rec.autos.simulators

Ouch! It's starting to sound like GP2 when it was released - everyone
will have to wait 2-3 for hardware that can actually run GPL!

Joe

You are right that wasn't my point, but just for comparison what set-up are
you using?

What graphics card(s) and graphics options?  It never drops below 36 FPS?
If it does, how low does it go?

Thanks,

Marc.

Actually, they do. On Papyrus' website, the specs for the recommended
system include a PII-266.

--
Wolfgang Preiss   \ E-mail copies of replies to this posting are welcome.

Which you'll also find printed on the bottom of the box as well as in
the readme.

- Eric

I've got to second Alison's comments. See my own post on GPL performance
on a K6-225. Last night I checked my frame rates, and with all graphics
on except mirror textures, and cars and track only in mirrors, I got
16-23 fps with a full field, mainly around 18-19, dropping only slightly
when other cars were around. In the pits, I got 10-12, and on the start,
the frame rate began around 11 and climbed steadily as everyone
approached the first turn. Turning more graphics off didn't affect the
frame rate nearly as much as reducing the field - going down to 10
opponents, frame rates rose to the mid to high 20s.

Still much more playable than GP2, which I still can't get to <100% CPU
load without turning most of the graphics off.

I also took Alison's advice and tried out the Coventry rather than the
Lotus. The improvement in handling was quite noticeable, though I was
slower than everyone else on the track :)

Michael Knepher

Eric,

The bottom of the box does not tell anyone what is required to race as
opposed to drive in training mode.  Everyone assumes that graphics options
will affect framerate and will need to be adjusted accordingly.  They may
not be aware how little effect that has in GPL.  I can set my graphics to
look worse than ICR2 and it's the still the Ai that kills the framerate.

Astonishingly, Steve Smith is bluntly honest about this and many other
aspects of the game in the included Strategy Guide (I just got my official
copy of the game today, so I had not yet seen this).  All I am saying, and I
won't keep repeating it, is that a precis of his hardware requirements
should be on the outside of the box--where people can see it before they buy
(usually unreturnable software).

GPL is a racing game (although it also great as a hot lapper) and presumably
people are buying it to race.  You are advertising and promoting it as a
racing game.  A third category called hardware required to run a full field
race should be added to the minimum and preferred requirements.  Equally
important is an explanation of what the "minimum" requirements will get
someone.  I think you know it is a lot more minimum than any typical
consumer/purchaser would expect, if you want to be honest about this.  No
aspect of the game other than the menus would be recognisable (see box
cover, as you pointed out) on a minimum system (unless you wanted 3-5 fps).

Obviously I am big fan, have been eagerly awaiting this game, and have just
purchased it.  But I would buy it anyway because I am a nut.  However, if
you relied on people like me to keep you afloat, this game wouldn't have
ever seen the light of day.  GPL is a tough enough sell in a day and age
where the playstation mentality seems to rule.  Don't offend and mislead Joe
and Jane Average or, to use a Steve Smith phrase, "they will come back and
bite you."

Marc.

Well, for the real specs:

 4 meg Rendition V2200 AGP
12 meg Voodoo2

I get slightly different results with the two rendering engines.

The V2200 is very nearly locked at 35-36 fps.  No major slowdows at all
at 640x480.  Pit lane and start/finish hardly cause a hiccup.  800x600
gives me a lower framerate, and I don't like it.  I keep anti-aliasing off because it does wacky things to distant objects.  There is also a
graininess to the overall image - the tracks often appear to be made
of gravel.  No idea whether this would be better with an 8 meg card.

The Pure 3D II gives me slightly higher peak fps...36-37 whether at
640x480 or 800x600...so I run at 800 all the time.  Image quality is
IMHO better than the V2200 (no graininess), but that's also due to
the higher resolution I can run.  FPS drops to about 28 when running in
traffic, and I've seen (very briefly) it go as low as 22-24 through the
pits.

I seem to get faster laptimes with the Voodoo2 - no explanation, as
framerates are pretty much the same...I suppose I can "see" better
at 800x600...but the car seems to "feel" better with the Voodoo2.

--

Neil Yeatman          
Ajax, Ontario, CANADA

Hey Cool people are comparing my Homebuilt K6-2 333 to a PII -450
neato...my sim runs pretty much 32FPS all the time except during the
start and near the pits. INCREDIBLE GAME....ABSOLUTELY INCREDIBLE....

FERRARI

PAPA DOC

Pierre PAPA DOC Legrand
Infamous
Pink Flamingo Pilot...<G>

http://home.earthlink.net/~plegrand/PINKFLAMINGO.htm

At least in my opinion, then, you have the minimum set-up to actually
race...if low 20's is the lowest you get.

Marc.

because it does wacky things to distant objects.  There is also a

I agree completely that companies need to be honest about hardware
requirements.  And that Steve Smith did a better job than Sierra's
box at defining what GPL needs.

However, good software stores in the US do allow returns.  (Friends
don't let friends shop at Best Buy.)  And Sierra does have a 30-day
direct return policy in the US.

90% of computer games are utter crap.  Buy only after seeing
favorable end-user reviews and/or playing a demo.  Even then, buy
only where you can return the game if it doesn't work.  Semantics
as to the distinction between what "minimum" and "recommended"
requirements give you in an incredibly great product like GPL are
a pretty minor problem, in an industry where outright fraud
(features listed on the box but not in the product, rebates that
are never honored) is rampant.

--

spamgard(tm): To email me, put "geek" in your Subject line.

Yes...but only for VERY short periods of time.  Most of the time it
flies along at max FPS.

--

Neil Yeatman          
Ajax, Ontario, CANADA

Sorry Dave,

That was with a full field of 19 opponents.  I shouldn't have left
that part out.. :)

--

Neil Yeatman          
Ajax, Ontario, CANADA

I agree that Papyrus'/Sierra's transgression on this one is minor compared
to all the awful dishonest fraudulent activities out there...  But I don't
measure my "friends" against the lowest common denominator available and
Papyrus has a long an honoured history with many of us that results in, for
me at least, higher expectations.

Marc.

% What good is it to have super AI, when you can not race against any of them.
% I have a PII 333 OC to 375, voodoo2 and It still drop way down to less than
% 10 FPS with full field.  What type of computer did they make this game on.
% It must be something we can't get or else they knew the FPS sucked and
% released it anyway.

At what resolution?  I never see it drop below 19 (except for major
accidents) at any resolution 800 or below (this is with a full field and
4 sounds, cars only in the mirrors) on my PII 300 with Voodoo2.

--
**************************** Michael E. Carver *************************
     Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town.

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