rec.autos.simulators

F1 2002 early news

bill

F1 2002 early news

by bill » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 03:29:04

$500 Is a bit steep Randy but if you could persuade sierra to make GPL2 I
have no dought it would be a far better seller than GPL1 maybe $100 is a
more realistic figure! ask the people that go to vroc and see the response
and then send all the e-mails to Vivendi:)) hey I even went out and bought
Nascar2002 just because you make the best racing sims in the world and I do
not like oval racing. I just admire the way that Papyrus put the sims
together. Go on make GPL2 you know you want two:)
Jan Verschuere

F1 2002 early news

by Jan Verschuere » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 03:49:11

So GPL2 or Papyrus CART sim = $500 per licence.... ok, are you taking
pre-orders? ;-)

Seriously, I don't see why not... the GPL demo blew me away, I just *had* to
have both it and a PC capable of running it. Money doesn't really enter the
equation in that situation, at least it doesn't for me.

Silly idea perhaps, but why not have a credit option? -People borrow money
to by a new TV or DVD all the time.

Jan.
=---

Tony Rickar

F1 2002 early news

by Tony Rickar » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 04:13:08


> > Leaving a market of about 10,000 hard core sim racers who'd never have a
> > single title made for them. EVER>

> Not for $50.  For $500 they could.  Which is probably less than they'd pay
> for a good FF wheel, great graphics card, and the premium for a fast system
> over an average one.  But they'd never EVER pay that much for the piece of
> software for which they would spend all that extra cash on hardware, would
> they?

Paying a premium for that ultimate sim for *** RASers has been mentioned a
few times - even to the tune of paying a group of programmers up front to do it.

It needs a change in mentatility from the 90s when we had steady releases that
increased the experience in reasonable leaps (e.g. graphically, aurally,
features and of course physics) For me the evolution went something like
Indy500, GP1, ICR, Nascar, ICR2/GP2, N2, F1RS, GPL in the space of about 8
years. So pretty close to one title a year, and typically each big release
replaced the previous (i.e. one sim at a time)

In 1992 GP1 cost 45 (approx $65) as a premium price Microprose title - 10 years
on premium priced games cost 30 ($42)

Now 45 represented pretty stunning value for a year's entertainment.

GPL cost 30 in 1998. Judging by previous experience I would have expected it to
have been superceded by 2000. It has shared a place with other sims GP3, F1RC,
F12001, Rally Trophy since but is still a primary piece of entertainment,
largely due to the great work by the sim community.

Arguably had GPL been further developed with other eras it would have been the
only sim for me - as it provides the best engine for feel for my own PC,
contoller & driving style (cough) setup.

In which case the investments in the EA sims (every few weeks) GP3 & 2000, F1RC
etc. could have been channeled into one "monster" Sim. Each individual purchase
looking for that leap forward which seemed sadly lacking.

To conclude if I really thought a sim was going to be that good to last for
three years with an open design to allow quality modifications I should be
prepared to pay the sum total of all the other sims I won't buy during that
period because it is so good.

Obviously this has an element of risk - what if somebody else produces something
better and I have used up my budget? - though experience suggests the number of
*** racing sims is limited to say the least.

Somehow (as Randy states) it is easier to justify a new graphics card &
processor every year or so, plus it seems easier to fork out for a new steering
wheel purely for ones sim racing hobby than the cost of a game.

Time for change in approach?

Tony

Goy Larse

F1 2002 early news

by Goy Larse » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 04:33:53





> >>Guys, I was speaking to an EA rep who tried to tell me that F12002 is

> > being

> >>'dumbed down' a bit over its predecessor.  I found this remark quite
> >>disturbing but he claimed that EA had received lots of complaints from
> >>people saying that the game is too hard to control - especially with a
> >>keyboard.  Has anyone else heard this?  Please say it isn't so..!

> > KEYBOARD??
> > To properly use a keyboard to play AN F1 SIM, one must shove the keyboard up
> > one's ass. Good Grief. WTF?? KEYBOARDS??
> > Tell your EA rep to blow it out his ass, if they dumb this thing down it's
> > back to GPCrammond.

