rec.autos.simulators

by **Michael Barlo** » Wed, 12 Jan 2000 04:00:00

> | I am running a P3-500 with 64 megs of RAM and a 1 meg trident video card.
> I
> | get about 13fps

> Yikes no wonder why you're having trouble!

> | (I will get a voodoo 3 next week).

> This will help a LOT!

> | Everytime i brake down the
> | backstretch, car would spin out

> Another point to remember when braking in addition to being smooth is to not
> change down the gears too quickly as this will try to spin you.

This is called "compression braking". The rear wheels are slowing
their spin by allowing the engine compression to drive (anti drive?;-)
them. It's just as bad as setting the brake bias to 100% on the rear
wheels.

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by **Michael Barlo** » Wed, 12 Jan 2000 04:00:00

> I am running a P3-500 with 64 megs of RAM and a 1 meg trident video card. I
> get about 13fps (I will get a voodoo 3 next week). So far I am able to get
> the car up the esses without problem, but the major problem is still with
> the way the car handles under braking. Everytime i brake down the
> backstretch, car would spin out. and the other problem i have is coming out
> of the last corner onto the front straight away. I can get it off the corner
> straight, but as power start coming in in 2nd and 3rd, car would get kicked
> sideways. Most of the time I approch the first turn with the car sideway.
> THat is not the best way to get decent lap times. I am using a NASCAR Pro,
> it is okay, but I found the wheel seems to be a little off center, or it
> might be the track, who knows. but the front stretch is certainly a #$%^& to
> drive on without jumping all over the road

1. Adjust your brake bias
2. Adjust your braking technique
3. Adjust your gearing.
4. Lift off the gas between shifts
5. Apply power smoothly
6. The track does have a bit of a crown on the strait. (less camber on
half the track)
7. Till you get 30+ fps, your steering/brake/gas inputs will be
delayed. Or, You are not able to time them correctly. So, when you do
get your V3, you will be able to handle the car easyer and your lap
times will improve dramaticaly.

--
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by **Bj?rn Nyhlé** » Wed, 12 Jan 2000 04:00:00

Don't despair until you get that gfx card. As of now you can blame your
computer but soon you can't blame anyone but yourself :o). The TM NASCAR Pro
should be ok, I've got a TM Formula 1 (It the same as a nascar pro but has
different stickers)

Nope, if you dont touch anything hard your suspension should be ok.
Just below the rev limiter, wich seems to be at 10800 in the eagle.

These are higly tuned racing engines wich deliver the power at high revs.

The WR is 1:03:xx but most can do 1:07's

Try to let off the throttle when you shift. If you shift like that you will
start blowing engines once you turn on damage.

-Bj?rn

by **Don Scurlo** » Wed, 12 Jan 2000 04:00:00

When in training mode you have the option of no damage whatsoever. When racing
you must accept some level of damage, and depending on the degree of damage set
the cars suspension may or may not get damaged from any number of things: going
offroad, jumping over brows, the mechanic had a hangover (Lotus)

In training with no damage rev it till it won't go any higher and that's where
red line is. When racing with damage turned on that will eventually blow your
motor, so it's a bad habit to get into. You can download some neat custom
***pits that have redlines on the tachs that make shifting much easier.

The obvious first target is the included replay: 1.06:91
For the world records go here: http://www.racesimcentral.net/~schubi/fastlaps.htm

Slow down before you downshift. Use the brakes to slow, not the motor.
You never want to force the motor to rev anywhere near redline from
downshifting. Your are in effect applying rear wheel brakes when you bang
high rpm downshifts and will cause the car to spin by locking up your rear
tires.

--
Don Scurlock
Vancouver,B.C.

by **Greg Campbel** » Wed, 12 Jan 2000 04:00:00

> Doesn't more front brake bias lock up the brakes easier and make your rear
> end lighter? In turn that spins you out?

A sliding tire actualy produces _less_ braking force than one on the verge of
lockup. If your fronts are skidding and the rears are still (barely) turning,
your car will naturally weathervane in a straight line. You lose steering
ability, but stay pointed in the right direction.

I suspect you're having trouble at the entrance to "Big Bend" and "The 90,"
the last two right handers at The Glen.
Due to the curving approach, these are tricky ***s and can bring anyone
grief if they get carried away.
May I gently suggest you start with a more forgiving track... I think Monza is
possibly the best "beginner" track. It has simple (no esses) turns seperated
by long straights that allow you plenty of time to set up for the next
corner. (Ooops, scratch that....
you're running the demo...) Well then, buy the full game!!

If you're looking for the full game, check eBay. You should find a copy for
~15 bucks.

GPL is very frustrating for a novice. However, if you stick to it, you will,
at some (unexpected) point, suddenly realise "Hey, those fools were right!
This acutally _IS_ fun!" Once you get to that point, the whole game opens up
and becomes a still-difficult but very rewarding diversion.

