rec.autos.simulators

Logitech Profiler Brake Axis Tweaking for GPL

Haqsa

Logitech Profiler Brake Axis Tweaking for GPL

by Haqsa » Sat, 04 Jan 2003 08:48:17

For anybody who read my previous messages about the above subject - I was
wrong!!!  If you haven't read the previous posts, basically I was trying to
get the brakes in GPL to feel more like they do in NR2002 or GTR2002.  In
both cases the spot at which the brakes really start to work coincides
roughly with the spot where the pedal on the Momo Racing starts to get
firmer, which makes braking very predictable and repeatable in those games.
In GPL OTOH it hardly takes a touch to get them working, so I was finding it
very difficult to go back and forth between GPL and the other games.  I
thought that I could tweak the axis range and sensitivity in the Logitech
Profiler to fix the feel.  You can, but it turned out I was going about it
the wrong way.

I couldn't figure out why the changes I made often had unexpected results,
so today I tried making one change at a time and each time got into GPL and
looked at the values it was receiving.  It is basically all backwards from
what I originally said.  The brake axis on the Momo Racing (and most likely
on other Logitech pedals) is inverted, i.e. the max value is when the brake
is off and the min value is when the brake is full on.  But the profiler
looks at it as a generic axis and therefore adjusts the range and
sensitivity based only on the values that it sees.  As a result, setting the
axis range to 80% cut both the high and low end values and meant that I was
dragging the brakes all the time!  The weird thing is it was hardly
noticeable.  I noticed my average lap times at Monza went up about 0.2 or
so, but I'm so inconsistent anyway it took me a while to realize that
something was wrong.  So stay away from axis range tweaking.

Secondly, sensitivity works the opposite of what you would expect.  Low
sensitivity increases precision in the low range of axis values, therefore
increasing the precision when the brake is nearly full on.  To increase the
precision and reduce the response rate when the brake is nearly off, you
need to *increase* the sensitivity.  I found that somewhere around 55% to
60% felt pretty good.  And this time it was consistent from car to car and
the lap times don't appear to be suffering.

Anyway, sorry for the confusion, and I hope this helps somebody.

bertr

Logitech Profiler Brake Axis Tweaking for GPL

by bertr » Sat, 04 Jan 2003 08:52:12

Thanks for that Info, Haqsau.  I've been following your suggestions and my Monza
times were suffering as well (although the brake pedal did feel right.....)

I'll try your new suggestions and continue to blame you when my laptimes
suffer.  8-)

Bert


> For anybody who read my previous messages about the above subject - I was
> wrong!!!  If you haven't read the previous posts, basically I was trying to
> get the brakes in GPL to feel more like they do in NR2002 or GTR2002.  In
> both cases the spot at which the brakes really start to work coincides
> roughly with the spot where the pedal on the Momo Racing starts to get
> firmer, which makes braking very predictable and repeatable in those games.
> In GPL OTOH it hardly takes a touch to get them working, so I was finding it
> very difficult to go back and forth between GPL and the other games.  I
> thought that I could tweak the axis range and sensitivity in the Logitech
> Profiler to fix the feel.  You can, but it turned out I was going about it
> the wrong way.

> I couldn't figure out why the changes I made often had unexpected results,
> so today I tried making one change at a time and each time got into GPL and
> looked at the values it was receiving.  It is basically all backwards from
> what I originally said.  The brake axis on the Momo Racing (and most likely
> on other Logitech pedals) is inverted, i.e. the max value is when the brake
> is off and the min value is when the brake is full on.  But the profiler
> looks at it as a generic axis and therefore adjusts the range and
> sensitivity based only on the values that it sees.  As a result, setting the
> axis range to 80% cut both the high and low end values and meant that I was
> dragging the brakes all the time!  The weird thing is it was hardly
> noticeable.  I noticed my average lap times at Monza went up about 0.2 or
> so, but I'm so inconsistent anyway it took me a while to realize that
> something was wrong.  So stay away from axis range tweaking.

> Secondly, sensitivity works the opposite of what you would expect.  Low
> sensitivity increases precision in the low range of axis values, therefore
> increasing the precision when the brake is nearly full on.  To increase the
> precision and reduce the response rate when the brake is nearly off, you
> need to *increase* the sensitivity.  I found that somewhere around 55% to
> 60% felt pretty good.  And this time it was consistent from car to car and
> the lap times don't appear to be suffering.

> Anyway, sorry for the confusion, and I hope this helps somebody.

