rec.autos.simulators

by **Dave Henri** » Thu, 09 Apr 1998 04:00:00

I believe the standard Papyrus line ever since they announced this title
was 3dfx or Rendition. Here's the deal...if you race you should be seriously
considering either of those cards, if you fly 3dfx all the way...the
mainstream D3d boards do their thing very well, but....in the specilized world
of sims....having a Riva or Virge is a huge handicap
dave henrie

> I've been digging through the massive amounts of info on GPL, and have not
> been able to find a clear answer, so Mike Lescault if you're out there,
> PLEASE let us all know if there are plans to support D3D or OpenGL in the
> retail game. Thanks for any info you may have.

> --
> Mike McCloskey
> CPR Playground
> http://www.racesimcentral.net/

by **Mike McCloske** » Fri, 10 Apr 1998 04:00:00

I've been digging through the massive amounts of info on GPL, and have not
been able to find a clear answer, so Mike Lescault if you're out there,
PLEASE let us all know if there are plans to support D3D or OpenGL in the
retail game. Thanks for any info you may have.

--
Mike McCloskey
CPR Playground
http://www.cprplayground.home.ml.org

by **Zonk** » Fri, 10 Apr 1998 04:00:00

> I believe the standard Papyrus line ever since they announced this title
>was 3dfx or Rendition. Here's the deal...if you race you should be seriously
>considering either of those cards, if you fly 3dfx all the way...the
>mainstream D3d boards do their thing very well, but....in the specilized world
>of sims....having a Riva or Virge is a huge handicap
>dave henrie

>> I've been digging through the massive amounts of info on GPL, and have not
>> been able to find a clear answer, so Mike Lescault if you're out there,
>> PLEASE let us all know if there are plans to support D3D or OpenGL in the
>> retail game. Thanks for any info you may have.

>> --
>> Mike McCloskey
>> CPR Playground
>> http://www.racesimcentral.net/

Actually thats absolute crap. The big problem in the sim world is with 3Dfx's
and how difficult it is for those cars to continue to have to render***pits
each frame.

And putting Riva's and Virge's in the same group is stupid. Perhaps Rendition
& Virge beling together more?

by **Keith Allso** » Fri, 10 Apr 1998 04:00:00

> I believe the standard Papyrus line ever since they announced this title
> was 3dfx or Rendition. Here's the deal...if you race you should be seriously
> considering either of those cards, if you fly 3dfx all the way...the
> mainstream D3d boards do their thing very well, but....in the specilized world
> of sims....having a Riva or Virge is a huge handicap
> dave henrie

Ubisoft F1RS works very well in D3D on a RIVA128, completely negating your final
comments. There is no reason for GPL to not be on D3D, other than Papyrus not
wanting to invest in learning a new interface. If Papyrus are waiting for directx6
(beta in April?), that is reasonable, but to ignore open standards like D3D or
OpenGL is very shortsighted. This will become more obvious when the Intel 740
drives down the price of top quality D3D cards later this year.

Keith.

--

!!! remove _ANTISPAM from e-mail address when replying !!!

by **Michael E. Carve** » Fri, 10 Apr 1998 04:00:00

% I've been digging through the massive amounts of info on GPL, and have not
% been able to find a clear answer, so Mike Lescault if you're out there,
% PLEASE let us all know if there are plans to support D3D or OpenGL in the
% retail game. Thanks for any info you may have.

Take the following with a few grains of salt, but this is what I found:
http://www.gamespot.com/news/news/97_11/25_grandprix/index.html

The title should hit shelves sometime in the summer of 1998. It will
support Microsoft's Direct 3D, Rendition, and 3Dfx 3D APIs through
Windows 95. Drivers set to take on the winding roads will be able to
race as many as 17 competitors; the number of tracks hasn't been decided
yet.

--
**************************** Michael E. Carver *************************
Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

by Jo » Fri, 10 Apr 1998 04:00:00

>Ubisoft F1RS works very well in D3D on a RIVA128, completely negating your final
>comments. There is no reason for GPL to not be on D3D, other than Papyrus not
>wanting to invest in learning a new interface.

Nope, they just want maximum performance and quality. That means
native APIs, not D3D.

Joe

by **ttam** » Fri, 10 Apr 1998 04:00:00

>Actually thats absolute crap. The big problem in the sim world is with 3Dfx's
>and how difficult it is for those cars to continue to have to render***pits
>each frame.

As far as I can remember, GPL demo seemed to have a 3D***pit made of
polygons, so drawing it "for each frame" is not any harder for 3Dfx
Voodoo/Voodoo2 cards than Rendition/Riva128/whatever.

What you stated was only true for 2D bitmap***pits, but even Voodoo
cards draw them fine if the game developer knows what he is doing.
Archimedean Dy*** and also F1RS are good examples of this.

by **ymenar** » Fri, 10 Apr 1998 04:00:00

Michael E. Carver wrote :

Michael,

Yeah I remember this article. Still it's a little bit dated, but I also
take it with a grain of salt.

Mike Lescault told in the GPL Forum that Papyrus don't have plans to do an
D3D or OpenGL version of GPLegends. Oh and the Nascar3 interview also said
AFAIK that they will only support 3dfx and Rendition.

