yet, but there may be some people who
get BANNED from my server...

Eldred
--
Homepage - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~epickett
A friend of mine is involved in a fund-raiser walk-a-thon for research to cure
*** cancer. If you can, please go to my homepage and see how to make a
donation. Thank you.

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by **John Pancoas** » Mon, 29 Apr 2002 23:13:22

Also fwiw, your position in these cases is via the pit wall, not the start
line.

-John

> > > Actually, you passed everyone<G> Even when going to the pits, you
can't
> > > pass those that stay on the track, and vice versa. You needed to stay
> > > "behind"(via F2 screen since he couldn't be seen) Tony in this case.

> > I considered that was the case, but it's such a stupid way to pit I
didn't
> > think it could be true. :-)

> If I could only type and drive, David, I would have warned you!

> I could see you go past me as you went down the pit lane and got way ahead
of me
> and the car in front. My F2 screen still showed you ahead at the s/f line.

> Perhaps I will map a suitable comment to a wheel button. I certainly
didn't need
> to tell lapped traffic I would be passing low in that race :-)

> I got damaged early on and got the dreaded "we've got problems with that
motor"
> message. Down on power after that and decided to call it a day after
getting
> swamped at the restarts.

> Still, progress is being made - I could see the pace car at the start of
this
> race having qualified further up than previous RASCAR races!

> Cheers

> Tony

by **John Pancoas** » Mon, 29 Apr 2002 23:36:42

That's the only way to keep things at a desired level Eldred; make an
invitation/muzzle list, etc.

-John

Burnette"

> >But I do agree with you on not stopping this, of course it's Eldred's
server
> >and he can do what he wants - I think it is wonderful Eldred is taking
the
> >time and effort to put these on - many thanks!!
> >But no doubt, if the field size stays the same as Saturday or even grows
> >larger, many cautions will just be something we will have to deal with.
> >Let's just make the best of it and have as much fun as we can. I am
> >convinced from what I have seen that with field sizes at 25 and above it
is
> >just very difficult to have a good race without multiple cautions. That
many
> >cars with this physics model and a sensitive collision detection along
with
> >warping , it's just going to happen..

> One idea that I just had while reading your message is this: On the races
> likely to draw large fields, I may have to make it 'invitation only'.
People
> would be 'evaluated' by their performance in the open races. We'll see...
I
> haven't watched the replay from Talladega yet, but there may be some
people who
> get BANNED from my server...

> Eldred
> --
> Homepage - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~epickett
> A friend of mine is involved in a fund-raiser walk-a-thon for research to
cure
> *** cancer. If you can, please go to my homepage and see how to make a
> donation. Thank you.

> Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

by **Joachim Trens** » Tue, 30 Apr 2002 02:44:38

Hi Eldred.

Only the best can do it <g>

Achim

by **Harja** » Tue, 30 Apr 2002 00:10:28

Oops, I hope I will not be muzzled, because I had an eventful race.
- I delayed the start by not knowing the right starting procedure and
speeding up before the green came out.
- Touched a lapped car because I had commited before to the outside when he
decided to make room low and so I had to go back low. In my replay we didn't
touch, but it sure caused him to spin and it brought the yellows out.
- Made the most stupid move in my history of online sim racing by loosing my
sense of track position and ending up down low on the apron coming back on
the track and crashing into #328 in the last lap.

If I would read this, I would think: muzzle. But if you would have seen me
after the race, I was really pissed off at myself and embarassed.

I always tend to be quite agressive on track, but I rarely go over the top.
In real life racing I was compared once to Jacques, well yesterday I pulled
off a first corner Canada move.

So sorry to the guys that were hindered by my bad driving, but do know I
always try to learn from my mistakes. And I've learnt quite some lessons
yesterday. Even with all the yellows, I loved the racing.

Burnette"

> >But I do agree with you on not stopping this, of course it's Eldred's
server
> >and he can do what he wants - I think it is wonderful Eldred is taking
the
> >time and effort to put these on - many thanks!!
> >But no doubt, if the field size stays the same as Saturday or even grows
> >larger, many cautions will just be something we will have to deal with.
> >Let's just make the best of it and have as much fun as we can. I am
> >convinced from what I have seen that with field sizes at 25 and above it
is
> >just very difficult to have a good race without multiple cautions. That
many
> >cars with this physics model and a sensitive collision detection along
with
> >warping , it's just going to happen..

