rec.autos.simulators

by **Gavin Thoma** » Sun, 30 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Hello people.

OK, I'm get a serious survey going here. Basically, I'm intrigued in peoples
opinions on GP3 based on what experience they have had with other sims in
the past. Basically, I suppose the crux of it is has anyone who plays/played
GPL actually said they think GP3 is more realistic.

First, lets get my background out of the way. I've played GP1 (about a
weekends worth), GP2 (brought that one), F1RS and GPL. Out of those, I feel
GPL is far superior. My flatemate has brought GP3, and I've tried it a bit
as well. I have to admit that I thought the weather was quite impressive in
GP3 but thats it. Graphics just don't seem right. The physics model just
seems 'wrong' (taking into account that I have more downforce etc).
Basically, I'm sticking to GPL, and GP3 is a dissappointment, given it's
meant to have been in development for 4 years.

Anyway, my view out of the way, heres my question.

Basically, I would like as many people to group themselves into the
following catogaries.

A) - I've played GP2, never played GPL, got GP3 and think its great, really
realistic.
B) - I've played GP2, played GPL, got GP3 and think its great, really
realistic. I think its more realistic than GPL.
C) - I've played GP2, played GPL, got GP3 and think its great, really
realistic. I think its not as realistic as GPL, but good anyway.
D) - I've played GP2, played GPL, got GP3 and think its great, really
realistic. I thought GPL was too hard.

E) - Played GPL, got GP3 and think its overatted, but still pretty good.
F) - Played GPL, got GP3 and think its overatted, but GPL is better, though
GP3 ain't bad.
G) - Played GPL, got GP3 and think its overrated, but GPL is worse.

H) - Played GPL, got GP3, and think its not good, GPL is far superior.
I) - Played GPL, got GP3 but won't play much as GPL is far superior. But
GP3 has some nice touches, like fancy weather.

J) - F1-2000 is better than GP3, but GPL is better.
K) - F1-2000 is better than GP3, GPL is not good
L) - GP3 is better than F1-2000

Basically, I'm a type (I) person.

Now, why I have produced these groups. Well, I just get this nagging feeling
that the people who really like GP3 are in the (A) or (D) group. It seems
that some people in the D group slag of GPL as being to hard, but some just
accept that they didn't have the time to practice it. Whereas, most people
who don't like GP3 are in the F, H or I group. I doubt anyone is in the G
group.

I'm saying that there is not anything wrong with some people not liking GPL,
some people just don't have the time to practice like you need to for GPL,
and GP3 is a better product for them. I just don't understand some of the
people who say GP3 is better than GPL from a physics point of view. I'm just
wondering how many of these people actually played GPL, or in fact they
did, and it was because it was too hard, they think the physics are not
accurate.

Look, I'm not trying to start a flame war. I'm just intrigued by peoples
backgrounds with sims, and how that influences their opinion of GP3.

Gavin 'Sharknose' Thomas

by **mrace** » Sun, 30 Jul 2000 04:00:00

J.

> Hello people.

> OK, I'm get a serious survey going here. Basically, I'm intrigued in peoples
> opinions on GP3 based on what experience they have had with other sims in
> the past. Basically, I suppose the crux of it is has anyone who plays/played
> GPL actually said they think GP3 is more realistic.

> First, lets get my background out of the way. I've played GP1 (about a
> weekends worth), GP2 (brought that one), F1RS and GPL. Out of those, I feel
> GPL is far superior. My flatemate has brought GP3, and I've tried it a bit
> as well. I have to admit that I thought the weather was quite impressive in
> GP3 but thats it. Graphics just don't seem right. The physics model just
> seems 'wrong' (taking into account that I have more downforce etc).
> Basically, I'm sticking to GPL, and GP3 is a dissappointment, given it's
> meant to have been in development for 4 years.

> Anyway, my view out of the way, heres my question.

> Basically, I would like as many people to group themselves into the
> following catogaries.

> A) - I've played GP2, never played GPL, got GP3 and think its great, really
> realistic.
> B) - I've played GP2, played GPL, got GP3 and think its great, really
> realistic. I think its more realistic than GPL.
> C) - I've played GP2, played GPL, got GP3 and think its great, really
> realistic. I think its not as realistic as GPL, but good anyway.
> D) - I've played GP2, played GPL, got GP3 and think its great, really
> realistic. I thought GPL was too hard.

