GPL trying to go quicker at Monza

by **Tim Leighto** » Fri, 05 Mar 1999 04:00:00

I have been practising GPL for about two months now. I am quite new to
simming, having had the occasional play with GP2 in rookie mode, all aids
on, with a basic joystick. I now have MS FF wheel, PII 350, 128 Mb RAM,
Voodoo 2 SLI and am enthralled by GPL to the exclusion of all other games. I
probably play about 5-10 hours per week. I like the Lotus, finding it the
easiest car to drive quickly, and generally I find Graeme Nash's setups (or
something softer) suit my style. Would that I could drive his laptimes
however!

I seem to have hit a ceiling at the tracks I know, and would appreciate tips
to go faster. I can't seem to get under 1m30 at Monza, but I can do
consistent 1m30's and 31's. I think its the Curva Grande that slows me down:
my Vmin always gets down to 130 mph and if I try to go quicker I usually end
up on the rail. I am braking a bit at the end of the straight and changing
down to fourth as it seems quicker out of the corner than staying in 5th. I
could go quicker through the Lesmos too I suspect, but the Vialone isn't a
problem: I usually end up going through there at 175 to 180 mph. Rather than
send a long post about all the tracks I'd like to improve on (Glen, Spa,
Zandvoort and Rouen) I'll post about each in turn. Any advice would be most
welcome.

Tim

by **Wosc** » Fri, 05 Mar 1999 04:00:00

lets see. At curve grande it is hard to explain how to do it so I won't
even try it, its just too hard to explain. In the lesmo, try to brake
diagonally into the turn where when it cuts to turn to the right, you are at
the right hand side, this allows you to hit your apex easier without getting
caught out. If I try to stay outside and then try to cut in for the apex,
it normally doesnt turn and I end up running way wide, at the second lesmo,
try to slow down a little extra and hit your apex perfectly and then get the
power down ASAP. That is important there because you need that speed ALL
the way down the back straight. Also in parabolica, try to feed as much gas
on the exit as you can without spinning it, just keep putting it on until it
gets loose and keep it there, normally you have enough room at the outside
but if not then youll need to get closer to the inside in the middle of the
turn which requires either going a little wider at the enterance or you can
slow down a little more and just hold it tight until halfway through, and at
about a third through, you should be on the gas as hard as it will allow
without spinning. This will help get a good run on to the front straight.
People don't realise that the most important turns are the ones before the
straights. They say that gaining 10% in a slow corner has less results than
gaining 10% in a faster turn, what i have to say about that is, its easier
to gain 10% in a slower corner and if you gain say just 5 mph in a turn, you
will hold that extra 5 MPH all teh way down the straight and if it is real
long, it can count for a lot of time. Yet the other turns are also crucial,
if you can get through lesmo 1 fast, that is still time off your lap, but
you have to slow down right afterwards so you gain little. Well I'm
rambling but I hope this helps.

Jesse

>I have been practising GPL for about two months now. I am quite new to
>simming, having had the occasional play with GP2 in rookie mode, all aids
>on, with a basic joystick. I now have MS FF wheel, PII 350, 128 Mb RAM,
>Voodoo 2 SLI and am enthralled by GPL to the exclusion of all other games.
I
>probably play about 5-10 hours per week. I like the Lotus, finding it the
>easiest car to drive quickly, and generally I find Graeme Nash's setups (or
>something softer) suit my style. Would that I could drive his laptimes
>however!

>I seem to have hit a ceiling at the tracks I know, and would appreciate
tips
>to go faster. I can't seem to get under 1m30 at Monza, but I can do
>consistent 1m30's and 31's. I think its the Curva Grande that slows me
down:
>my Vmin always gets down to 130 mph and if I try to go quicker I usually
end
>up on the rail. I am braking a bit at the end of the straight and changing
>down to fourth as it seems quicker out of the corner than staying in 5th. I
>could go quicker through the Lesmos too I suspect, but the Vialone isn't a
>problem: I usually end up going through there at 175 to 180 mph. Rather
than
>send a long post about all the tracks I'd like to improve on (Glen, Spa,
>Zandvoort and Rouen) I'll post about each in turn. Any advice would be most
>welcome.

