rec.autos.simulators

Honest opinions... F1 2001?

Stephen Smit

Honest opinions... F1 2001?

by Stephen Smit » Wed, 10 Oct 2001 09:47:42

Dave,

No he wasn't:

<<EA: Feels the way I expect an F1 would except a bit grippy at times and
not
enough feeling of inertia when lifting and "gliding" through chicanes.  The
feel is one of tremendous power and speed with very tight control.  Easy to
drive but hard to drive extremely well.  Control is very direct and smooth.
FF is good, not GP3 and certainly not GPL but the best F1 after those.>>

What's it say at the head of that paragraph?  Sony?  No, "EA," which is what
Joe was calling the PC version.  Of course, I could be wrong.

--Steve


>   He's comparing PS2 console versions.  Sony doesn't have a current PC F1
> sim that I'm aware of.  The EA console version of F12k+1 does have FF.
> dave henrie


> > Uh, Joe?  F1 2001 doesn't have any FF....

Stephen Smit

Honest opinions... F1 2001?

by Stephen Smit » Wed, 10 Oct 2001 09:53:28

Dave,

I see.  I thought Joe was comparing EA's "F1 2001" for the PC with EA's
"Formula One 2001" for the *Sony* PS2.  Apples, apologies & oranges.

--Steve


>   He's comparing PS2 console versions.  Sony doesn't have a current PC F1
> sim that I'm aware of.  The EA console version of F12k+1 does have FF.
> dave henrie


> > Uh, Joe?  F1 2001 doesn't have any FF....

Joe Marque

Honest opinions... F1 2001?

by Joe Marque » Wed, 10 Oct 2001 10:48:12

I just tried the dual shock.  It's actually easier to drive in a straight
line with the dual shock then the wheel.  You should be fine.

--
Joe Marques




> Joe, thanks for the info.

> Is F1-2001-PS2 easily controllable in the sim mode using
> a dual-shock? I heard it was extremely difficult to drive in
> a straight line. I have no way to position myself with a wheel
> and pedals in front of my TV.

> Thanks for any additional info!

> >Hey rrevved,

> >I'll save you some time with the PS2 versions: EA wins across the board.
> >Here's my comparison:

> >Physics:

> >EA: Feels the way I expect an F1 would except a bit grippy at times and
not
> >enough feeling of inertia when lifting and "gliding" through chicanes.
The
> >feel is one of tremendous power and speed with very tight control.  Easy
to
> >drive but hard to drive extremely well.  Control is very direct and
smooth.
> >FF is good, not GP3 and certainly not GPL but the best F1 after those.

> >Sony: Feels very similar to EA.  Major difference for me is the actual
wheel
> >control (using the Logitech Force GP).  The control isn't as direct or
> >immediate in this one.

> >EA wins here by transferring excellent physics to your hands via control
and
> >decent force feedback.  I did my standard F1 physics test: cut the wheel
and
> >pop into first gear.  This is the "celebration" dance where the car spins
in
> >circles.  EA looked and behaved exactly as expected, spinning around the
> >inside front tire.  Sony felt artificial, spinning slightly, moving
forward
> >and STOPPING then spinning again.  This just didn't feel real.

> >Graphics:

> >EA: I can't believe how good this looks with 22 cars on the track!  GT3
are
> >you listening?  Trade in some eye candy for more cars and damage.  Pure
> >racing experience is far more important than the color of the sky at
sunset.
> >Back to EA, the tracks aren't the most accurate but the graphics are
superb.
> >Great textures, lighting effects, particle effects, etc.  Best F1 visuals
on
> >a console by far.

> >Sony:  Looks dated but certainly still very nice.  Little too much
shimmer
> >and jaggies.  Colors muted and overall darker.  Gameplay impact, it's
harder
> >to see what's ahead.

> >EA wins handily again.

> >Sound:

> >EA: Best sound ever, period.  Won't waste too much time describing since
I
> >think it's not even close.

> >Sony: Sounds like a toy F1, not even close to reality.

> >EA wins again.

> >Gameplay:

> >EA: Bottom line for me: fun.  The AI is a huge improvement over prior
years.
> >Competitive, sometimes daring, far from perfect.  I play sim mode, no
> >driving aids with EASY opponents.  For comparison, my avg. lap at monza
is
> >1:28.  I'm hardly an expert but on easy I'm in the race.  I qualify 12-13
> >and generally stay competitive throughout, finishing anywhere from top 10
to
> >last depending on the day I'm having.  The racing is tight and exciting,
> >probably more exciting than real F1 which is okay for me since 1 hour of
> >lapping alone is not my idea of racing.  I don't mind a slight departure
> >from pure F1 that includes more passing and action but still seems
realistic
> >and credible.  I really enjoy this game.  The challenge mode was a fun
bonus
> >that is worth going back to as a sort of driving school for the newbies.

> >Sony:  The AI is pretty good around the track but I can't get around the
> >first lap!  At monza I've crashed and restarted at least 30 times.  I'm
> >either too fast and rear-ending the car in front or too slow and getting
hit
> >from behind.  I know first turns can be treacherous but this is just
poor.
> >There are still hits and spins in EA but I get through the first chicane
in
> >EA at least 9/10 times.  The lack of a true***pit view is a big
negative
> >for me as well since I never feel like I'm actually IN a car.