> One idea that I just had while reading your message is this: On the races
> likely to draw large fields, I may have to make it 'invitation only'.
People
> would be 'evaluated' by their performance in the open races. We'll see...
I
> haven't watched the replay from Talladega yet, but there may be some
people who
> get BANNED from my server...

> Eldred
> --
> Homepage - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~epickett
> A friend of mine is involved in a fund-raiser walk-a-thon for research to
cure
> *** cancer. If you can, please go to my homepage and see how to make a
> donation. Thank you.

> Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

by **Don Burnett** » Tue, 30 Apr 2002 00:26:14

I thought you were pretty clean when you settled in, yes you wanted that
lead bad, but I think you learned and from what I saw I would race with ya
anytime..

Don Burnette

> Oops, I hope I will not be muzzled, because I had an eventful race.
> - I delayed the start by not knowing the right starting procedure and
> speeding up before the green came out.
> - Touched a lapped car because I had commited before to the outside when
he
> decided to make room low and so I had to go back low. In my replay we
didn't
> touch, but it sure caused him to spin and it brought the yellows out.
> - Made the most stupid move in my history of online sim racing by loosing
my
> sense of track position and ending up down low on the apron coming back on
> the track and crashing into #328 in the last lap.

> If I would read this, I would think: muzzle. But if you would have seen me
> after the race, I was really pissed off at myself and embarassed.

> I always tend to be quite agressive on track, but I rarely go over the
top.
> In real life racing I was compared once to Jacques, well yesterday I
pulled
> off a first corner Canada move.

> So sorry to the guys that were hindered by my bad driving, but do know I
> always try to learn from my mistakes. And I've learnt quite some lessons
> yesterday. Even with all the yellows, I loved the racing.

> Burnette"

> > >But I do agree with you on not stopping this, of course it's Eldred's
> server
> > >and he can do what he wants - I think it is wonderful Eldred is taking
> the
> > >time and effort to put these on - many thanks!!
> > >But no doubt, if the field size stays the same as Saturday or even
grows
> > >larger, many cautions will just be something we will have to deal with.
> > >Let's just make the best of it and have as much fun as we can. I am
> > >convinced from what I have seen that with field sizes at 25 and above
it
> is
> > >just very difficult to have a good race without multiple cautions. That
> many
> > >cars with this physics model and a sensitive collision detection along
> with
> > >warping , it's just going to happen..

> > One idea that I just had while reading your message is this: On the
races
> > likely to draw large fields, I may have to make it 'invitation only'.
> People
> > would be 'evaluated' by their performance in the open races. We'll
see...
> I
> > haven't watched the replay from Talladega yet, but there may be some
> people who
> > get BANNED from my server...

> > Eldred
> > --
> > Homepage - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~epickett
> > A friend of mine is involved in a fund-raiser walk-a-thon for research
to
> cure
> > *** cancer. If you can, please go to my homepage and see how to make
a
> > donation. Thank you.

> > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

by **MadDAW** » Tue, 30 Apr 2002 00:54:49

One was thing that I noticed and I'm not sure if it the new patch or
something else. My system was only drawing about 7 cars ahead even though my
cars ahead is set to 36 and my draw distance is in the 90-95% range.
Needless to say this made things kinda hairy at times. There is still no
reason to wreck before the green. To be honest I have never seen the start
of a race waved off before. As far as the car count goes I bet it goes back
down after this weekend. I think Tally just brings everyone out to the
track.

MadDAWG

by **Goy Larse** » Tue, 30 Apr 2002 00:56:31

> >I'm still trying to understand the crashes under the yellow
> > flags. Barring a hardware error with your computer, that's ***ing
> STUPID...
> > How the hell do you crash on a PACE lap?!?

> > Eldred

> One was thing that I noticed and I'm not sure if it the new patch or
> something else. My system was only drawing about 7 cars ahead even though my
> cars ahead is set to 36 and my draw distance is in the 90-95% range.
> Needless to say this made things kinda hairy at times. There is still no
> reason to wreck before the green. To be honest I have never seen the start
> of a race waved off before. As far as the car count goes I bet it goes back
> down after this weekend. I think Tally just brings everyone out to the
> track.

