rec.autos.simulators

"Now, I don't want to get off on a rant here....."
...but what the hell is the government doing telling people what we
can
and cannot see at sporting events? Does the governtment really have
so little to do anymore, that they have to turn they're attention to
trying to regulate what's on billboards?  Just what the hell is going
on here?
When did the government take care of the drug problem?  When did it
solve
the high crime rate?  When were all the homeless people given homes,
and all the starving children fed?  When did the government take care
of the problems of the country, educate the children, and become a
leader
in world peace?  I must've missed it, because now they've moved on to
the petty bullshit things like cigarette advertising at sporting
events?
The hard, simple truth of the matter is, there's a bunch of dumb ass
politicians in office who want to STAY in office, so they're going to
service a group who promises their votes if they'll carry out their
vested intrests, and the politicians will go whichever way the wind
plows so they can continue to follow a useless lifestyle, soaking up
the money of the taxpayers while sitting on their fat asses.
The political "***busters" claim they're doing this "for the
children".
Hey, I've been following NASCAR Winston Cup racing for all of my life.
I'm 23 years old, and I've never had the urge to smoke a Winston.  By
the same token, I've watched the Spam car race for the last three or
so years, and it's never inspired me to eat a goddamn can of Spam.  Do
you see where I'm going with this?
Where did our goverenment take the wrong turn off of the "good of the
people" yellow brick road and go carening down the highway to hell?
Well, a while back.......okay, so I got off track.
The point of the matter is, there is no larger a warning light to have
gone off since Tipper***and the Washington Housewives fought Frank
Zappa over putting warning labels on records.  The government has NO
BUSINESS WHATSOEVER telling the tobacco industry wheather they can
sponser race cars or not.  It is a direct violation of the
constitution,
and, more to the point, it's STUPID!!!!!!  Just what the hell are our
tax dollars doing being spent on running "The Marlboro man out of town
riding Joe Camel"?  Who the hell voted for this, and why haven't they
taken their medication?
Here's the deal, folks.  When the government has solved all the
financial,
educational, housing and employment problems,  moved the world
towards universal peace, and made a college education finanacially
available to every person in this county, THEN we'll sit down and talk
about this situation.
Even thinking of dealing with it beforehand is nothing but ludicrus,
and a slap in the face of every american who voted in the last
election.
Bill Clinton, get your hands out of NASCAR, and back into your
pants.
"Of course, that's just my opinon.  I could be wrong."

Brandon Reed
--
Number 6

                Every Other Man Productions
                                      Reed Racing & Enginering
http://www.***highway.net/~blreed/
"Save the Texas Prarie Chicken!"

Racing will survive this very well.  We don't need RJR.

The tobacco industry just admitted:

1.  That cigarettes are ***ive.
2.  That they have caused the public _billions_ of dollars in health care
costs.
3.  That too many children smoke.

Why would we want our beloved sport identified with this product?

I'm an avid race fan, former road racer, NASCAR2 fanatic.  Racing will
survive this very well.  The fans are there, the sponsors will come.  We
don't need RJR.

                        bob

Because it's been paying a pretty fair chunk of change to support our
beloved sport for over 25 years now.

Cigarettes are a legal product, that can be sold without a
prescription to the vast majority of viewers of NASCAR. The government
shouldn't proscribe the advertising of a legal product merely because
SOME viewers are not old enough to buy and use it. Should we ban
automobile ads for the same reason? After all, SOME of the audience
won't be legally allowed to buy and use the cars being advertised, AND
cars kill lots of people every year... And the auto-makers have worked
for years to make cars ***ive... :-)  <-- NB

---Jim Sokoloff

--
PolePosition#3

My Unofficial Dale Earnhardt Fan Page:
http://www.racesimcentral.net/

The Dale Earnhardt Fan Ring:
http://www.racesimcentral.net/

"If you don't believe, you don't belong." -- Alan Kulwicki's Credo

Tell ya what. When I drive my car home late at night, I had
rather meet a cigarette smoker who had just smoked one too
many that the Bud-Man who had gone one drink over the line.

I think we should outlaw ALL non-politically correct things
as sponsors in our sporting events. If we could just get
Opra, Seinfeld, Married with Children, AOL, and the Gun Cantrol
Lobby to hook up with a car owner or two, now THAT would be
some great racing.

