rec.autos.simulators

West Racing update

Dave Henri

West Racing update

by Dave Henri » Fri, 24 Oct 2003 12:29:24


Nobody could

   Well call me a drooling idiot.  We have to remember that "WE" the
members of RAS have absolutely NO right to demand anything from the Wests.  
The WESTS are making RL not RAS.  We can shout to the heavens about what we
want and what we think is important, and maybe the Wests will listen, but
in the end, this is their project.  RL may, or may-not, be born, but I
willnot spend X amount of time between now and then complaining about stuff
that I have no creative input on.  A-lot of fellows here are getting worked
up about RL as if they themselves are funding the project, as if we the
denizens of RAS are sponsors.  We are nothing.  We cannot dictate.  We
cannot demand.  
  And we also seem to be short sighted....a fully working
transporter...just imagine what a sim could do with that...driving the big
rig into the track, I wonder if the ACT LABs shifter would need an 18 gear
template.  Then unloading your car and pushing it over to the garages.  
Then driving from the garages to the pits and thence to the track.  Why
racing sims have never attempted to match the Hanger to runway immersion
many flight sims have is beyond me.
   I'm not appolgizing for the Wests...they have created much of their own
PR problems, but I am also not criticizing something just because their
timeline doesn't meet with my approval.  Let'em work, let'em make tiny
updates sporadically on their website, I don't care.  Call me if RL is  
ever released and then you can ask me what I think of it.

dave henrie

Steve Blankenshi

West Racing update

by Steve Blankenshi » Fri, 24 Oct 2003 12:32:33






> >>Nobody could
> >> POSSIBLY be stupid enough to think that a fully-modelled race
transporter
> >is
> >> what everyone wants...

> >And nobody could possibly be stupid enough to think that RL is for
everyone.
> >Thus, what everyone wants is unimportant

> Ok, maybe I should have said "what PEOPLE want".  Meaning that nobody in
their
> right mind would think that's what most people wanted. Is what most people
want
> unimportant as well?   I still find it hard to believe that anyone would
drool
> over a fully-modelled race transporter, when we don't even have the cars
yet.
> Come on, a *transporter*?!?  I would say "who cares?", but it's obvious
that at
> least you do.  You really seem to always be on the West's bandwagon
through
> weird press release after weird press release.  While that's
admirable(nobody
> can accuse you of being a Johnny-come lately), I'm just wondering why?
Your
> support of those guys borders on religious faith.  You continue to believe
with
> all your heart even though there's no real proof that something even
exists.
> Watching the group reactions though, their church is losing followers...
> I'm an atheist - I can't believe in something without seeing evidence.

Actually Eldred, that would make you agnostic.  Which I think is where a lot
of folks come down on RL, among other things.  They'd love for it all to be
true, but aren't willing to believe just yet for fear of being disappointed
in...the end... ;-)

SB

Steve Whitt

West Racing update

by Steve Whitt » Fri, 24 Oct 2003 13:06:12


>   And we also seem to be short sighted....a fully working
> transporter...just imagine what a sim could do with that...driving the big
> rig into the track,

Just imagine, a wreckers delight.....:-)
Take out the whole field by parking across a corner...

Steve

Txl

West Racing update

by Txl » Fri, 24 Oct 2003 15:43:04

You're right and make sense.

Personally i don't give a shit about the transporter, all I want to do is
"drive" the damn cars, but if their priority list may seem ***ed up to me
it might make sense to them, before the racing you need to get to the
track...

So the next step might be to simulate the bad food and the driver needing
to take a shit in the middle of the race, or pissing in his suit for the
long races and then you COULD have electrical problems based on the fluid
dynamics, track layout (turning right or left) and whether your***is
more yellow than white and has a fluidity factor of more than 0.21454

Basically do the same for me than for Dave, wake me up when we have
something to test, and let them simulate what they want, after all it's
their life...

Carl Ribbegaard

West Racing update

by Carl Ribbegaard » Fri, 24 Oct 2003 17:40:26

I honestly don't see the point in bashing the Wests methods. It's their
project, period.
If it is released, I'll be happy to buy it. But until that moment, I'm happy
for whatever progress they do.

/Carl

Joachim Trens

West Racing update

by Joachim Trens » Fri, 24 Oct 2003 18:33:54

Yup, and if you want caviar and champaign instead of beer with
fish and chips, you've got to shell out that extra buck or two ;-)

Achim


...

redTe

West Racing update

by redTe » Sat, 25 Oct 2003 00:10:51

Since when did the consumer become a "nothing" ? Unless these West's guys
are giving the game away for sod all, and that certainly does not seem to be
the case, then I suggest they would be wise to take some advice from a few
sim racers.

Eldre

West Racing update

by Eldre » Sat, 25 Oct 2003 02:03:24

Nah, I wouldn't do that...

I wasn't demanding - I just thought it was pretty damn WEIRD...  Truthfully,
I've given up on it.  