> E) - Played GPL, got GP3 and think its overatted, but still pretty good.
> F) - Played GPL, got GP3 and think its overatted, but GPL is better, though
> GP3 ain't bad.
> G) - Played GPL, got GP3 and think its overrated, but GPL is worse.

> H) - Played GPL, got GP3, and think its not good, GPL is far superior.
> I) - Played GPL, got GP3 but won't play much as GPL is far superior. But
> GP3 has some nice touches, like fancy weather.

> J) - F1-2000 is better than GP3, but GPL is better.
> K) - F1-2000 is better than GP3, GPL is not good
> L) - GP3 is better than F1-2000

> Basically, I'm a type (I) person.

> Now, why I have produced these groups. Well, I just get this nagging feeling
> that the people who really like GP3 are in the (A) or (D) group. It seems
> that some people in the D group slag of GPL as being to hard, but some just
> accept that they didn't have the time to practice it. Whereas, most people
> who don't like GP3 are in the F, H or I group. I doubt anyone is in the G
> group.

> I'm saying that there is not anything wrong with some people not liking GPL,
> some people just don't have the time to practice like you need to for GPL,
> and GP3 is a better product for them. I just don't understand some of the
> people who say GP3 is better than GPL from a physics point of view. I'm just
> wondering how many of these people actually played GPL, or in fact they
> did, and it was because it was too hard, they think the physics are not
> accurate.

> Look, I'm not trying to start a flame war. I'm just intrigued by peoples
> backgrounds with sims, and how that influences their opinion of GP3.

> Gavin 'Sharknose' Thomas

by **Phil Le** » Sun, 30 Jul 2000 04:00:00

I'm a type (I) person although I would add that I played GP2 a lot.

My background in sims really started with GP2, ICR2 and Nascar Racing. I
gave up on these for 3-4 years and got back into sim racing in September
last year when I bought a new PC and GPL. Since then I have bought Nascar 3
(kept), GP500 (kept), RC2000 (kept), NFS PU (kept), SBK2000 (returned) and
GP3.

All the sims listed above which I kept run well on my PC. I returned SBK
2000 because I couldn't control it with the range of controllers I have. Of
the sims that I have kept I can't remember the last time I fired up anything
other than GPL.

I bought GP3 on Friday. I did not try the Warez version, infact I have
never downloaded any pirated software. I have read a few of the posts here
about GP3 but haven't read most of them, mainly because there were so many
and also because I wanted to come at GP3 with an open mind.

I have spent some of last night and most of today driving GP3 and have come
to the conclusion that I will be returning GP3 to Game tomorrow. This is
because I feel that I will not get 30 worth of time with it.

The main reason for this is that despite a lot of time spent tweaking the
game settings, particularly the graphics and controllers settings, I cannot
get it to run well on my PC. I have come to the conclusion that my system
is not up to running it without a large amount of slowmo when near more than
1 car, particularly in the rain. The lowest processor occupancy I was able
to get during a race was 80% when running completely on my own. As soon as
I got near a car this went up to 100% and when there were 2 or more cars
this went over 100%, inducing slowmo. The highest occupancy I saw was at
San Marino in the wet when a car span in front of me. At this point the
occupancy was 280% and the sim practically ground to a halt.

I never felt in control of the car, probably because, in my opinion, it
doesn't provide the same visual, audio and force feedback that GPL does. At
no point did I feel immersed in the sim.

I was running GP3 at a resolution of 800x600 with all mirror textures
switched off, trackside objects set to medium and in the cards.txt file,
bilinear filtering and low resolution clouds enabled. I also tried all the
other options given listed in the readme file for tweaking the graphics
settings. FYI my PC is a P2 400 with 128Mb RAM, V3 2000, SB Live! 1024 and
both an Act Labs Force RS and an LWFF.

If anyone wants to query whether there is a problem with my PC, they are
more than welcome to do so, but I am sure that there is not. I base this on
the fact that I can run GPL at 1024x768 with a full field and get 36 fps all
the time except for the first few moments of a race. The lowest fps reading
I get is 28. Also the other sims that I have listed all play very
satisfactorily.

