rec.autos.simulators

Sadly I too returned CPR .. I just couldn't see keeping it for now.  I
thoroughly enjoyed MTM by TRI, so I was expecting a finished product
w/CPR.  Alas, I agree... I think there was a push to "make the Christmas
buying season..."

Maybe CPR99 will be better...

Doug

 Try the version update - available shortly.

I downloaded the demo of ICR2 to see why everyone is e***d by this game.
I was disappointed in the feel of the ICR2 car.  It feels like you're
driving a block of wood around a track.  No 3-dimensional feel at all, and
the steering feels strange.  I double checked all of the realism options.
Is this how the car is in the full version of the game or am I missing some
option.  CPR, on the other hand, feels and turns like a car.

--
Kevin
(Remove the "x-" prefix from my address in order to reply via email)

Now, if the patch doesn't work as advertised, then shame on me for believing.

-- Mark

   There were some handling bugs in the first release of ICR2, which
would also be in the demo.  (I don't remember the specifics, my main
problem was that it was impossible to catch the car once it broke
loose, which was fixed by the patch.)  The handling model in ICR2
tends towards oversteer (default setups) or little grip, versus the
"grippy" default CPR model.

   As far as no 3-D feel, no, it doesn't have much in the way of
vibration or***pit shake like CPR does (unless you go off-roading).

   On "strange" steering, perhaps toggling linear (preferred for
wheels, YMMV)/non-linear (preferred for joysticks) steering might
help.

   One other thing to consider is that many of the ICR2 fans are
talking about the Rendition-enhanced version of the game, which gives
better frame rates and better graphics than the non-accelerated demo.
On my machine (P133 + Rendition V1000), the choice of ICR2 at 30fps
(up to 45 in turbo mode) versus CPR at 15 or so makes it hard to sell
myself on CPR (we'll see how the patch does).

   Hope this helps.

Before you send me UCE, I know what you're thinking...  Did he complain
to five or six postmasters last month?  Now, you must ask yourself one
question: "Do I feel lucky?"  Well, do you, punk?

It is hard to understand how you know that in cpr all you have to do is
slide 'er round on the ovals, when in the next paragraph you say you
haven't tried the whole game yet and the demo only includes Laguna.

There's a lot of people who were really, really, really, REALLY good
at ICR2, and are equally good at CPR - but still don't like it. It has
nothing to do with not being able to drive it, and everything to do
with being unwilling to drive it because of the issues long ago
acknowledged by Microsoft.

If anything CPR is easier to drive than ICR2 (without any help on),
since it lacks the delicacy of touch ICR2 demanded on ovals. In CPR
you simply crank the wheel over and slide 'er round.

Let's see what this patch brings. MS have mentioned that a new demo
will be released at some point, containing all the improvements. Since
I have no chance to try the full product (not released in UK yet), I'm
looking forward to the new demo very much, whenever it should appear.
If it does attend to everything listed then I'll be the first to sing
the praises of CPR from the treetops as a good product and a well
supported product.

So, roll on the patch, or, more importantly, the new demo, since
that's all I'm going to be able to try.

Cheers!
John

Hey, I've got a fertile imagination! :)

No, actually what I said was that I have no chance to try the full
product (present/future tense), not that I've never _tried_ the full
product. A friend got it mailed to him from the States and I tried it
a few times at his house.

There's a lot to like, and CPR captures the "rush" of driving these
cars very well with the engine roar, skittishness etc, but for me the
problems vastly outweighed any fun I might have with it. I'm hopeful
that the patch will address all the problems, and if so I'm sure that
it is a product that I would have enjoyed. Unfotunetaly Ubi-F1 has
arrived and most likely stolen CPR's thunder, at least here in Europe,
so I doubt I'll ever get round to buying CPR myself now, unless the
patch gives a total transformation to lift CPR above Ubi-F1.

Cheers!
John

l8er
ronny

--
          |\      _,,,---,,_        I want to die like my Grandfather,
   ZZZzz /,`.-'`'    -.  ;-;;,_              in his sleep.
        |,4-  ) )-,_. ,\ (  `'-'     Not like the people in his car,
       '---''(_/--'  `-'\_)            screaming their heads off!

On Mon, 8 Dec 1997 20:37:35 -0800, "Dean (CART Team)"

     I'm assuming that you are refering to the patch,or is there a new
version being released ?

Joel Willstein

John,
    Call me shallow, but it's the little things that turn me onto CPR.  I'm
a BIG stickler for realism, and when I did my first spin on a roadcourse,
then attempted to do a half doughnut to get pointed in the right direction
(Ala Mario Andretti at IMS), I was very impressed to see that I could in
fact break the rears loose and get her around.  What really impressed me
though was, when I looked at the racetrack directly in front of me, there
were the two burnout tracks from my rear tires on the pavement!  I was so
taken by surprise that I spent the next five minutes melting the rear tires
to see it again!  Hey, they even stuck around after a couple of runs around
the track.  Very cool.  Unfortunatly, durinng that same period, I also drive
headlong into a wall at 180 mph and the only thing that happened was the
nose cone popped off (and Bob Varsha's smart ass comment about Racecars and
wings...Thanks, pal! <G>).  This, combined with no yellow flags, and I was
quickly unamused with the potential race problems.  I wiped out about three
cars on the start at Miami and all I got was a small flash of yellow flag,
then back to green.  Not a good way to be on the speedway.  Also, the crash
dynamics are tragic.  Hit a wall at 180 mph, and they shouldn't be able to
find all the pieces of your car, yet in CPR I backed up and drove away, none
the worse for wear (other then sans the nose cone).  I have yet to see an AI
car wreck without my intervention (or unwilling participation, re: blasting
into the back of me), and if it did, I probably wouldn't see it anyway as
the car would have driven away, not ever recieving terminal damage.
    All of this said, I am NOT going to return it, even though it runs like
a dog on my P166/Velocity 128/64MB machine.  I hope the patch will help, and
if it doesn't address everything, we'll just simply talk with Dean or others
about the deficiencies.  The CPR team is as interested in selling more
product, and nothing sells software faster then rave reviews from users.
Fortunatly, most racing sim users are also "realism seekers", and as such,
won't let these kind of deficiencies slide.  After all, if all I wanted was
some cool graphics at a decent frame rate, I'd go out and buy a Nintendo 64!