>Tim

by **Tim Leighto** » Sat, 06 Mar 1999 04:00:00

Thanks Jesse. Makes sense. I guess I'm going to have to up my practice time.
I'm beginning to notice that braking harder for a slower entry to some
corners ends up with a faster exit.
Tim

>lets see. At curve grande it is hard to explain how to do it so I won't
>even try it, its just too hard to explain. In the lesmo, try to brake
>diagonally into the turn where when it cuts to turn to the right, you are
at
>the right hand side, this allows you to hit your apex easier without
getting
>caught out. If I try to stay outside and then try to cut in for the apex,
>it normally doesnt turn and I end up running way wide, at the second lesmo,
>try to slow down a little extra and hit your apex perfectly and then get
the
>power down ASAP. That is important there because you need that speed ALL
>the way down the back straight. Also in parabolica, try to feed as much
gas
>on the exit as you can without spinning it, just keep putting it on until
it
>gets loose and keep it there, normally you have enough room at the outside
>but if not then youll need to get closer to the inside in the middle of the
>turn which requires either going a little wider at the enterance or you can
>slow down a little more and just hold it tight until halfway through, and
at
>about a third through, you should be on the gas as hard as it will allow
>without spinning. This will help get a good run on to the front straight.
>People don't realise that the most important turns are the ones before the
>straights. They say that gaining 10% in a slow corner has less results
than
>gaining 10% in a faster turn, what i have to say about that is, its easier
>to gain 10% in a slower corner and if you gain say just 5 mph in a turn,
you
>will hold that extra 5 MPH all teh way down the straight and if it is real
>long, it can count for a lot of time. Yet the other turns are also
crucial,
>if you can get through lesmo 1 fast, that is still time off your lap, but
>you have to slow down right afterwards so you gain little. Well I'm
>rambling but I hope this helps.

>Jesse

by **Andre Warrin** » Sat, 06 Mar 1999 04:00:00

Wise words Wosco. After examing lots of fast laps (especially those of
Woeger) I realized that I lost most of my time in the second lesmo and
in the parabolica. If you're a fraction quicker out of the 2nd lesmo,
you take the speed all the way with you to parabolica, gaining lots of
time.
Curve grande IS hard to describe, you have to develop a feeling for
it. But I'll try:
Enter it on the far right. Just about a second before entering the
corner, brake fairly hard and immediately steer to the right. The
sudden braking will help you point your car in the right direction.
Don't give gas yet, keep a steady throttle and make sure you are
driving close to the right side. At about 1/3rd of the corner, slowly
give gas. You will drift to the left. At about 2/3rd of the corner,
give full throttle. You'll drift more to the left. With a right
timing, you'll exit the corner while just missing the grass on the
left side.
Take a look at the 1.27.14 lap of Woeger. He even touches the grass on
the left, but this doesn't cost any speed (or hardly)
I drive Monza for about 3 months, without getting below 1.30. Very
frustrating to see other people do it, and in their replays they seem
to do it so easily.
I also learned a lot by using the GPLDUMP program, a great way to see
where other people are faster than you.
Hope this helps!

Best regards,
Andre Warringa
The Netherlands.

>lets see. At curve grande it is hard to explain how to do it so I won't
>even try it, its just too hard to explain. In the lesmo, try to brake
>diagonally into the turn where when it cuts to turn to the right, you are at
>the right hand side, this allows you to hit your apex easier without getting
>caught out. If I try to stay outside and then try to cut in for the apex,
>it normally doesnt turn and I end up running way wide, at the second lesmo,
>try to slow down a little extra and hit your apex perfectly and then get the
>power down ASAP. That is important there because you need that speed ALL
>the way down the back straight. Also in parabolica, try to feed as much gas
>on the exit as you can without spinning it, just keep putting it on until it
>gets loose and keep it there, normally you have enough room at the outside
>but if not then youll need to get closer to the inside in the middle of the
>turn which requires either going a little wider at the enterance or you can
>slow down a little more and just hold it tight until halfway through, and at
>about a third through, you should be on the gas as hard as it will allow
>without spinning. This will help get a good run on to the front straight.
>People don't realise that the most important turns are the ones before the
>straights. They say that gaining 10% in a slow corner has less results than
>gaining 10% in a faster turn, what i have to say about that is, its easier
>to gain 10% in a slower corner and if you gain say just 5 mph in a turn, you
>will hold that extra 5 MPH all teh way down the straight and if it is real
>long, it can count for a lot of time. Yet the other turns are also crucial,
>if you can get through lesmo 1 fast, that is still time off your lap, but
>you have to slow down right afterwards so you gain little. Well I'm
>rambling but I hope this helps.