-Greg

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by **Greg Campbel** » Wed, 12 Jan 2000 04:00:00

> yeeehaw. After 6 hours of practice, I finally finished my 1st lap without
> spinning in the GPL demo at Watkins Glen. My time was 1:12:09 or something
> (In a Eagle w/ a NASCAR Pro wheel, P3-500, 64 megs of RAM, 1 meg trident
> car). I know this time is probably bad, but i was just happy to finish a lap
> in this game without cutting grass. Thanks to those who gave me tips on
> braking and tires spinning. I was able to finish the lap because you guys
> gave me tips on braking earlier and never use 100% brakes. (At Skip Barber,
> they taught me to jam on the brakes 100% down the straight...) As for the
> tire spin, I made it better by lowering my gear ratios. The gears in the car
> was real messed up when I made that lap, but at least I got to finish A lap.

> Just got a few more questions before I go out and buy a real video card and
> the game itself next week

> 1. When you run the car off road on and off the banking, does it hurt the
> suspension if you didn't touch the wall?

I depends on what damage model you're running.

Hmmm, idunnow. Try this: Select auto shifting and observe where the computer
shifts. Set your shift point slightly beyond that RPM.

No turbo, but they still have a steep torque curve. When the engine "comes on
the cam" and starts to breathe well, the power (torque) goes ballistic.

Don't sweat it. 1:12 is great for a newbie. I think the world record is a low
1:03 so you've got your work cut out for you.
With lots more time on track, your lap times will stabillize and slowly drop as
you learn and apply new driving techniques.

GPL uses an "automagic" clutch that disengages when you shift. If you don't let
up on the gas as you shift, the motor zings to the rev limiter. When running
with the "realistic" damage settings, this will eventually wreck your ride.

-Greg

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by **Peter Ive** » Wed, 12 Jan 2000 04:00:00

>> Hi all, I have spent about 5 hours on the GPL demo. So far i still haven't
>> been able to finish a lap without spinning out. My question is, how the hell
>> do I get the god damn car to not jump sideways on me under braking and when i
>> am in 1st/2nd and 3rd gear. I am having a tough time with that, any setups or
>> tips will be helpful

>Hi Cossie,

>First off, N2 it ain't. No slamming on the brake and
>gas - you have to be gentle with the car. At first,
>try to only push the brake about 1/2 way down.
>It's really hard to brake and turn at the same time,
>so try to brake only in a straight line.

>Honestly, your biggest problem is low frame
>rate, based on your other posts. Things happen
>way too fast in GPL to drive at 13 fps. Sorry
>to tell you, but for the price of the PIII 300,
>you could have gotten a Celeron and Voodoo 3,
>and been able to crank up the graphics and
>resolution with 36 fps.

Cossie are you still actually trying to play this game at 13fps? Trust
us on this. You are wasting your time. You'll never get the most out
of this game. I've been there, but fortunately found rehab. here on ras
and was cured. Here's my story:

Until GPL came along I had pretty much been able to jump into any
driving sim that had come out and been able to keep the car on the road
straight out of the box. When I first got GPL I had an fps of about
20-24 which had always been enough for any of these other sims but, just
like you, I was having the greatest difficulty keeping the car from
flying off at every opportunity. God only knows what it's like at
13fps. As soon as I got my fps up to the magic 36 number it was a
completely different game. Until you do something about this you're
just *** a dead horse.
--
Peter Ives - (AKA Ivington)

No person's opinions can be said to be
more correct than another's, because each is
the sole judge of his or her own experience.

by **Bruce Kennewel** » Thu, 13 Jan 2000 04:00:00

Cossie, I would suggest that you ease yourself into the GPL experience by
initially becoming familiar with the car behaviour, and the circuit(s)
layout, by driving either a F3 or F2 car.
They have less power and are therefore not as "snappy" as a full-power F1
car.
By using one of these you will have a much easier introduction to the sim,
with a lot less frustration!
--
Regards,
Bruce Kennewell,
Canberra, Australia.
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by **Dan Belch** » Thu, 13 Jan 2000 04:00:00

Not really. If you add front brakes, the front end will slide more and the
rear will stay planted more. Try putting your brakes totally in the front and
then totally in the rear for an example. Makes for hellacious wrecks if you
have them in the rear. ;)

Dan Belcher
Team Racing Unlimited
http://simcrashes.cjb.net

by **Cossi** » Thu, 13 Jan 2000 04:00:00

Thanks for the help man. I finally got GPL figured out. Right now my braking
problem is all gone (actually i need to find brake markers), now all I need
is stop spinning the damn thing exiting the turns....

My best is at mid 1:11 now

>> Doesn't more front brake bias lock up the brakes easier and make your
rear
>> end lighter? In turn that spins you out?

>A sliding tire actualy produces _less_ braking force than one on the verge
of
>lockup. If your fronts are skidding and the rears are still (barely)
turning,
>your car will naturally weathervane in a straight line. You lose steering
>ability, but stay pointed in the right direction.