I feel that I have given GP3 a fair crack of the whip and really wanted to
enjoy it but sadly I didn't. I expect if I had a faster processor and a
better graphics card I would have liked it better. Unfortunately GP3 has
not given me any desire to spend time with it. When I got GPL I had that
desire almost instantly. I knew that I had to learn to drive it properly.
After 10 months of ownership I still have a lot to learn. I'm afraid that
because I don't get this feeling from GP3 I won't be playing it very much
and so feel justified in returning it, getting a refund and saving my 30 to
put towards Nascar 4, Nascar Heat and Mercedes Benz truck racing, all of
which I will probably buy and try.

Cheers

Phil

--
F1 GPL Handicap: +62.32 secs
F2 GPL Handicap: +149.80 secs

St Eldred's Cup: -8.13 secs

http://www.youpies.co.uk

by **HJ Ventur** » Sun, 30 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Z) F1 2000 is better than GP3. And you cannot compare GPL with these games
!!!

by **Jaso** » Sun, 30 Jul 2000 04:00:00

G.)

by **Pierre PAPA DOC Legra** » Sun, 30 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Yea Im Z as well....hehe.

PAPA DOC

PS I said it before and its still true...(or maybe I agree with
it..umm) Grand Prix Legends is the Flanker 1.5 of sims...awesome.

>Z) F1 2000 is better than GP3. And you cannot compare GPL with these games
>!!!

>> Hello people.

>> OK, I'm get a serious survey going here. Basically, I'm intrigued in
>peoples
>> opinions on GP3 based on what experience they have had with other sims in
>> the past. Basically, I suppose the crux of it is has anyone who
>plays/played
>> GPL actually said they think GP3 is more realistic.

>> First, lets get my background out of the way. I've played GP1 (about a
>> weekends worth), GP2 (brought that one), F1RS and GPL. Out of those, I
>feel
>> GPL is far superior. My flatemate has brought GP3, and I've tried it a bit
>> as well. I have to admit that I thought the weather was quite impressive
>in
>> GP3 but thats it. Graphics just don't seem right. The physics model just
>> seems 'wrong' (taking into account that I have more downforce etc).
>> Basically, I'm sticking to GPL, and GP3 is a dissappointment, given it's
>> meant to have been in development for 4 years.

>> Anyway, my view out of the way, heres my question.

>> Basically, I would like as many people to group themselves into the
>> following catogaries.

>> A) - I've played GP2, never played GPL, got GP3 and think its great,
>really
>> realistic.
>> B) - I've played GP2, played GPL, got GP3 and think its great, really
>> realistic. I think its more realistic than GPL.
>> C) - I've played GP2, played GPL, got GP3 and think its great, really
>> realistic. I think its not as realistic as GPL, but good anyway.
>> D) - I've played GP2, played GPL, got GP3 and think its great, really
>> realistic. I thought GPL was too hard.

>> E) - Played GPL, got GP3 and think its overatted, but still pretty good.
>> F) - Played GPL, got GP3 and think its overatted, but GPL is better,
>though
>> GP3 ain't bad.
>> G) - Played GPL, got GP3 and think its overrated, but GPL is worse.

>> H) - Played GPL, got GP3, and think its not good, GPL is far superior.
>> I) - Played GPL, got GP3 but won't play much as GPL is far superior. But
>> GP3 has some nice touches, like fancy weather.

>> J) - F1-2000 is better than GP3, but GPL is better.
>> K) - F1-2000 is better than GP3, GPL is not good
>> L) - GP3 is better than F1-2000

>> Basically, I'm a type (I) person.

>> Now, why I have produced these groups. Well, I just get this nagging
>feeling
>> that the people who really like GP3 are in the (A) or (D) group. It seems
>> that some people in the D group slag of GPL as being to hard, but some
>just
>> accept that they didn't have the time to practice it. Whereas, most people
>> who don't like GP3 are in the F, H or I group. I doubt anyone is in the G
>> group.

>> I'm saying that there is not anything wrong with some people not liking
>GPL,
>> some people just don't have the time to practice like you need to for GPL,
>> and GP3 is a better product for them. I just don't understand some of the
>> people who say GP3 is better than GPL from a physics point of view. I'm
>just
>> wondering how many of these people actually played GPL, or in fact they
>> did, and it was because it was too hard, they think the physics are not
>> accurate.

