rec.autos.simulators

by **Glen Pries** » Sun, 23 Jul 2000 04:00:00

I have only today been able to find RAS after several days of being
unable to get on; (another "up-grade" from my local shop, right?
Actually, it may be OK, as I went from NetNav 3.1 to 4.7, if that is
the correct nomenclature!) I have missed the messages which have
aroused such indignation. I know little to nothing about "warez";
when I first saw it I figured it was someone who had paid scant
attention to the possibility of learning something in school making a
failed attempt to spell "Juarez", the town in Old Mexico adjacent to El
Paso, Texas. When I was an army boy in the '50's at White Sands PG in
New Mexico you could call something a "Juarez Special" and that pretty
much meant crappy quality. I guess there is a close connection with
"warez" in that regard, after all these 44 years!
That said, I think that rights to any intellectual property should
be protected; meaning to access a "warez" ("Juarez" ?) copy is to
receive stolen property, pure and simple. I, too, have bought some
stinkers, and it really burned my can to have wasted my money.HOWEVER,
I do NOT think that entitles me to have a cheater copy of any new game
which may interest me. How many sims would we have , good or bad, if
the developers simply gave up on the idea of bringing out new ones
because so many prospective purchasers would simply take down a cheater
copy? Would Kammerer, Crammond and the West Brothers have any
incentive to continue working feverishly to satisfy fanatics like those
of us who post to this NG?
Certainly the companies have released some real dogs, but I
seriously doubt they began with the idea of releasing a real dozer on
us unsuspecting simmers, getting rich while we fume and rant!
It reminds me very much of the MP3 controversy. It would take
either a very big and threatening man, or else a gorgeous semi-***
babe to get me to listen to ANYTHING by "Metallica", but that guy's
"music" should not be available to anyone who hasn't bought a CD or
tape, or attended a concert, or listened to an advertiser-supported
radio station. MY not-very-humble opinion! :-)) Glen Priest

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by **Bruce Kennewel** » Mon, 24 Jul 2000 04:00:00

In all the years that I have been posting to RAS I have never been so amazed
at the behaviour of some as I have been over the past several days.

Taking a step back and reading the subject headers gives the impression of a
hoard of hungry pigs all vying to get their snouts into the slop. From my
vantage point it's a disgusting sight.

F12000 started what will now become a "warez habit"......no doubt releases
of NASCAR Heat, N4, WSC, and other anticipated sim releases will bring
similar activity here. RAS has descended to the same level as any ***
newsgroup on the 'net.

I really and sincerely hope that the publishers note and take full advantage
of this shameful behaviour and deliberately feed defective, pre-release beta
gold CDs into the warez "system" so that those bottom-feeders who devour
this type of stuff will ***on it.

I, for one, have nothing but contempt for the morals and behaviour of some
who have posted here over the last week. I feel as if I've trodden in
something rather ***.
--
Regards,
Bruce Kennewell,
Canberra, Australia.
---------------------------

by **Senninh** » Mon, 24 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Personally I'm feeling more than a tad queasy from all the right-on
moralising - Sherpa Tensing couldn't help people onto any higher m***
ground than has been seen here.

Warez helps people try software prior to purchase - some buy it who
wouldn't otherwise, others don't buy it who perhaps would.. Those
numbers will even out, but if the product is good you should benefit.
The ones with the warez habit wouldn't buy any game anyway, so what's
lost?

I don't think it applies to anyone here, and I don't think there's any
new angle left with which to denounce, so can we all take a break from
the war of words? I don't think my stomach can take much more.

John

On Sun, 23 Jul 2000 08:46:27 +1000, "Bruce Kennewell"

>In all the years that I have been posting to RAS I have never been so amazed
>at the behaviour of some as I have been over the past several days.

>Taking a step back and reading the subject headers gives the impression of a
>hoard of hungry pigs all vying to get their snouts into the slop. From my
>vantage point it's a disgusting sight.

>F12000 started what will now become a "warez habit"......no doubt releases
>of NASCAR Heat, N4, WSC, and other anticipated sim releases will bring
>similar activity here. RAS has descended to the same level as any ***
>newsgroup on the 'net.

>I really and sincerely hope that the publishers note and take full advantage
>of this shameful behaviour and deliberately feed defective, pre-release beta
>gold CDs into the warez "system" so that those bottom-feeders who devour
>this type of stuff will ***on it.