>Jesse

>>I have been practising GPL for about two months now. I am quite new to
>>simming, having had the occasional play with GP2 in rookie mode, all aids
>>on, with a basic joystick. I now have MS FF wheel, PII 350, 128 Mb RAM,
>>Voodoo 2 SLI and am enthralled by GPL to the exclusion of all other games.
>I
>>probably play about 5-10 hours per week. I like the Lotus, finding it the
>>easiest car to drive quickly, and generally I find Graeme Nash's setups (or
>>something softer) suit my style. Would that I could drive his laptimes
>>however!

>>I seem to have hit a ceiling at the tracks I know, and would appreciate
>tips
>>to go faster. I can't seem to get under 1m30 at Monza, but I can do
>>consistent 1m30's and 31's. I think its the Curva Grande that slows me
>down:
>>my Vmin always gets down to 130 mph and if I try to go quicker I usually
>end
>>up on the rail. I am braking a bit at the end of the straight and changing
>>down to fourth as it seems quicker out of the corner than staying in 5th. I
>>could go quicker through the Lesmos too I suspect, but the Vialone isn't a
>>problem: I usually end up going through there at 175 to 180 mph. Rather
>than
>>send a long post about all the tracks I'd like to improve on (Glen, Spa,
>>Zandvoort and Rouen) I'll post about each in turn. Any advice would be most
>>welcome.

>>Tim

by **DAVI** » Sat, 06 Mar 1999 04:00:00

Those seem top be the most important corners on the track. I have been able
to drop a bunch of time concentrating on these two corners.

Remember with this corner you really don't drop time here but you can gain
a bunch. I brake medium at entry loosing speed from 194 to about 160 and
then just let car roll into corner with no gas so car will rotate to apex.
As soon as I can I start to roll on to gas so that when at apex I am at
full throttle. I aim for an exit rpm close to 8000 rpms in 4th gear. I do
think this corner is taken more as a result of setup then anything else.
My best laps put me about a low speed in the corner in the mid 130s.

Dave

by **Bill Bollinge** » Sat, 06 Mar 1999 04:00:00

> Thanks Jesse. Makes sense. I guess I'm going to have to up my practice time.
> I'm beginning to notice that braking harder for a slower entry to some
> corners ends up with a faster exit.
> Tim

AAAAAAAAAAAK, you road racers are sounding like us Oval guys now......
No don't say it hehehehheheheh

In oval racing the above statement is absolutely true.

Bill / Amish on TEN

by **Pat Dotso** » Sat, 06 Mar 1999 04:00:00

> > Thanks Jesse. Makes sense. I guess I'm going to have to up my practice time.
> > I'm beginning to notice that braking harder for a slower entry to some
> > corners ends up with a faster exit.
> > Tim

> AAAAAAAAAAAK, you road racers are sounding like us Oval guys now......
> No don't say it hehehehheheheh

> In oval racing the above statement is absolutely true.

> Bill / Amish on TEN

Unless you have JKirby behind you... Then it's
a straight trip into the wall.

--
------------------------------------------------------

IMPACT Motorsports
http://www.impactmotorsports.com/pd.html
------------------------------------------------------

by **Tim Leighto** » Sat, 06 Mar 1999 04:00:00

First of all thanks to everyone who offered advice

>Curve grande IS hard to describe, you have to develop a feeling for
>it. But I'll try:
>Enter it on the far right.

Andre, your advice is very useful, as is Dave's. However I have to check.
Enter on the far right??? I have been approaching on the far left of the
track (where the groove is or even a little to the left of it) and turning
in. am I being stupid, have I misunderstood you, or is there a different way
of driving this bend? I apologise if I'm being dumb. Where can I download
Woeger's laps?

Tim

by **Tim Leighto** » Sat, 06 Mar 1999 04:00:00

Sorry Andre, I now understand exactly what you mean about the entry to Curva
Grande. I downloaded Wolfgang's Monza lap 15 minutes ago, and using his
setup have just driven: outlap then 1m30.98, 1m30.89, 1m30.58 straight out
of the box. So I know better times are just around the corner (so to
speak!). I am however amazed to see him (WW) drive the Lesmos in third. I
have always been down to second round Lesmo 1, and really squirting on the
power between them to about 122 mph, and round the second Lesmo and then
squeezing on power to the redline still in second before the upshift. Is it
quicker in third?
Tim

>Wise words Wosco. After examing lots of fast laps (especially those of
>Woeger) I realized that I lost most of my time in the second lesmo

by **DAVI** » Sun, 07 Mar 1999 04:00:00

I think for Wolfgang taking the Lesmos in third is faster. I had tried it
and have problems getting car to rotate fast enought to suit me. I do
think Wolfgang entry speed into Lesmo 2 is around 122 mph. The car will be
more settled in 3rd gear compared to 2nd gear and that may help in getting
power down, and keep you running more consistant laps.