> Where's that Papy F1 sim when we really need it??

Right where it should be hopefully, in the dust bin, what we need is a
proper AussieV8 sim, with changeable weather and Bathurst, ***y Max
and Bernie show, who needs it anyways

Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy

http://www.racesimcentral.net/
http://www.racesimcentral.net/

"Animation isn't the illusion of life; it is life"
--Chuck Jones (1912-2002)--

Goy Larse

F1 2002 early news

by Goy Larse » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 04:35:05




> > Leaving a market of about 10,000 hard core sim racers who'd never have a
> > single title made for them. EVER>

> Not for $50.  For $500 they could.  Which is probably less than they'd pay
> for a good FF wheel, great graphics card, and the premium for a fast system
> over an average one.  But they'd never EVER pay that much for the piece of
> software for which they would spend all that extra cash on hardware, would
> they?

For a proper AussieV8 sim I might....:-)

Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy

http://www.theuspits.com
http://www.teammirage.com

"Animation isn't the illusion of life; it is life"
--Chuck Jones (1912-2002)--

John Pancoas

F1 2002 early news

by John Pancoas » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 04:49:29

  Actually, problem would most likely be not as simple as a high priced sim.
Getting distributors to carry it would be a pain I bet.  Who's going to risk
something like this, sitting on their shelves, taking up space that the
latest fps title that can't be kept on the shelves enough, could be
occupying ?

  Other ways to distribute of course, but retailers dictate a lot of market
actions too.

-John





> >>Leaving a market of about 10,000 hard core sim racers who'd never have a
> >>single title made for them. EVER>

> > Not for $50.  For $500 they could.  Which is probably less than they'd
pay
> > for a good FF wheel, great graphics card, and the premium for a fast
system
> > over an average one.  But they'd never EVER pay that much for the piece
of
> > software for which they would spend all that extra cash on hardware,
would
> > they?

> If it's the kind of ground-breaking work that GPL was on it's initial
> release, I bet many would.

> --

> Fester

> "Beware the leader who bangs the drums of war in order to whip the
> citizenry into a patriotic fervor, for patriotism is indeed a
> double-edged sword. It both emboldens the ***, just as it narrows the
> mind.  And when the drums of war have reached a fever pitch and the
> *** boils with hate and the mind has closed, the leader will have no
> need in seizing the rights of the citizenry. Rather, the citizenry,
> infused with fear and blinded by patriotism, will offer up all of their
> rights unto the leader and gladly so. How do I know? For this is what I
> have done. And I am Caesar."   -- Julius Caesar

Borut Srebotni

F1 2002 early news

by Borut Srebotni » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 04:51:05

do

i bought a second copy of GPL just to support the makers of that sim :-)

b.

Tony Rickar

F1 2002 early news

by Tony Rickar » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 05:07:32

"John Pancoast" wrote

Yes, I would expect the likely customers of a specialist premium priced sim
would happily use the net as a means of obtaining and purchasing the software.
Be it by download or mail order. It is not a title to attract casual buyers in
EB.

Tony

ayemdeefanREM..

F1 2002 early news

by ayemdeefanREM.. » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 06:17:19

On Wed, 20 Mar 2002 20:07:32 GMT, "Tony Rickard"


>Yes, I would expect the likely customers of a specialist premium priced sim
>would happily use the net as a means of obtaining and purchasing the software.
>Be it by download or mail order. It is not a title to attract casual buyers in
>EB.

If the sim is gonna cost $500, the game would definitely get pirated
like crazy.  I mean, with it costing $50, people are more inclined to
buy it.  As great a sim GPL is, I remember seeing 10+ copies of it at
my local Staples/OD for $9.99.  At that price it didn't even sell.
Ronald Stoeh

F1 2002 early news

by Ronald Stoeh » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 06:15:21






> > >>Guys, I was speaking to an EA rep who tried to tell me that F12002 is

> > > being

> > >>'dumbed down' a bit over its predecessor.  I found this remark quite
> > >>disturbing but he claimed that EA had received lots of complaints from
> > >>people saying that the game is too hard to control - especially with a
> > >>keyboard.  Has anyone else heard this?  Please say it isn't so..!