>I, for one, have nothing but contempt for the morals and behaviour of some
>who have posted here over the last week. I feel as if I've trodden in
>something rather ***.

by **PHendrix** » Mon, 24 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Thank you!! I felt the exact same way when this started with F1 2000. And now
people are doing the same thing with GP3, only in larger numbers. Pretty soon
the game companies may decide that it's better to cut costs altogether, and
produce more $19.95 specials like the deer hunter games. Wether or not you
agree with the way companies like Hasbro/Microprose do things, like rushing the
product out before it's done(I guess no one would really agree with that). It
doesn't change the fact that downloading a warez version of the game is still
wrong, and still stealing.

just my opinion

by **Simon Brow** » Mon, 24 Jul 2000 04:00:00

I agree. The only genuine argument the anti-warez people could put is that
some of the people who have downloaded won't buy it because it doesn't meet
their expectations. That's fair enough, but there are plenty of people who
have downloaded it and will now buy it. Isn't that fair enough if
Microprose won't do a demo?
About warez in general, how much sympathy can you have for the industry as a
whole when it consistently churns out so much mediocre rubbish, or when it
produces so many blatant copies of other games. Also I know for a fact that
many companies literally bribe reviewers. And we all know about countless
games that are released bug-ridden and unfinished.
Given this sort of attitude from the majority of the industry it's no wonder
people resort to warez rather than get ripped off. I've got piles and piles
of original full priced games which weren't worth the money, yet got 90+
reviews.

by **Jig** » Mon, 24 Jul 2000 04:00:00

You sure it's not Bruce Ruxton? What makes you think people give a
damn about your m***perspective? Discuss the simulator. You're posts
are off topic.

On Sun, 23 Jul 2000 08:46:27 +1000, "Bruce Kennewell"

>In all the years that I have been posting to RAS I have never been so amazed
>at the behaviour of some as I have been over the past several days.

>Taking a step back and reading the subject headers gives the impression of a
>hoard of hungry pigs all vying to get their snouts into the slop. From my
>vantage point it's a disgusting sight.

>F12000 started what will now become a "warez habit"......no doubt releases
>of NASCAR Heat, N4, WSC, and other anticipated sim releases will bring
>similar activity here. RAS has descended to the same level as any ***
>newsgroup on the 'net.

>I really and sincerely hope that the publishers note and take full advantage
>of this shameful behaviour and deliberately feed defective, pre-release beta
>gold CDs into the warez "system" so that those bottom-feeders who devour
>this type of stuff will ***on it.

>I, for one, have nothing but contempt for the morals and behaviour of some
>who have posted here over the last week. I feel as if I've trodden in
>something rather ***.

by **L_NiN** » Mon, 24 Jul 2000 04:00:00

did someone say ***?

oh, guess it was just another fascist lumping everything he deems morally
wrong together in the same concentration camp....

HEY - you killed my PCXL!!!

by **T.Galvi** » Mon, 24 Jul 2000 04:00:00

So you have never had a warez copy of anything on your hard drive Bruce ?
Not even GPL? I seem to recall GPL posts from you prier to its release.

Todd.

by **Victor Cha** » Mon, 24 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Nah..............besides, if GP3 is going to be like the warez version and you don't know
about it, you and others will get pissed when GP3 is out; you are expecting a F1 sim of
all sim. In short, from what I read (I don't have DSL yet or cable so I couldn't try out
the game), GP3 is GP2 updated. Worst, hypes surrounding this game are so much that
people have been brainwashed into believing GP3 is the F1 sim of all sims. The best
thing is to come out with a demo. If it isn't for the warez version to slap people in
the face so that they can think for a moment about this game, everyone would flock to
their local EB and to buy GP3. There, you have just wasted $45 for an updated to GP2.
Yet, you make the publishers and the developers richer. 4 years into the development but
to release an update for GP2. :-)

> In all the years that I have been posting to RAS I have never been so amazed
> at the behaviour of some as I have been over the past several days.

> Taking a step back and reading the subject headers gives the impression of a
> hoard of hungry pigs all vying to get their snouts into the slop. From my
> vantage point it's a disgusting sight.

> F12000 started what will now become a "warez habit"......no doubt releases
> of NASCAR Heat, N4, WSC, and other anticipated sim releases will bring
> similar activity here. RAS has descended to the same level as any ***
> newsgroup on the 'net.

> I really and sincerely hope that the publishers note and take full advantage
> of this shameful behaviour and deliberately feed defective, pre-release beta
> gold CDs into the warez "system" so that those bottom-feeders who devour
> this type of stuff will ***on it.