Dave

by **DAVI** » Sun, 07 Mar 1999 04:00:00

I try to go down the straight with car in the darkened groove. At Curva
Grande I will brake a touch early and turn car in before the darkened area
starts to turn. I find if I wait I end up missing turn in and try to play
catch up thru the turn. I have set car up to oversteer when I am off the
gas and to understeer when I am on the gas and if I am able to get to what
is called nuetral throttle the car is neutral. So depending on how is
reacting I wll either apply throttle or stay off of gas and let car
oversteer to the inside of corner. This can be a bit unsettling tho since
when car is neutral at neutral throttle you really are not too sure what
car is going to do sometimes.

Dave

by **Tim Leighto** » Mon, 08 Mar 1999 04:00:00

Yes! Thanks to all who helped. I have just driven a 1m29.79 and I was
dreadfully wide into the first Lesmo and slower than my best through Ascari
and Parabolica, so I know I can improve by more than a second.
Tim

>On Thu, 04 Mar 1999 17:33:16 GMT, "Tim Leighton"

>>I seem to have hit a ceiling at the tracks I know, and would appreciate
tips
>>to go faster. I can't seem to get under 1m30 at Monza, but I can do
>>consistent 1m30's and 31's. I think its the Curva Grande that slows me
down:
>>my Vmin always gets down to 130 mph and if I try to go quicker I usually
end
>>up on the rail. I am braking a bit at the end of the straight and changing
>>down to fourth as it seems quicker out of the corner than staying in 5th.
I
>>could go quicker through the Lesmos too I suspect, but the Vialone isn't a
>>problem: I usually end up going through there at 175 to 180 mph. Rather
than
>>send a long post about all the tracks I'd like to improve on (Glen, Spa,
>>Zandvoort and Rouen) I'll post about each in turn. Any advice would be
most
>>welcome.

>I'll try to explain how I drove my fastest lap 1:27.37. Before Curva
>Grande the asphalt gets darker. Just before that brake, change down to
>4th and turn in pretty hard. Stay tight on the inside line and then
>try to find a point where you can apply the throttle and not get on
>the grass at the exit.

>Approaching the first Lesmos brake hard and turn in early so you can
>stay tight. In the second Lesmos the exit is really important so try
>to get the power down as early as possible.

>Then full speed with no lifts through Serraglio and Ascari, use all
>the road in Ascari if you have to. Approaching Parabolica, again brake
>hard and turn in quite early so the car slides a little bit and drops
>speed. Then careful with the throttle and there's your first lap under
>1:30 I hope. :)

>Before I struggled to get under 1:28 but then I started to turn in
>harder at the Curva Grande so the car slides a little bit. This way I
>got my record lap.

>It's a little bit difficult to explain this especially if your native
>language isn't english but I hope this helps you!
>--
>Greger Huttu

by **Lindsay Adam** » Tue, 09 Mar 1999 04:00:00

it may also be worth checking his gear ratios...

>Sorry Andre, I now understand exactly what you mean about the entry to
Curva
>Grande. I downloaded Wolfgang's Monza lap 15 minutes ago, and using his
>setup have just driven: outlap then 1m30.98, 1m30.89, 1m30.58 straight out
>of the box. So I know better times are just around the corner (so to
>speak!). I am however amazed to see him (WW) drive the Lesmos in third. I
>have always been down to second round Lesmo 1, and really squirting on the
>power between them to about 122 mph, and round the second Lesmo and then
>squeezing on power to the redline still in second before the upshift. Is it
>quicker in third?
>Tim

>>Wise words Wosco. After examing lots of fast laps (especially those of
>>Woeger) I realized that I lost most of my time in the second lesmo

by **Tadej Krev** » Wed, 10 Mar 1999 04:00:00

Ok.... here's my 1:27.23 lap ;o)

Curva Grande :
As Greger said, brake a bit, downshift and (if you're still carrying too much
speed)
turn-in hard, otherwise turn-in gentle. And keep feathering the throttle !
You don't have to exit as Greger said. His way, you'll scrubb off the speed at
exit
and you don't want that. The easier,safer and (maybe a bit) faster way to exit
it, is
to stay as close to the apex as you can and after apex aim for the exit at full
throttle
and try not to slide to the left side of the track (you'll need a nice setup for
it - e.g.
Ian Lake's).