Steve Smit

Logitech Profiler Brake Axis Tweaking for GPL

by Steve Smit » Sat, 04 Jan 2003 09:27:28

Yes and no.  You can actually see it when the brake is dragging in the
Win/Ctrl Pnl calibration applet (it doesn't retrurn to zero).  Most sims
(e.g., SCGT, F1200x) will pick this up...but not Papy's, which--providing
you recalibrate within the sim--will undrag the brakes with the pedal up,
and give you vollgaz with the hammer down, as I found out after some
ill-advised tweaks (not yerz) within DXTweak2.  But thanx for stepping up,
as it were.


bertr

Logitech Profiler Brake Axis Tweaking for GPL

by bertr » Sat, 04 Jan 2003 11:38:11

FWIW:  After trying for more than a week to tweak the pedals of the MOMO Racing
Wheel (thru the Profiler), I decided to try going back to my trusty TSW peds in
combination with the MOMO wheel.   With the TSW peds, within about 8 laps in GPL
I was consistently (5-6 laps in a row) faster than my fastest lap using the MOMO
peds (at Monza - F2).  Then I decided to give the TSW peds a quick whirl on
GTR2002.  Within about 6 laps at Road Atlanta, I had a PB by about 3/4s of a
second.

I can't explain it, because the MOMO peds FEEL so good.  Not that the TSW's
don't, but the TSW brake doesn't have that "progressive resistance" feel to it
like the MOMO's does.  However, even without that "feel", I find that I can
control the drifts thru the turns, using the pedals, much better than with the
MOMO's.

Go figure.  One feels "better", but the other's are faster....  Perhaps it's
just a matter of familiarity, but I'm not so sure of that.  The TSW's just seem
to be more..........precise.

Perhaps a bit more tweaking on the MOMO, when I have a more time.  But for right
now, I'm sticking with the TSW peds.

Bert


> For anybody who read my previous messages about the above subject - I was
> wrong!!!  If you haven't read the previous posts, basically I was trying to
> get the brakes in GPL to feel more like they do in NR2002 or GTR2002.  In
> both cases the spot at which the brakes really start to work coincides
> roughly with the spot where the pedal on the Momo Racing starts to get
> firmer, which makes braking very predictable and repeatable in those games.
> In GPL OTOH it hardly takes a touch to get them working, so I was finding it
> very difficult to go back and forth between GPL and the other games.  I
> thought that I could tweak the axis range and sensitivity in the Logitech
> Profiler to fix the feel.  You can, but it turned out I was going about it
> the wrong way.

> I couldn't figure out why the changes I made often had unexpected results,
> so today I tried making one change at a time and each time got into GPL and
> looked at the values it was receiving.  It is basically all backwards from
> what I originally said.  The brake axis on the Momo Racing (and most likely
> on other Logitech pedals) is inverted, i.e. the max value is when the brake
> is off and the min value is when the brake is full on.  But the profiler
> looks at it as a generic axis and therefore adjusts the range and
> sensitivity based only on the values that it sees.  As a result, setting the
> axis range to 80% cut both the high and low end values and meant that I was
> dragging the brakes all the time!  The weird thing is it was hardly
> noticeable.  I noticed my average lap times at Monza went up about 0.2 or
> so, but I'm so inconsistent anyway it took me a while to realize that
> something was wrong.  So stay away from axis range tweaking.

> Secondly, sensitivity works the opposite of what you would expect.  Low
> sensitivity increases precision in the low range of axis values, therefore
> increasing the precision when the brake is nearly full on.  To increase the
> precision and reduce the response rate when the brake is nearly off, you
> need to *increase* the sensitivity.  I found that somewhere around 55% to
> 60% felt pretty good.  And this time it was consistent from car to car and
> the lap times don't appear to be suffering.

> Anyway, sorry for the confusion, and I hope this helps somebody.


1. GPL VROC and Logitech Profiler Prob

2. Logitech FF Wheel and homemadepedals in dual axis mode --won't work in GPL!

3. GPL, Logitech and Split Axis

4. GSB2 and Logitech Profiler

5. Logitech new Profiler 3.30 is out, GOOD JOB !!

6. Logitech Wingman Profiler and CPU ussage

7. Logitech Wingman Profiler for Win2000

8. GP3 - Logitech WingMan Profiler Problem

9. Logitech Profiler under Win2000

rec.autos.simulators is a usenet newsgroup formed in December, 1993. As this group was always unmoderated there may be some spam or off topic articles included. Some links do point back to racesimcentral.net as we could not validate the original address. Please report any pages that you believe warrant deletion from this archive (include the link in your email). RaceSimCentral.net is in no way responsible and does not endorse any of the content herein.