rec.autos.simulators

Don't get a TNT if you want to enjoy GPL

Greg Sutto

Don't get a TNT if you want to enjoy GPL

by Greg Sutto » Thu, 10 Jun 1999 04:00:00

I finally found out how to avoid the problems I have had with
GPL and my TNT.

PROBLEM

  With TNT on 378MHz Celeron, GPL is impossible to drive consistently.  
  I set the graphics options to get around 36fps but even though the
  framerate dsiplay shows 36 most of the time, it's obvious that the
  framerate is not consistent.  I was lucky if I could get more than
  two laps into a race without spinning off.

SOLUTION

  Last night I gave up on my TNT and switched it for the Banshee in  
  my other machine.  With exactly the same graphics settings as the
  TNT, the Banshee gave a solid 35.xx framerate from seconds after
  the start.

  With the banshee and a consistent framerate it was much easier to
  control and it didn't take long to improve my lap time.  More to
  the point, it was MUCH MORE FUN!!  I completed my first race, with
  a lot of close racing with Surtees (yes I'm still down towards the
  rear of the grid).

I wonder how many people using TNT think they are getting good
framerates, but then say that GPL is too difficult.  If they
just switched to a supported card they might find it a completely
different sim.

Greg.

Thom j

Don't get a TNT if you want to enjoy GPL

by Thom j » Thu, 10 Jun 1999 04:00:00

Well Paul I have been here, there & everywhere on this very subject
and do not buy the 'Voodoo3 2000' if you want to use another card
with it because the 3dfx Voodoo3 2000, 3000 & 3500 are all stand
alone cards & you'll have to take out any other video card in your pc.
I got this info right from tech support at 3DFX..
Good luck Thom_j.


> I'd have to agree with that.

> I'm going to go and see if I can buy my Voodoo2 back from my friend.
> Going to keep my TNT2 and run the V2 in there as well......actually might
be
> better with a PCI V3 2000 if the prices are only around $100.00 US.



> > I finally found out how to avoid the problems I have had with
> > GPL and my TNT.

> > PROBLEM

> >   With TNT on 378MHz Celeron, GPL is impossible to drive consistently.
> >   I set the graphics options to get around 36fps but even though the
> >   framerate dsiplay shows 36 most of the time, it's obvious that the
> >   framerate is not consistent.  I was lucky if I could get more than
> >   two laps into a race without spinning off.

> > SOLUTION

> >   Last night I gave up on my TNT and switched it for the Banshee in
> >   my other machine.  With exactly the same graphics settings as the
> >   TNT, the Banshee gave a solid 35.xx framerate from seconds after
> >   the start.

> >   With the banshee and a consistent framerate it was much easier to
> >   control and it didn't take long to improve my lap time.  More to
> >   the point, it was MUCH MORE FUN!!  I completed my first race, with
> >   a lot of close racing with Surtees (yes I'm still down towards the
> >   rear of the grid).

> > I wonder how many people using TNT think they are getting good
> > framerates, but then say that GPL is too difficult.  If they
> > just switched to a supported card they might find it a completely
> > different sim.

> > Greg.

Hans

Don't get a TNT if you want to enjoy GPL

by Hans » Thu, 10 Jun 1999 04:00:00

Hey, you're totally in the wilderness here. My TNT gives me 36fps most of
the time with 12 AI cars and ALL graphics on except for the mirrors. I have
a Celeron running on 450MHz. But as always with
computer hardware you have to get the setup right...

>I finally found out how to avoid the problems I have had with
>GPL and my TNT.

>PROBLEM

>  With TNT on 378MHz Celeron, GPL is impossible to drive consistently.
>  I set the graphics options to get around 36fps but even though the
>  framerate dsiplay shows 36 most of the time, it's obvious that the
>  framerate is not consistent.  I was lucky if I could get more than
>  two laps into a race without spinning off.

>SOLUTION

>  Last night I gave up on my TNT and switched it for the Banshee in
>  my other machine.  With exactly the same graphics settings as the
>  TNT, the Banshee gave a solid 35.xx framerate from seconds after
>  the start.

>  With the banshee and a consistent framerate it was much easier to
>  control and it didn't take long to improve my lap time.  More to
>  the point, it was MUCH MORE FUN!!  I completed my first race, with
>  a lot of close racing with Surtees (yes I'm still down towards the
>  rear of the grid).