> I, for one, have nothing but contempt for the morals and behaviour of some
> who have posted here over the last week. I feel as if I've trodden in
> something rather ***.
> --
> Regards,
> Bruce Kennewell,
> Canberra, Australia.
> ---------------------------

by **Intimidato** » Mon, 24 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Chill out, man. It's a newsgroup about racing games on the computer.
Don't equate it with a sanctuary where only the most blessed, most
purest of souls gather to discuss everything that is good and right.

by **L_NiN** » Mon, 24 Jul 2000 04:00:00

may he who has never used winzip past its 30 day shareware limit cast the
first stone.

oh, and I bet you don't know what napster either?

by **Chris Bloo** » Mon, 24 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Nicely put Bruce. I wonder if all those who have downloaded the
Warez version had been forced to buy GP3 they would be so quick
to point out the negative aspects. I'm sure they would be more
inclined to appreciate the positive features of what I still
believe will be a great sim.

Chris

-----------------------------------------------------------

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by **Bruce Kennewel** » Mon, 24 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Peddle that message at a warez convention, John, to the already-converted.
That's where it belongs.

And if you can't stand the the high m***ground then stay down in the mud
with the rest of the herd.
--
Regards,
Bruce Kennewell,
Canberra, Australia.
---------------------------

by **Bruce Kennewel** » Mon, 24 Jul 2000 04:00:00

And which simulator would that be that you'd like to discuss? The one in the
QANTAS base at Mascot, for the 747? Or the one that is used by the RAAF for
training on the F-18?

--
Regards,
Bruce Kennewell,
Canberra, Australia.
---------------------------

> You sure it's not Bruce Ruxton? What makes you think people give a
> damn about your m***perspective? Discuss the simulator. You're posts
> are off topic.

> On Sun, 23 Jul 2000 08:46:27 +1000, "Bruce Kennewell"

> >In all the years that I have been posting to RAS I have never been so
amazed
> >at the behaviour of some as I have been over the past several days.

> >Taking a step back and reading the subject headers gives the impression
of a
> >hoard of hungry pigs all vying to get their snouts into the slop. From my
> >vantage point it's a disgusting sight.

> >F12000 started what will now become a "warez habit"......no doubt
releases
> >of NASCAR Heat, N4, WSC, and other anticipated sim releases will bring
> >similar activity here. RAS has descended to the same level as any ***
> >newsgroup on the 'net.

> >I really and sincerely hope that the publishers note and take full
advantage
> >of this shameful behaviour and deliberately feed defective, pre-release
beta
> >gold CDs into the warez "system" so that those bottom-feeders who devour
> >this type of stuff will ***on it.

> >I, for one, have nothing but contempt for the morals and behaviour of
some
> >who have posted here over the last week. I feel as if I've trodden in
> >something rather ***.

by **Bruce Kennewel** » Mon, 24 Jul 2000 04:00:00

No, Todd...I have NEVER had a warez (or any other illegal copy) on any
computer since I've been using them....and that includes applications
software.
Demos, "crippleware", shareware and freeware....yes. But anything that has
been "ripped" (I think that's the term) and posted for general
download.....definitely not.

Certainly there were posts concerning GPL prior to it's official release,
but there was no illegal copy involved to the best of my knowledge.

I had the opportunity, for over seven years, to test and evaluate
software....so although I may not have PAID for every copy I tested, the
software was made available to me legally.

Now, if you want to take it further, I can make arrangements to meet you in
my solicitors office if you so wish.

--
Regards,
Bruce Kennewell,
Canberra, Australia.
---------------------------

> > In all the years that I have been posting to RAS I have never been so
> amazed
> > at the behaviour of some as I have been over the past several days.

> > Taking a step back and reading the subject headers gives the impression
of
> a
> > hoard of hungry pigs all vying to get their snouts into the slop. From
my
> > vantage point it's a disgusting sight.

> > F12000 started what will now become a "warez habit"......no doubt
releases
> > of NASCAR Heat, N4, WSC, and other anticipated sim releases will bring
> > similar activity here. RAS has descended to the same level as any ***
> > newsgroup on the 'net.

> So you have never had a warez copy of anything on your hard drive Bruce ?
> Not even GPL? I seem to recall GPL posts from you prier to its release.

> Todd.

rec.autos.simulators

GP3: Like pigs at a feeding trough.

GP3: Like pigs at a feeding trough.

GP3: Like pigs at a feeding trough.

GP3: Like pigs at a feeding trough.

GP3: Like pigs at a feeding trough.

GP3: Like pigs at a feeding trough.

GP3: Like pigs at a feeding trough.

GP3: Like pigs at a feeding trough.

GP3: Like pigs at a feeding trough.

GP3: Like pigs at a feeding trough.

GP3: Like pigs at a feeding trough.

GP3: Like pigs at a feeding trough.

GP3: Like pigs at a feeding trough.

GP3: Like pigs at a feeding trough.

GP3: Like pigs at a feeding trough.

GP3: Like pigs at a feeding trough.