>> Look, I'm not trying to start a flame war. I'm just intrigued by peoples
>> backgrounds with sims, and how that influences their opinion of GP3.

>> Gavin 'Sharknose' Thomas

Pierre PAPA DOC Legrand
Flanker Target
GPL Crash Dummy
Video Card Wizard
www.papadoc.net
FALCON 4 Benchmarks
Rants, Bullshit and Reviews

by **David Butte** » Sun, 30 Jul 2000 04:00:00

M) Got GP2 and GP3 and GPL, loved GP2, love GPL now, quite like GP3 but
am disappointed with lack of advances over GP2. Not even close to GPL.

--
David. (GPLRank handicap: -3.01)
"After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll,
really."
(Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh)

by **Phil Le** » Sun, 30 Jul 2000 04:00:00

I'm using the latest 1.05 drivers.

Cheers

Phil

> > FYI my PC is a P2 400 with 128Mb RAM, V3 2000, SB Live! 1024 and
> >both an Act Labs Force RS and an LWFF.

> 3dfx drivers? They need to be the latest, or it will be slow.

by **Gavin Thoma** » Sun, 30 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Interesting analogy with Flanker 1.5.

Umm, I can see why you may not wish to compare GPL with either F1-2000 or
GP3, because its from a different era.

Prehaps.

But they way I look at it, the realism of a sim can be judged to a certain
extent by how much of a subset of Newtonian Physics it implements, IMHO.

From what I've read, GPL is meant to contain a large subset of Newtonian
physics, wheres GP3 apparently (from what I've read) contains a smaller
subset. I can't comment on F1-2000, as I haven't tried it.

Now, I'm not saying there is anything wrong with this, there is obviously a
market for this kinda game, but your *** simmer spoilt on GPL is bound
to be a little dissappointed.

Gavin 'Sharknose' Thomas

> Yea Im Z as well....hehe.

> PAPA DOC

> PS I said it before and its still true...(or maybe I agree with
> it..umm) Grand Prix Legends is the Flanker 1.5 of sims...awesome.

> >Z) F1 2000 is better than GP3. And you cannot compare GPL with these
games
> >!!!

> >> Hello people.

> >> OK, I'm get a serious survey going here. Basically, I'm intrigued in
> >peoples
> >> opinions on GP3 based on what experience they have had with other sims
in
> >> the past. Basically, I suppose the crux of it is has anyone who
> >plays/played
> >> GPL actually said they think GP3 is more realistic.

> >> First, lets get my background out of the way. I've played GP1 (about a
> >> weekends worth), GP2 (brought that one), F1RS and GPL. Out of those, I
> >feel
> >> GPL is far superior. My flatemate has brought GP3, and I've tried it a
bit
> >> as well. I have to admit that I thought the weather was quite
impressive
> >in
> >> GP3 but thats it. Graphics just don't seem right. The physics model
just
> >> seems 'wrong' (taking into account that I have more downforce etc).
> >> Basically, I'm sticking to GPL, and GP3 is a dissappointment, given
it's
> >> meant to have been in development for 4 years.

> >> Anyway, my view out of the way, heres my question.

> >> Basically, I would like as many people to group themselves into the
> >> following catogaries.

> >> A) - I've played GP2, never played GPL, got GP3 and think its great,
> >really
> >> realistic.
> >> B) - I've played GP2, played GPL, got GP3 and think its great, really
> >> realistic. I think its more realistic than GPL.
> >> C) - I've played GP2, played GPL, got GP3 and think its great, really
> >> realistic. I think its not as realistic as GPL, but good anyway.
> >> D) - I've played GP2, played GPL, got GP3 and think its great, really
> >> realistic. I thought GPL was too hard.

> >> E) - Played GPL, got GP3 and think its overatted, but still pretty
good.
> >> F) - Played GPL, got GP3 and think its overatted, but GPL is better,
> >though
> >> GP3 ain't bad.
> >> G) - Played GPL, got GP3 and think its overrated, but GPL is worse.

> >> H) - Played GPL, got GP3, and think its not good, GPL is far superior.
> >> I) - Played GPL, got GP3 but won't play much as GPL is far superior.
But
> >> GP3 has some nice touches, like fancy weather.