 ** Please remove NOSPAM from my address to mail me **
 ** CARMAGEDDON ( the best game ever created )
 ** See for yourself: http://www.interplay.com/carma/

that?.....just smoke and you KNOW!..it's that simple

What's this?..who caused the public billions of dollars?...what's going to
happen if and when they make cigarrettes illegal...people will find a way
to smoke...it's ***ive remember?....Don't try to tell me a lifetime
smoker is going to jump up and shout "WOW this stuff is ***ive , and I
only know this because it's just been announced!!...whewwhew...I'm just a
lamb led to slaughter!!"
Obviously some jerks are going to take advantage of the inevitable "class
actions" that are to come.

Talk to them ,ground 'em ,spank their ass,BE a PARENT DAMN IT!!!

Whatever...I feel no particular way about it , If I dont' blame them then
why SHOULD I care who the sponsor is.

You'll pardon the  tone of my reply , as I feel passionately about placing
blame where it belongs in a world where nothing is ever the individual's
fault or responsibility , and an idiot with a good lawer can leach off a
good hard working person's life earnings and literally change the direction
of that life and family for the worse becuse they don't FEEL like working
for their own keep!!!

Example....remember the woman who burned her dumbass self with hot coffee
bought at McDonalds?....$22,000,000.00.........that's no typo....I could go
on for an hour with examples of non-responsibe idiots who feel the world
owe's them early retirement.

I am a former smoker and I don't want to increase my odds of death so I
quit....If I do someday croak early as a result of my former years of
smoking ,well....that's the breaks is'nt it...it's my own damn fault since
I knew the risks going in 13 YEARS ago.

And , no, I've never been sued but we all live with the threat of it, if
you don't make a concious effort to be aware of it and try to prepare for
it.

RaiderMac

I'm not arguing against your point as I happen to agree with it, but I
hate it when inanimate objects get blamed when it is the people operating
them who need to take the responsibility. And whilst we're at it, yes it
is the people who smoke who are at fault, not the tobacco adverts.

Cheers,
Richard

---Jim

Jerry Morelock

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That was in the past and of course still the case today, but NASCAR
doesn't need support from an industry that has knowingly, increased the
***iveness of their cigarettes, used additives that were harmful to
users and withheld research information about the harmful effects of
cigarettes. For years the tobacco industry has denied that their
products were harmful to the American people and even to Congress, until
recently when they had to admit to the contrary.

   Cars or cigarettes, as inanimate objects, will not kill anyone. If
someone were to operate a car properly, it wouldn't hurt anyone. If
someone were to use a cigarette properly, they would almost be
guaranteed to become ***ive to a product that causes cancer,
emphezyma and other respiratory problems, unless of course you're Bill
Clinton and don't inhale.My point here is about deception and how the
tobacco industry has deceived the public about the harmful effects of
cigarettes while making millions. If they had published their findings
about the harmful effects and it's ***iveness 30 years ago when
they(tabacco companies) did their studies and people still chose to
smoke in spite of the findings, then I would agree that it's the smokers
fault. But when the industry knowingly lied about and concealed their
findings, then these companies must be held accountable. The recent
court decision is not only about direct advertising towards kids but
also about making the industry responsible for the harm they have
inflicted on the public by withholding information and lying to them.

Steve

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<HTML>

<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>&nbsp;</BLOCKQUOTE>
&nbsp;
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>

<P>>Why would we want our beloved sport identified with this product?

<P>Because it's been paying a pretty fair chunk of change to support our
<BR>beloved sport for over 25 years now.</BLOCKQUOTE>
That was in the past and of course still the case today, but NASCAR doesn't
need support from an industry that has knowingly, increased the ***iveness
of their cigarettes, used additives that were harmful to users and withheld
research information about the harmful effects of cigarettes. For years
the tobacco industry has denied that their products were harmful to the
American people and even to Congress, until recently when they had to admit
to the contrary.
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>

<P>Cigarettes are a legal product, that can be sold without a
<BR>prescription to the vast majority of viewers of NASCAR. The government
<BR>shouldn't proscribe the advertising of a legal product merely because
<BR>SOME viewers are not old enough to buy and use it. Should we ban
<BR>automobile ads for the same reason? After all, SOME of the audience
<BR>won't be legally allowed to buy and use the cars being advertised,
AND
<BR>cars kill lots of people every year... And the auto-makers have worked
<BR>for years to make cars ***ive... :-)&nbsp; &lt;-- NB