>I suspect you're having trouble at the entrance to "Big Bend" and "The 90,"
>the last two right handers at The Glen.
>Due to the curving approach, these are tricky ***s and can bring anyone
>grief if they get carried away.
>May I gently suggest you start with a more forgiving track... I think Monza
is
>possibly the best "beginner" track. It has simple (no esses) turns
seperated
>by long straights that allow you plenty of time to set up for the next
>corner. (Ooops, scratch that....
>you're running the demo...) Well then, buy the full game!!

>If you're looking for the full game, check eBay. You should find a copy
for
>~15 bucks.

>GPL is very frustrating for a novice. However, if you stick to it, you
will,
>at some (unexpected) point, suddenly realise "Hey, those fools were right!
>This acutally _IS_ fun!" Once you get to that point, the whole game opens
up
>and becomes a still-difficult but very rewarding diversion.

>-Greg

>--

>Note!
>Anti-spam tactics engaged!
>Remove the duplicate "g" and "s" before replying.

by **Cossi** » Thu, 13 Jan 2000 04:00:00

I have to disagree with you on that one. With my old computer in NASCAR 2
and 3, I've been racing at somewhere around 15-20fps, so I know what it
feels like. With 13fps, the game is completely playable, it might not be the
best, but I can get a hang of the game after a few hours of frustration.
Right now I got down to 1:11 at the Glen. That 1:11 came as a surprise
because I was driving it very easy and all over the place with the stock
setup. 13fps might not get me the world record, but it will be goood enough
to get a hang of the game.

by **Kurt Steinboc** » Thu, 13 Jan 2000 04:00:00

>I have to disagree with you on that one. With my old computer in NASCAR 2
>and 3, I've been racing at somewhere around 15-20fps, so I know what it
>feels like. With 13fps, the game is completely playable, it might not be
the
>best, but I can get a hang of the game after a few hours of frustration.
>Right now I got down to 1:11 at the Glen. That 1:11 came as a surprise
>because I was driving it very easy and all over the place with the stock
>setup. 13fps might not get me the world record, but it will be goood enough
>to get a hang of the game.

I don't understand how you can make this playability claim without a point
of comparison. When you get to 36 fps, you will not BELIEVE the difference.

Kurt

by **Steve Ferguso** » Thu, 13 Jan 2000 04:00:00

:>I have to disagree with you on that one. With my old computer in NASCAR 2
:>and 3, I've been racing at somewhere around 15-20fps, so I know what it
:>feels like. With 13fps, the game is completely playable, it might not be
: the
:>best, but I can get a hang of the game after a few hours of frustration.
:>Right now I got down to 1:11 at the Glen. That 1:11 came as a surprise
:>because I was driving it very easy and all over the place with the stock
:>setup. 13fps might not get me the world record, but it will be goood enough
:>to get a hang of the game.
:>

: I don't understand how you can make this playability claim without a point
: of comparison. When you get to 36 fps, you will not BELIEVE the difference.

I fired up my notebook at work and started up GP2. Normally I have to
play with all the textures off to get a solid 20-25 fps. I turned them
all on to get the pretty visuals. The frame rate dropped to 13-14. It
sure looked nice (especially with the newer edited tracks) and my lap
times were within 1-2 seconds, but it lost all "feel" with the reduction
in frame rate (and GP2 lacks feel compared to GPL). At low framerates,
regardless of whether one can post decent laptimes, the feeling is that of
interactively controlling a movie of a racing car. At higher framerates,
I get the feling of actually driving the car.

just my opinion.
Stephen

by **Michael Barlo** » Thu, 13 Jan 2000 04:00:00

> I have to disagree with you on that one. With my old computer in NASCAR 2
> and 3, I've been racing at somewhere around 15-20fps, so I know what it
> feels like. With 13fps, the game is completely playable, it might not be the
> best, but I can get a hang of the game after a few hours of frustration.
> Right now I got down to 1:11 at the Glen. That 1:11 came as a surprise
> because I was driving it very easy and all over the place with the stock
> setup. 13fps might not get me the world record, but it will be goood enough
> to get a hang of the game.

13 fps in GPL is just like running N2 at 3 fps. There is a BIG
difference. Once you get that V3, you'll see what we mean. It's a
totally different Sim at 36 fps.

--
=========================================
Mike Barlow of Barlow Racing?
=========================================
http://members.xoom.com/BarlowRacing/

Racing online with the help of......

Race Communications Association
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Mystic Music
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by **Mark Seer** » Thu, 13 Jan 2000 04:00:00

Aha. Mr Kennewell.

Happy new year to you ya lurker <G>

MS

rec.autos.simulators

GPL is hell, I need help

GPL is hell, I need help

GPL is hell, I need help

GPL is hell, I need help

GPL is hell, I need help

GPL is hell, I need help

GPL is hell, I need help

GPL is hell, I need help

GPL is hell, I need help

GPL is hell, I need help

GPL is hell, I need help

GPL is hell, I need help

GPL is hell, I need help

GPL is hell, I need help

GPL is hell, I need help

GPL is hell, I need help