>I wonder how many people using TNT think they are getting good
>framerates, but then say that GPL is too difficult.  If they
>just switched to a supported card they might find it a completely
>different sim.

>Greg.

CombatWomba

Don't get a TNT if you want to enjoy GPL

by CombatWomba » Thu, 10 Jun 1999 04:00:00

I never understood the decision to not support D3d or at least opengl.  GPL
is amoung, if not, the most advanced sim for physics and graphics, yet it
only included glide?  Methinks the ceo of 3dfx and the ceo of papy are in
bed together as we speak....
Simon Mallet

Don't get a TNT if you want to enjoy GPL

by Simon Mallet » Thu, 10 Jun 1999 04:00:00


  The best option surely is to get the TNT2 Ultra from Hercules(the fastest
TNT2 you can get) and do what i do, which is to run GPL with my voodoo2  in
SLI ....why bother with the naff Banshee at all??????????

Paul Malyn

Don't get a TNT if you want to enjoy GPL

by Paul Malyn » Fri, 11 Jun 1999 04:00:00

I'd have to agree with that.

I'm going to go and see if I can buy my Voodoo2 back from my friend.
Going to keep my TNT2 and run the V2 in there as well......actually might be
better with a PCI V3 2000 if the prices are only around $100.00 US.


MipMa

Don't get a TNT if you want to enjoy GPL

by MipMa » Fri, 11 Jun 1999 04:00:00

With a celeron 450 and a no-name banshee.... I got 36 fps rock stable at
800x600 with 19AI.....
I can even reach 1600x1200... ;-)


>Hey, you're totally in the wilderness here. My TNT gives me 36fps most of
>the time with 12 AI cars and ALL graphics on except for the mirrors. I have
>a Celeron running on 450MHz. But as always with
>computer hardware you have to get the setup right...



Paul Malyn

Don't get a TNT if you want to enjoy GPL

by Paul Malyn » Fri, 11 Jun 1999 04:00:00

Me thinks you hit the nail right on the head.............


Mark C Dod

Don't get a TNT if you want to enjoy GPL

by Mark C Dod » Fri, 11 Jun 1999 04:00:00

Can you believe that Diablo II is also Glide only! Lucky I still have some
Voodoo 2's lying around.....

> Me thinks you hit the nail right on the head.............



> > I never understood the decision to not support D3d or at least opengl.
> GPL
> > is amoung, if not, the most advanced sim for physics and graphics, yet it
> > only included glide?  Methinks the ceo of 3dfx and the ceo of papy are in
> > bed together as we speak....

Nathan Wo

Don't get a TNT if you want to enjoy GPL

by Nathan Wo » Fri, 11 Jun 1999 04:00:00

On Wed, 9 Jun 1999 15:47:36 -0400, "CombatWombat" <COMBATWOMBAT(REMOVE


>I never understood the decision to not support D3d or at least opengl.  GPL
>is amoung, if not, the most advanced sim for physics and graphics, yet it
>only included glide?  Methinks the ceo of 3dfx and the ceo of papy are in
>bed together as we speak....

And what about the Rendition support? :P

--
Nathan Wong          http://www.nectar.com.au/~alfacors
                        - Super Touring - Alfa Romeo -

                            - V8Supercars - CART -

John Simmo

Don't get a TNT if you want to enjoy GPL

by John Simmo » Fri, 11 Jun 1999 04:00:00

I think you guys are missing the big picture.Back two (or more?) years
ago when Papy started working on GPL, Voodoo/Glide was "da bomb".  OpenGL
didn't have widespread support, and DirectXcrement was simply too damn
hard to program with.  They included support for what they viewed as the
two most popular proprietary 3D API's.

Their decisions were sound.  Video technology moves so fast that it's
ludicrous to think that any game developer can possibly hope to keep up
with what's hot in the industry and STILL release a game on schedule.  
the technology is ALWAYS going to be a step or two ahead of the games
that are available at any given point.

If you guys think it's so easy to tell the future, why don't *you* become
game developers...


says...

> Me thinks you hit the nail right on the head.............



> > I never understood the decision to not support D3d or at least opengl.
> GPL
> > is amoung, if not, the most advanced sim for physics and graphics, yet it
> > only included glide?  Methinks the ceo of 3dfx and the ceo of papy are in
> > bed together as we speak....