<P>---Jim Sokoloff</BLOCKQUOTE>
&nbsp;&nbsp; Cars or cigarettes, as inanimate objects, will not kill anyone.
If someone were to operate a car properly, it wouldn't hurt anyone. If
someone were to use a cigarette properly, they would almost be guaranteed
to become ***ive to a product that causes cancer, emphezyma and other
respiratory problems, unless of course you're Bill Clinton and don't inhale.My
point here is about deception and how the tobacco industry has deceived
the public about the harmful effects of cigarettes while making millions.
<U>If they had published their findings about the harmful effects and it's
***iveness 30 years ago when they(tabacco companies) did their studies
and people still chose to smoke in spite of the findings,</U> <I>then</I>
I would agree that it's the smokers fault. But when the industry knowingly
lied about and concealed their findings, then these companies must be held
accountable. The recent court decision is not only about direct advertising
towards kids but also about making the industry responsible for the harm
they have inflicted on the public by withholding information and lying
to them.

<P>Steve</HTML>

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<HTML>
<BR>Keep the Government out of private business or we'll all be in deep
S#$t!!
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>&nbsp;
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>&nbsp;</BLOCKQUOTE>
&nbsp;
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>>Why would we want our beloved sport identified with
this product?

<P>Because it's been paying a pretty fair chunk of change to support our
<BR>beloved sport for over 25 years now.</BLOCKQUOTE>
That was in the past and of course still the case today, but NASCAR doesn't
need support from an industry that has knowingly, increased the ***iveness
of their cigarettes, used additives that were harmful to users and withheld
research information about the harmful effects of cigarettes. For years
the tobacco industry has denied that their products were harmful to the
American people and even to Congress, until recently when they had to admit
to the contrary.
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>Cigarettes are a legal product, that can be sold
without a
<BR>prescription to the vast majority of viewers of NASCAR. The government
<BR>shouldn't proscribe the advertising of a legal product merely because
<BR>SOME viewers are not old enough to buy and use it. Should we ban
<BR>automobile ads for the same reason? After all, SOME of the audience
<BR>won't be legally allowed to buy and use the cars being advertised,
AND
<BR>cars kill lots of people every year... And the auto-makers have worked
<BR>for years to make cars ***ive... :-)&nbsp; &lt;-- NB

<P>---Jim Sokoloff</BLOCKQUOTE>
&nbsp;&nbsp; Cars or cigarettes, as inanimate objects, will not kill anyone.
If someone were to operate a car properly, it wouldn't hurt anyone. If
someone were to use a cigarette properly, they would almost be guaranteed
to become ***ive to a product that causes cancer, emphezyma and other
respiratory problems, unless of course you're Bill Clinton and don't inhale.My
point here is about deception and how the tobacco industry has deceived
the public about the harmful effects of cigarettes while making millions.
<U>If they had published their findings about the harmful effects and it's
***iveness 30 years ago when they(tabacco companies) did their studies
and people still chose to smoke in spite of the findings,</U> <I>then</I>
I would agree that it's the smokers fault. But when the industry knowingly
lied about and concealed their findings, then these companies must be held
accountable. The recent court decision is not only about direct advertising
towards kids but also about making the industry responsible for the harm
they have inflicted on the public by withholding information and lying
to them.

<P>Steve</BLOCKQUOTE>
&nbsp;</HTML>

They had a problem with sudden acceleration.

One example was while the car was in park, the person went to open the
garage door, the car suddenly accelerated thru the person, the garage
door,
the back of the garage, and finally stopped in a swimming pool.

It was found but happened rarely.  Audi bought back this model and
resold
them in some third world country. (I guess that country didn't have
lawyers)

So yes, cars kill people. (or would you say engineers kill people?)

mykey

actually the cigarete companies could stop adding niccatine and tarr to
thier products to give them a tune up.

From your statement, I could conclude that every single instance of
car-to-car or car-to-pedestrian collision must then be the fault of
improper maintainence or unlawful operation. Clearly, that's not true.

Anyway, it's the emissions from the cigarettes that are harmful...

I understand your point, and I'm about as anti-smoking as a sensible
person can be. However, I don't mind at all seeing the Smokin' Joes
Camel-Powered and the Skoal car chasing after the millions of dollars
that RJR puts up every year for Winston Cup Racing. The government
jamming its nose into motorsports advertising of a legal product seems
ridiculous. If cigarettes are so damn bad, make them illegal. (And
then, I'd stand up for banning the ads...)

---Jim

I understand the intellectual problems people have here with the
government.

My major point is that this will not be a big deal for racing.  It's
gotten too big for the loss of tobacco sponsorship to cause major
problems.

                          bob