rec.autos.simulators

by **jaf** » Sat, 24 Feb 2001 11:15:04

I thought the cause of Senna's death was a freak thing. It was my
understanding he was hit and killed with a part on the car that had broken
prior to the crash, this did not happen?

> Yeah the concrete runoff really helped Senna out.

> JB

> > > What would save lives are run-offs with gravel or sand, but we're
> > > never going to see them due to cost.

> > BS.....gravel and sand cause other problems, such as the cars flipping
at
> > horrible rates when the come into contact with either the gravel or
> > sand....the best runoff is asphalt...

> > Dave

by **Wosc** » Sat, 24 Feb 2001 11:43:25

Yes I believe it was a suspension linkage to the head. But you have to
wonder if a trap would have slowed him just enough to save him...car rolling
(not sliding) on concrete loses very little speed.

JB

> I thought the cause of Senna's death was a freak thing. It was my
> understanding he was hit and killed with a part on the car that had broken
> prior to the crash, this did not happen?

> > Yeah the concrete runoff really helped Senna out.

> > JB

> > > > What would save lives are run-offs with gravel or sand, but we're
> > > > never going to see them due to cost.

> > > BS.....gravel and sand cause other problems, such as the cars flipping
> at
> > > horrible rates when the come into contact with either the gravel or
> > > sand....the best runoff is asphalt...

> > > Dave

by **Eldre** » Sat, 24 Feb 2001 12:40:18

>On Thu, 22 Feb 2001 10:49:40 -0500, "Dave St.Onge"

>>BS.....gravel and sand cause other problems, such as the cars flipping at
>>horrible rates when the come into contact with either the gravel or
>>sand....the best runoff is asphalt...

>Can you site an example for me? I've never seen this.

>Tim

Patrick Carpentier at Elkhart Lake, Martin Brundle, there are a couple more
that I remember but can't think of the driver right now...

Eldred
--
Dale Earnhardt, Sr. 1951-2001
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
GPL F1 hcp. +28.67...F2 +151.26...F3 hcp. +373.73

Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

by **Alan Conceic** » Sat, 24 Feb 2001 12:46:11

Michael Andretti at Portland?

-
Alan

Dale Earnhardt, 1951-2001:
"The Last American Hero"
R.I.P.

by **Brian Carabe** » Sat, 24 Feb 2001 13:07:43

Think of the hundreds if not thousands of drivers who's lives were saved by
the combination of energy dissipating materials and construction. It would
be foolish to think that these techniques would save the life of every
driver in every crash, but that does not negate the fact that hundreds of
lives have been saved. Therefore I contend that research should continue and
energy dissipating techniques should be employed wherever possible.

Brian

by **Gregor Vebl** » Sat, 24 Feb 2001 17:19:50

> True, but in Earnhardts accident, the enery was dissipated instantly.
> That was sort of my point. No amount of breakaway parts or a carbon
> fiber tub is going to prevent a 180 to 0 MPH impact against concrete.

> Tim

That's exactly the point. If you build a car as strong as a tank, it
will not deform on impact but simply stop almost instantly upon
collision with the wall. Simple physics (average force times the time
interval equals mass times the change in velocity) will tell you that if
a car disippates a given momentum (mass times the change velocity) upon
collision, the average force acting on the car and therefore average
acceleration (average force divided by mass of the car) on the driver
within it is inveresly proportional to the time that the deformation
takes place.

So, if a car is build very rigid, the time spent in a collision is much
shorter than it would be if a car is deigned to crumple as much as
possible (without deforming the driver cell, of course), and the short
times involved create large accelerations and it is these that cause
injuries.

-Gregor

by **Alan Conceic** » Sun, 25 Feb 2001 03:38:44

I don't disagree. I'm just stating that not every impact is survivable.

-
Alan

Dale Earnhardt, 1951-2001:
"The Last American Hero"
R.I.P.

by **Bob Wil** » Sun, 25 Feb 2001 23:11:10

But ---- they all survived. Maybe the gravel trap was the reason they
survived. The tumbling dissapates the energy in small segments. The drivers
are strapped into a survival cell, the***pit, which protects them from the
tumbling.
...Bob

by **Disgruntled Go** » Mon, 26 Feb 2001 20:03:21

>>Therefore I contend that research should continue and
>>energy dissipating techniques should be employed wherever possible.

>I don't disagree. I'm just stating that not every impact is survivable.

With all due respect, that isn't really much use, is it? We can sit
around saying "shit happens" but to achive anthing we need to be
asking "How can we minimise the possibility of shit happening? How can
we make shit less damaging when it does happen?"

To sit about saying "well it didn't help in this case..." or "well it
wouldn't have made any difference to Dale (or another deceased
driver)' is, frankly, a waste of time and space. Yet that seems to be
what about half the responses to any of these suggestions seem to be.

DG

by **Marty U'Re** » Mon, 26 Feb 2001 05:07:31

Exactly, and NASCAR has a head-the-sand attitude about known safetly technology
that could be saving more lives.
Four deaths in one year I think show more needs to be done and NASCAR officials
act more concerned about image and liability than safety. Now with the death of
a 'super star' hopefully they will wake up.

Marty

> Think of the hundreds if not thousands of drivers who's lives were saved by
> the combination of energy dissipating materials and construction. It would
> be foolish to think that these techniques would save the life of every
> driver in every crash, but that does not negate the fact that hundreds of
> lives have been saved. Therefore I contend that research should continue and
> energy dissipating techniques should be employed wherever possible.

> Brian

> > >From what I've seen, F1 cars are designed to break apart in various ways
> to
> > >dissipate energy away from the driver. With all those parts flying off
> the
> > >way they're supposed to, just think of the enormous amounts of energy
> that
> > >is diverted away from the driver.

> > All the energy dissapating materials in the world didn't help Sam Schmidt,
> > Scott Brayton, etc. Good luck finding a incident similar to Earnhardt's,
> at the
> > same speed, in which the driver survived or did not recieve massive
> injuries.

> > -
> > Alan

> > Dale Earnhardt, 1951-2001:
> > "The Last American Hero"
> > R.I.P.

rec.autos.simulators

It isn't the cars that are dangerous...

It isn't the cars that are dangerous...

It isn't the cars that are dangerous...

It isn't the cars that are dangerous...

It isn't the cars that are dangerous...

It isn't the cars that are dangerous...

It isn't the cars that are dangerous...

It isn't the cars that are dangerous...

It isn't the cars that are dangerous...

It isn't the cars that are dangerous...

It isn't the cars that are dangerous...