I have no problem with that, going to buy a Diamond Stealth II in a few
weeks. And enjoy Icr2 Rendition :-)

Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard> Sponsored by http://www.awpss.com/
Good race at the Brickyard, (-o-)

Official Mentally retarded guy of r.a.s.
Excuse me for my English (I'm French speaking)
Excuse me for being provocative (I'm dumb speaking)

--"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realise
how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."--

by **Jerry** » Fri, 10 Apr 1998 04:00:00

Before last Christmas I was faced with the new Riva 128 video cards as being
potentially faster than 3Dfx and had to make a decision on whether to bet on
Direct 3D or go with 3Dfx. In the end I found that the 3Dfx was very good at
direct 3D as well as its own native support so I went with a Diamond Monster
3D. This is definitely the best $150 I ever spent as I already had an ET6000
video card that was fast enough for 2D anyway. The reason you see Rendition
and 3Dfx support in games isn't necessarily because developers don't like
direct 3D, but I think it's because for a long time they were the only 3D cards
that really had the performance. The Cirrus Logic Laguna and S3 Virge while
supporting direct 3D didn't have the performance to make it worth while to
developers to write to the direct 3D standard. If the Riva 128 had came out a
year earlier than there might be more Direct 3D support. It take a year or
more lead time to write these new games and they can't hope that Direct 3D
cards would have enough performance by the time the game is released they have
to use the technology that has proven itself. Rendition and 3Dfx didn't lie
about their performance and like other 3D-video card makers. Finally I don't
program so I don't know the problems in writing Direct 3D code, but since I
know that direct 3D versions run slower than native 3Dfx and Rendition version
Papyrus would have had a revolt on their hands if there was a direct 3D only
version. So to keep the 3Dfx and Rendition people happy, which are a majority
of the 3D market they write native versions for these. Direct 3D will be an
after thought if it does come about and this doesn't seem limited to just
Papyrus.

Jerry

by **Dave Henri** » Fri, 10 Apr 1998 04:00:00

> Actually thats absolute crap. The big problem in the sim world is with 3Dfx's
> and how difficult it is for those cars to continue to have to render***pits
> each frame.

> And putting Riva's and Virge's in the same group is stupid. Perhaps Rendition
> & Virge beling together more?

i believe over in the pc.comp.sys.games.flight-sims newsgroup the producer of the Longbow series,
Andy Hollis, pretty firmly squashed the difficulty of 2d***pits overlayed with 3d enviroments.
Once they looked at the details it became as simple as any other graphic. Also, I think I've heard
some coders are starting to produce 3d***pits as well so once again the 'ol propaganda about what
3dfx chipsets can and cannot do seems flawed.
And in relation to my point in the post, the Riva should snuggle up nicely with the Virge. Not
because it's a wimp card, hardly that 128 bit chip is pretty stout. But as far as selection of
top-flight sims(drivers or flight sims), the Riva is decidedly 2nd tier. F1rs is a good
example...Native Voodoo, D3d patched, and last I looked showing some lovely black boxes around the
trees. The Papy products...N2, GPL. CART/ICR2...well your Riva will run them but in glorious 2d
which I have heard is also slower than the 3d versions. CPR--do you really want to go there??
Sure it's D3d and my $99 DS II ran it with full hills, distance etc without hardly a hiccup.
Bottom line, if you want 3d in the sim world, your Riva will do. but at this point is comming up
short selection wise. So thats why I grouped it with the Virge(r.i.p.)
I would think that the next gen Riva would be an excellant partner with A Voodoo2 or two but for
right now I'm extremely happy with my rendition card, running games like Jedi at 800x600 with a year
old Asus mb and only 32megs of edo...And the CART/ICR2 sim is like a whole 'nother product with
Rendition support...
later!
dave

by **Byron Forbe** » Sun, 12 Apr 1998 04:00:00

> Ubisoft F1RS works very well in D3D on a RIVA128, completely negating your final
> comments. There is no reason for GPL to not be on D3D, other than Papyrus not
> wanting to invest in learning a new interface. If Papyrus are waiting for directx6
> (beta in April?), that is reasonable, but to ignore open standards like D3D or
> OpenGL is very shortsighted. This will become more obvious when the Intel 740
> drives down the price of top quality D3D cards later this year.

Untrue. The F1RS D3D version is flawed (black outlines and overdone
and dark colours) and not as fast as the 3dfx version. However, being a
Riva owner (and beginning to regret it by the minute) it is depressing
to see a game your interested in not supporting D3D.

rec.autos.simulators

Will GPL final version support D3D or OpenGL?

Will GPL final version support D3D or OpenGL?

Will GPL final version support D3D or OpenGL?

Will GPL final version support D3D or OpenGL?

Will GPL final version support D3D or OpenGL?

Will GPL final version support D3D or OpenGL?

Will GPL final version support D3D or OpenGL?

Will GPL final version support D3D or OpenGL?

Will GPL final version support D3D or OpenGL?

Will GPL final version support D3D or OpenGL?

Will GPL final version support D3D or OpenGL?

Will GPL final version support D3D or OpenGL?