Then Lesmo1 : As you reach 179mph <g> (just kidding, this is rare), I mean when
you're
about 1 car length from the place where the groove darkens, hit the brakes and
stay on the
right. Then ease off the brakes at about 100mph (just before you think you should
turn-in)
and scrubb off the speed to about 80mph into the corner. If you do it right,
you'll hit the apex
just right and you'll be able to power out of it very effectively, up to 124mph
to the Lesmo2.
I still have to figure this one out. This one and Parabolica are a key for 1:26
lap :)
Well...Lesmo2 : brake a bit diagonal where the groove darkens, ease off gently,
try to hit the
apex and (the best thing is to switch to 3rd gear when easing off the brakes and
aiming for the apex)
power out of it as soon as possible (it's hard :)). Then flat out to Parabolica
(through both fast-lefthanders
try to be as smooth as possible not to scrubb off the seed). Start braking at
that white plate on the left
side of the track after the groove darkened. While braking, aim for the tight
entry to the corner. Ease off
and let it slide a bit into the corner. You can prevent the slide with applying a
bit throttle. Now in 2nd gear
you switch to 3rd as you try to come as close to the right hand of the corner as
possible under FULL throttle. And take that chequered flag ;o)

If you'd do it as I described, you should be in very low 1:27's :)
If not, you probably Shift-R'ed already :)

The problem is when you get so close to the best times or to the WR is that you
know how to do it, but
you just can't :) (or do it after 50 laps)

Hope this helps.

Tadej Krevh
Lotus Internet Racing
http://members.xoom.com/LotusRacing/

> On Thu, 04 Mar 1999 17:33:16 GMT, "Tim Leighton"

> >I seem to have hit a ceiling at the tracks I know, and would appreciate tips
> >to go faster. I can't seem to get under 1m30 at Monza, but I can do
> >consistent 1m30's and 31's. I think its the Curva Grande that slows me down:
> >my Vmin always gets down to 130 mph and if I try to go quicker I usually end
> >up on the rail. I am braking a bit at the end of the straight and changing
> >down to fourth as it seems quicker out of the corner than staying in 5th. I
> >could go quicker through the Lesmos too I suspect, but the Vialone isn't a
> >problem: I usually end up going through there at 175 to 180 mph. Rather than
> >send a long post about all the tracks I'd like to improve on (Glen, Spa,
> >Zandvoort and Rouen) I'll post about each in turn. Any advice would be most
> >welcome.

> I'll try to explain how I drove my fastest lap 1:27.37. Before Curva
> Grande the asphalt gets darker. Just before that brake, change down to
> 4th and turn in pretty hard. Stay tight on the inside line and then
> try to find a point where you can apply the throttle and not get on
> the grass at the exit.

> Approaching the first Lesmos brake hard and turn in early so you can
> stay tight. In the second Lesmos the exit is really important so try
> to get the power down as early as possible.

> Then full speed with no lifts through Serraglio and Ascari, use all
> the road in Ascari if you have to. Approaching Parabolica, again brake
> hard and turn in quite early so the car slides a little bit and drops
> speed. Then careful with the throttle and there's your first lap under
> 1:30 I hope. :)

> Before I struggled to get under 1:28 but then I started to turn in
> harder at the Curva Grande so the car slides a little bit. This way I
> got my record lap.

> It's a little bit difficult to explain this especially if your native
> language isn't english but I hope this helps you!
> --
> Greger Huttu

by **Tadej Krev** » Thu, 11 Mar 1999 04:00:00

It's easier, you make less mistakes, you can come on the power earlier and the
MOST important
thing : you don't scrub off your speed as you power out of the corner (powering
out of Lesmo2 in 3rd
is much quicker since you don't have to upshift while still sliding a bit)

Just my $0.02

Tadej

> Sorry Andre, I now understand exactly what you mean about the entry to Curva
> Grande. I downloaded Wolfgang's Monza lap 15 minutes ago, and using his
> setup have just driven: outlap then 1m30.98, 1m30.89, 1m30.58 straight out
> of the box. So I know better times are just around the corner (so to
> speak!). I am however amazed to see him (WW) drive the Lesmos in third. I
> have always been down to second round Lesmo 1, and really squirting on the
> power between them to about 122 mph, and round the second Lesmo and then
> squeezing on power to the redline still in second before the upshift. Is it
> quicker in third?
> Tim

> >Wise words Wosco. After examing lots of fast laps (especially those of
> >Woeger) I realized that I lost most of my time in the second lesmo