--
=========================================================
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Zonk

Don't get a TNT if you want to enjoy GPL

by Zonk » Fri, 11 Jun 1999 04:00:00


>I think you guys are missing the big picture.Back two (or more?) years
>ago when Papy started working on GPL, Voodoo/Glide was "da bomb".  OpenGL
>didn't have widespread support, and DirectXcrement was simply too damn
>hard to program with.  They included support for what they viewed as the
>two most popular proprietary 3D API's.

To say RRedline was every popular is somewhat dubious 8)

On your theory, since Unreal was first started in what 94-95, they should have
written for Software rendering and a what P60-90?

Technology does change, and devleopers need to allow for it. 12 months ago it
was obvious 3Dfx was becoming a spent force as a industry leader, and that
Opengl & D3D for their respective faults, was the way to go to support the
broadest userbase.
Z.

Please remove NOSPAM from my email address when replying.

Thom j

Don't get a TNT if you want to enjoy GPL

by Thom j » Fri, 11 Jun 1999 04:00:00

This is why I am staying with my Herc Thriller for now!! Nothing
comes close for Gpl & my system. Also I just bought two 12mg
Voodoo2s to SLI for $162. Its more then the $49.99 Creatives
refurbs but I wonder if they were really 'refurbs' or just left-over
stock & I don't think you'll see anymore at this price but I might
be wrong? Won't be the first time! ;O)
Cheers Thom_j.
Kirk Lan

Don't get a TNT if you want to enjoy GPL

by Kirk Lan » Fri, 11 Jun 1999 04:00:00

At best, a P90, 8 MB RAM, a 2MB S3 card....oh wait, that's my 4-year old PC!
:D  (Which has donated its original floppy, monitor, and a modem, CDROM, and
network card that were all in there at one time to a PII350 overclocked to
466 :)

--
Kirk Lane
Tempe, AZ

ICQ: 28171652
RMRL #119



>>I think you guys are missing the big picture.Back two (or more?) years
>>ago when Papy started working on GPL, Voodoo/Glide was "da bomb".  OpenGL
>>didn't have widespread support, and DirectXcrement was simply too damn
>>hard to program with.  They included support for what they viewed as the
>>two most popular proprietary 3D API's.

>To say RRedline was every popular is somewhat dubious 8)

>>Their decisions were sound.  Video technology moves so fast that it's
>>ludicrous to think that any game developer can possibly hope to keep up
>>with what's hot in the industry and STILL release a game on schedule.
>>the technology is ALWAYS going to be a step or two ahead of the games
>>that are available at any given point.

>On your theory, since Unreal was first started in what 94-95, they should
have
>written for Software rendering and a what P60-90?

>Technology does change, and devleopers need to allow for it. 12 months ago
it
>was obvious 3Dfx was becoming a spent force as a industry leader, and that
>Opengl & D3D for their respective faults, was the way to go to support the
>broadest userbase.
>Z.

>Please remove NOSPAM from my email address when replying.

Chris Schlette

Don't get a TNT if you want to enjoy GPL

by Chris Schlette » Fri, 11 Jun 1999 04:00:00

Lets see, when GPL was written for the most part D3D wasn't really an option
simply because it was hard to work in and not every card supported it or the
support was weak. OpenGL hardware support has always been spotty..some
companies have miniGL implementations which don't expose the full OpenGL
spec, some are missing certain parts and others such as Matrox say they have
an OpenGL driver and never ship one.  Not to mention, remember that Papyrus
has had lots of Rendition experience and they had done 3dfx for NROS/N2.

If GPL came out now, there might not be any good reasons for Glide/Rendition
only....but note also that PNR is coming out with D3D support, so I don't
doubt that N3 will have it too.....would be nice to see the 1.1 patch for
GPL have D3D support too. :)


> On Wed, 9 Jun 1999 15:47:36 -0400, "CombatWombat" <COMBATWOMBAT(REMOVE

> >I never understood the decision to not support D3d or at least opengl.
GPL
> >is amoung, if not, the most advanced sim for physics and graphics, yet it
> >only included glide?  Methinks the ceo of 3dfx and the ceo of papy are in
> >bed together as we speak....

> And what about the Rendition support? :P

> --
> Nathan Wong          http://www.nectar.com.au/~alfacors
>                         - Super Touring - Alfa Romeo -

>                             - V8Supercars - CART -


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