> >> J) - F1-2000 is better than GP3, but GPL is better.
> >> K) - F1-2000 is better than GP3, GPL is not good
> >> L) - GP3 is better than F1-2000

> >> Basically, I'm a type (I) person.

> >> Now, why I have produced these groups. Well, I just get this nagging
> >feeling
> >> that the people who really like GP3 are in the (A) or (D) group. It
seems
> >> that some people in the D group slag of GPL as being to hard, but some
> >just
> >> accept that they didn't have the time to practice it. Whereas, most
people
> >> who don't like GP3 are in the F, H or I group. I doubt anyone is in the
G
> >> group.

> >> I'm saying that there is not anything wrong with some people not liking
> >GPL,
> >> some people just don't have the time to practice like you need to for
GPL,
> >> and GP3 is a better product for them. I just don't understand some of
the
> >> people who say GP3 is better than GPL from a physics point of view. I'm
> >just
> >> wondering how many of these people actually played GPL, or in fact
they
> >> did, and it was because it was too hard, they think the physics are not
> >> accurate.

> >> Look, I'm not trying to start a flame war. I'm just intrigued by
peoples
> >> backgrounds with sims, and how that influences their opinion of GP3.

> >> Gavin 'Sharknose' Thomas

> Pierre PAPA DOC Legrand
> Flanker Target
> GPL Crash Dummy
> Video Card Wizard
> www.papadoc.net
> FALCON 4 Benchmarks
> Rants, Bullshit and Reviews

by **Joe6** » Mon, 31 Jul 2000 04:00:00

>C) - I've played GP2, played GPL, got GP3 and think its great, really
>realistic. I think its not as realistic as GPL, but good anyway.

C.

Joe McGinn
_____________________
Radical Entertainment

by **pjgt..** » Mon, 31 Jul 2000 04:00:00

> Basically, I would like as many people to group themselves into the
> following catogaries.

> A) - I've played GP2, never played GPL, got GP3 and think its great,
> really
> realistic.
> B) - I've played GP2, played GPL, got GP3 and think its great, really
> realistic. I think its more realistic than GPL.
> C) - I've played GP2, played GPL, got GP3 and think its great, really
> realistic. I think its not as realistic as GPL, but good anyway.
> D) - I've played GP2, played GPL, got GP3 and think its great, really
> realistic. I thought GPL was too hard.
> E) - Played GPL, got GP3 and think its overatted, but still pretty
> good.
> F) - Played GPL, got GP3 and think its overatted, but GPL is better,
> though
> GP3 ain't bad.
> G) - Played GPL, got GP3 and think its overrated, but GPL is worse.
> H) - Played GPL, got GP3, and think its not good, GPL is far superior.
> I) - Played GPL, got GP3 but won't play much as GPL is far superior.
> But
> GP3 has some nice touches, like fancy weather.
> J) - F1-2000 is better than GP3, but GPL is better.
> K) - F1-2000 is better than GP3, GPL is not good
> L) - GP3 is better than F1-2000

None of your options describe me accurately.

My preferred option would be:

I've played GP2, played GPL, got GP3 and think its great, really
realistic (for a modern F1 car sim). I think its *as* realistic as GPL
(bearing in mind GPL simulates a different type of F1 car and era).

The closest is either B or C.

I loved GP2, it was way ahead of its time.
I love GPL, it was also way ahead of its time.
I love GP3, IMHO it is now the best modern F1 sim.

Just my opinion......I'm not interested in any petty flame wars (I'm too
busy racing).

8-)

*Peter* - http://www.cix.co.uk/~peterpc/home.html

by **Peter Hoope** » Fri, 04 Aug 2000 04:00:00

I'd go along with this one as well.

If I was going to go with one of the ones outlined though it would be:-

C

PH

rec.autos.simulators

GPL vs GP3 vs Others survey.

GPL vs GP3 vs Others survey.

GPL vs GP3 vs Others survey.

GPL vs GP3 vs Others survey.

GPL vs GP3 vs Others survey.

GPL vs GP3 vs Others survey.

GPL vs GP3 vs Others survey.

GPL vs GP3 vs Others survey.

GPL vs GP3 vs Others survey.

GPL vs GP3 vs Others survey.

GPL vs GP3 vs Others survey.

GPL vs GP3 vs Others survey.

GPL vs GP3 vs Others survey.