ROFL

Well it sure did with me, I don't mind racing on ovals, I just hate
practicing on them, Daytona and Dega, and maybe a couple of the other
big tracks I can fake using skills (term used very losely) from days on
TEN and general knowledge of sim racing, probably the reason why I got
caught out the way I did too, simply been "out of it" too long

I'd never show up for Martinsville or anything like that without a "few"
practice laps first though, that would be inconsiderate, and I would
also have left last night had I felt out of my depth, as it was, I was
right at home :-)

Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy

"The Pits" http://www.racesimcentral.net/

"A man is only as old as the woman he feels"
--Groucho Marx--

by **John Simmon** » Tue, 30 Apr 2002 01:23:14

Because people are too busy holding a ***in tea-party and chatting it
up instead of concentrating on what they're doing.

That's why I kept telling people to stop talking. Sure, everyone can say
"just ignore the text flying across the top of the screen, but it's
DISTRACTING to see it.

Another problem is the guy at the head of the line somehow not knowing
what the word "PACE" means. It means proceed forward at a steady speed
with little or no diviation in that speed.

Now, if you put the "steady speed" together with "no chat", it stands to
reason there won't be any problems under yellow flag conditions.

Here's a little tidbit for anyone that didn't know - YOU DO NOT HAVE TO
BE RIGHT ON THE PACE CAR'S ASS. You could be half a lap behind and it
DOESN'T MATTER. As long as you're proceeding at a steady PACE (there's
that word again), nobody should be having a problem.

If you need practice pacing the field, set the AI to 80% using no
damage, and run offline. Practice yellows in the middle of the pack and
at the front.

It's not ***in rocket science guys.

--
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http://www.racesimcentral.net/
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http://www.racesimcentral.net/
Redneck Techno-Biker & "programming deity"
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If you want to send me email, go to the first URL shown
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by **Joachim Trens** » Tue, 30 Apr 2002 04:30:49

I've disabled in-car chat entirely. I am aware I might be missing something
this way, but so far it has never happened.

Achim

by **Goy Larse** » Tue, 30 Apr 2002 01:34:19

> I've disabled in-car chat entirely. I am aware I might be missing something
> this way, but so far it has never happened.

You are missing the "pit in" and "pit out" messages for starters, to me
those are pretty important, and had I managed to send one properly last
night, I was looking for the proper hot key :-), BFarmer would have
gotten a warning that all wasn't well on my end

You also missed my "damaged, off pace, pass high" messages on the last
couple of restarts, which when we're going single file could have cost
you, of course you weren't behind me :-), but still....

Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy

"The Pits" http://www.theuspits.com/

"A man is only as old as the woman he feels"
--Groucho Marx--

by **Tim** » Tue, 30 Apr 2002 01:41:24

>Here's a little tidbit for anyone that didn't know - YOU DO NOT HAVE TO
>BE RIGHT ON THE PACE CAR'S ASS. You could be half a lap behind and it
>DOESN'T MATTER. As long as you're proceeding at a steady PACE (there's
>that word again), nobody should be having a problem.

With just one exception. At shorter tracks, it's important for the
leader to stay close to the pace car and everyone behind to not allow
a huge gap to open up. Otherwise, guys at the back of the pack lose a
lap even trying to do a normal 4 tire stop.

But agreed, it's the deviation in speed that causes the problems. That
has a bad ripple effect that intensifies as it goes through the field.

One other suggestion....everyone should have an autochat message that
says "Pass Car ## - Serving EOLL Penalty". Saves typing...saves
confusion.

Tim Wortman
North American Simulation Series
www.nasscar.com

by **John Pancoas** » Tue, 30 Apr 2002 01:50:13

Should definately have this on at all time, IMO.

-John

by **Jan Verschuere** » Tue, 30 Apr 2002 01:48:40

I have to disagree, Eldred. Trouble doesn't come from those who've practised
little and _accept_ they are not on the pace. Trouble comes from those who
attempt to hang on to or pass those who _are_ better prepared.

Personally, I practised Tally for half an hour and Homestead for 15 minutes
before Saturday. I am a very experienced online simmer though, so apart from
getting caught out by the pacing line stopping in the tri-oval on a restart
at Talladega I wasn't instrumental in any trouble over the course of the two
races (and only then because me and Colin sort of got "wedged" together and
couldn't free ourselves for a while). It just isn't that hard to keep from
causing trouble.

Ergo: what we face in the bigger/more popular races is a discipline problem,
IMO. That's not going to be improved by leaving bigger gaps between the
races.

That said, once every forthnight might be better from a planning /
attendance point of view as well, so it's ok with me. I'm just trying to
establish a bit of a name for myself in the stock car world, so I'll take
whatever I can get at the moment.

Jan.
=---

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