> > > KEYBOARD??
> > > To properly use a keyboard to play AN F1 SIM, one must shove the keyboard up
> > > one's ass. Good Grief. WTF?? KEYBOARDS??
> > > Tell your EA rep to blow it out his ass, if they dumb this thing down it's
> > > back to GPCrammond.

> > Where's that Papy F1 sim when we really need it??

> Right where it should be hopefully, in the dust bin, what we need is a
> proper AussieV8 sim, with changeable weather and Bathurst, ***y Max
> and Bernie show, who needs it anyways

Ok, let me jump in here:

CART!

--
l8er
ronny

Your mouse has moved. Windows must be restarted for the change
to take effect. Reboot now?

rik zeppeli

F1 2002 early news

by rik zeppeli » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 06:21:27


Should read:

CART!!

Joe Marque

F1 2002 early news

by Joe Marque » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 06:44:07

Since countless console gamers have paid $500 (probably more adjusted for
inflation) for mediocre hockey and football games (by "upgrading" every year
from NHL 92-02 and Madden 92-02), I'd be more than willing to pay a few
hundred bucks for the "ultimate" simulation.  It would have to be more
versatile than just one genre like GPL2.  I want the GPL physics engine and
HUGE selection of tracks (ovals and road) and cars.  It's the cars where
many of us differ.  I want GT racing primarily (just loving that FREE ALMS
mod for F1 2001) and I'll dabble with Formula racing and Nascar.  Others may
want CART or TOCA.  So why not do it all and license it as various packages
over the course of several years?

The basic package could be one car set and small track set (say GT cars and
12 tracks) for $75 plus yearly fees for add-on cars, physics/graphics
enhancements, etc.  The advanced package is 2 car sets with a bigger track
pack (GT and Nascar with 30 tracks) for $150 plus the yearly fee.  The last
package is the super *** with 4 or 5 car sets and the jumbo track pack
(GT, F1, Nascar, TOCA or CART with 50 tracks) for $250 plus the yearly fee.
Who knows it just might work.

--
Joe Marques


ymenar

F1 2002 early news

by ymenar » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 07:09:46


> Not for $50.  For $500 they could.  Which is probably less than they'd pay
> for a good FF wheel, great graphics card, and the premium for a fast
system
> over an average one.  But they'd never EVER pay that much for the piece of
> software for which they would spend all that extra cash on hardware, would
> they?

If it's an brown-bag open-source simulator similar in type to FS2002 by
Papyrus, why not?

It's not like there never has been any market research on that.

--
-- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard>
-- http://www.ymenard.8m.com/
-- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez
Corporation - helping America into the New World...

ymenar

F1 2002 early news

by ymenar » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 07:10:50


>   Actually, problem would most likely be not as simple as a high priced
sim.
> Getting distributors to carry it would be a pain I bet.  Who's going to
risk
> something like this, sitting on their shelves, taking up space that the
> latest fps title that can't be kept on the shelves enough, could be
> occupying ?

Well, if a company ever plans to really release a 500$ simulator for the
*** simracer, online/mail distribution is the only way to go.

--
-- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard>
-- http://www.racesimcentral.net/
-- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez
Corporation - helping America into the New World...

ymenar

F1 2002 early news

by ymenar » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 07:13:12


> If the sim is gonna cost $500, the game would definitely get pirated
> like crazy.

Just make it impossible to go online unless you have a correct CD-Key.  You
know, like every other Papyrus product on the market since Nascar Racing 3.

Include the SDK, uncompressed textures, tools, etc.. etc.. and the software
might span on more then a CD.  This already, cuts back on the warez
situation.  Yes, it's known that kids don't much warez (I say normally) when
the game is over 500megs in space.

--
-- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard>
-- http://www.ymenard.8m.com/
-- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez
Corporation - helping America into the New World...


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