What's the percentage of people who actually follow pre-flight checklists, as
opposed to just jumping in the plane and flying?
It might actually make more sense for the 'immersion' factor, because a real
pilot(except the Blue Angels) would do their own pre-flights.  But a real race
driver wouldn't drive the truck and unload the car.  Most of them don't even
WORK on the car...<g>

As I said, I've given up on it.  So I look at it as a humorous curiousity, and
something to talk/laugh/argue about.  If it happens, fine.  If it doesn't, I'm
not out anything.
Are you saying that since it's not out yet, we can't argue about what we would
or would not like to see in it?  If so, why not?

Eldred
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Eldre

West Racing update

by Eldre » Sat, 25 Oct 2003 02:09:20

From dictionary.com:
atheist

\A"the*ist\, n. [Gr. ? without god; 'a priv. + ? god: cf. F. ath['e]iste.] 1.
One who disbelieves or denies the existence of a God, or supreme intelligent
Being.

I don't believe in God, so this definition is still accurate...<g>

I don't have any fear of being disappointed, but I simply haven't seen anything
that makes me believe it's true.  That goes for both subjects... :-)

Eldred
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Peter Ive

West Racing update

by Peter Ive » Sat, 25 Oct 2003 03:44:47



<snip>

<snip>

Aaw, come on Dave, that kind of stuff is jaw dropping and immersive the
first time around and would probably give you a real buzz, but a week
later and you would not even bother with it.  What most sim enthusiasts
want to do is the part that counts, be that racing, flying, skiing,
shooting, etc, and the sooner the simmer can get to the point where that
is exactly what he is doing the better.

I'm not saying all this extra eye-candy and little touches won't add
that bit extra, but it's not what will keep everyone coming back for one
more race.
--
Peter Ives (AKA Pete Ivington)
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If you know what's good for you, don't listen to me :)
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Steve Blankenshi

West Racing update

by Steve Blankenshi » Sat, 25 Oct 2003 04:19:25


That's a pretty broad definition; the important part in atheism/agnosticism
is not the not, but the WHY not...

As a RL agnostic, one would say, "I'll believe it when I see it, or when I
at least see enough evidence to convince me; but not before then", whereas a
true RL atheist would say "Nope. Not gonna happen, not ever, and here's
why...".  I'm sure there are some of the latter, but I suspect the majority
harbor at least some dark glimmer of hope, and that means they're not true
atheists.  Perhaps even you!

I rest my case... ;-)

SB

Carl Ribbegaard

West Racing update

by Carl Ribbegaard » Sat, 25 Oct 2003 06:49:21




> > >> I'm an atheist - I can't believe in something without seeing
evidence.

> > >Actually Eldred, that would make you agnostic.

> > From dictionary.com:
> > atheist

> > \A"the*ist\, n. [Gr. ? without god; 'a priv. + ? god: cf. F.
ath['e]iste.]
> 1.
> > One who disbelieves or denies the existence of a God, or supreme
> intelligent
> > Being.

> > I don't believe in God, so this definition is still accurate...<g>

> That's a pretty broad definition; the important part in
atheism/agnosticism
> is not the not, but the WHY not...

> As a RL agnostic, one would say, "I'll believe it when I see it, or when I
> at least see enough evidence to convince me; but not before then"

I think an RL agnostic would say, "RL is within us all. It's up to each own
to find it."

:)

Dave Henri

West Racing update

by Dave Henri » Sat, 25 Oct 2003 11:25:34



   What are you consuming?  Until they actual have a product to sell, you
can't be a consumer.  But I will agree, they could get plenty of good
advice from groups like RAS.  In they end though, we have no say whether
they will listen to such input.
dh

Dave Henri

West Racing update

by Dave Henri » Sat, 25 Oct 2003 11:27:41



   not in the least, but folks here have gotten pretty demanding it seems
to me.  "It MUST have this, it MUST have that..."  I hope it does see the
light of day, and then we can all judge it on it's merits...until
then..it's wasted energy to get so worked up over the title.

dave henrie

Eldre

West Racing update

by Eldre » Sat, 25 Oct 2003 12:17:05



>That's a pretty broad definition; the important part in atheism/agnosticism
>is not the not, but the WHY not...

>As a RL agnostic, one would say, "I'll believe it when I see it, or when I
>at least see enough evidence to convince me; but not before then", whereas a
>true RL atheist would say "Nope. Not gonna happen, not ever, and here's
>why...".  I'm sure there are some of the latter, but I suspect the majority
>harbor at least some dark glimmer of hope, and that means they're not true
>atheists.  Perhaps even you!

Nah...no glimmer of hope.  I simply don't CARE.  I remember seeing statement
like this once.  Sorry I can't remember who wrote it...

"If there is a God, and that God wants anything whatsoever to do with me, then
he know where I am and how to make me believe in his existence.  The fact that
he hasn't done so speaks for itself..."

Eldred
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