> >EA takes this category as well.

> >Overall:

> >EA is my choice for best modern F1.  I won't spend anymore time with GP3
on
> >the computer since EA on my TV looks better (amazing considering the PC
> >resolution advantage), feels just as good if not better and is more fun
and
> >immersive.

Eldre

Honest opinions... F1 2001?

by Eldre » Wed, 10 Oct 2001 11:29:52



>I got F1 2001 on Friday and wasn't able to drive it until this afternoon.  I
>have already put in more laps in it then in GP3 and F1 CS2K combined.  For
>the first time since GP2 I have a modern F1 sim that I want to put in the
>time to learn properly.  For some reason it just feels right, even without
>FF.

You didn't run that many laps in GP3 and F1CS2k?  Why - were they that
difficult, or just that bad?  If they were that bad, why do you think so?  I
have them both.  I'm not GOOD at them(no surprise), but I think they're ok...

Eldred
--
Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
F1 hcp. +16.36...Monster +360.54...

Never argue with an idiot.  He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Dave Henri

Honest opinions... F1 2001?

by Dave Henri » Wed, 10 Oct 2001 13:34:16

  This is what I saw...we may be crossing threads  :)
___
Hey rrevved,

I'll save you some time with the PS2 versions: EA wins across the board.
Here's my comparison:
____
dh


> Dave,

> No he wasn't:

> <<EA: Feels the way I expect an F1 would except a bit grippy at times and
> not
> enough feeling of inertia when lifting and "gliding" through chicanes.
The
> feel is one of tremendous power and speed with very tight control.  Easy
to
> drive but hard to drive extremely well.  Control is very direct and
smooth.
> FF is good, not GP3 and certainly not GPL but the best F1 after those.>>

> What's it say at the head of that paragraph?  Sony?  No, "EA," which is
what
> Joe was calling the PC version.  Of course, I could be wrong.

> --Steve



> >   He's comparing PS2 console versions.  Sony doesn't have a current PC
F1
> > sim that I'm aware of.  The EA console version of F12k+1 does have FF.
> > dave henrie


> > > Uh, Joe?  F1 2001 doesn't have any FF....

Rafe McAulif

Honest opinions... F1 2001?

by Rafe McAulif » Wed, 10 Oct 2001 15:23:36

It's because a lot of drivers (mainly nVidia ones) have a setting for
"use the desktop color depth". I guess it has problems when you have
desktop at 16bit, the drivers try to use 16bit, and the game wants to
use 32bit. And vice versa.

There may be other reasons as well (I'm sure someone will help us
there...)

Rafe Mc



>  glad to hear all is well.  That fix is something I should remember more
>often.  I would like to have somebody explain why desktop color depths etc
>have positive or negative effects on game performance.  Anybody have a
>clue(in PLAIN English)?
>dave henrie




>> >Have you tried running the game in windowed mode???????

>> John, Dave, Mike, and everyone who responded, I -finally-
>> got F1-2001 to run without pauses.

Jes??s Cancill

Honest opinions... F1 2001?

by Jes??s Cancill » Tue, 09 Oct 2001 20:41:25

rrevved ha escrito:

I experienced similar problems with FS2000. And tracked the cause to a
conflict between my two USB devices (joystick and Wheel)
May this be your case?

--

Tony Rickar

Honest opinions... F1 2001?

by Tony Rickar » Wed, 10 Oct 2001 16:20:03

"Stephen Smith"  wrote

You think you'll get away with that gaff using simple fruit, Steve?

Flame him, flame him I say  :-)

Tony

Dave Ryerso

Honest opinions... F1 2001?

by Dave Ryerso » Thu, 11 Oct 2001 00:08:29



>It's because a lot of drivers (mainly nVidia ones) have a setting for
>"use the desktop color depth".

That only applies to the OpenGL drivers. Some games do not switch to
16bit though, even though you have it set to in the game options, and
use your desktop settings.
Phil Le

Honest opinions... F1 2001?

by Phil Le » Thu, 11 Oct 2001 03:13:28


> You didn't run that many laps in GP3 and F1CS2k?  Why - were they that
> difficult, or just that bad?  If they were that bad, why do you think so?
I
> have them both.  I'm not GOOD at them(no surprise), but I think they're

ok...

I'd better start by saying that I buy almost all the race sims around so
that I can post about them at Legends Central if required.  This means that
I have a pretty extensive collection so inevitably sims get left by the way
side.  My main sim of choice is GPL with N4 as a backup.  In the last 3 or 4
months I can't recall running another sim apart from these two.

I didn't run many laps in GP3 because the AI weren't very good plus you
couldn't hear them.  I got fed up with crashing into the AI when I turned in
simply because I had no idea they were there.  I also wasn't a big fan of
the graphics which looked very dated.  I did try the GPxPatch and the
graphical updates but the sim simply didn't appeal to me.

I didn't run many laps in F1CS2k because I didn't like the track graphics,
particularly the arcade style brake boards.  I also didn't like the FF.
Again the sim lacked that certain something to get me e***d.

F1 2001 certainly appears to have appeal at the moment.  I have run 80+ laps
at Silverstone so far working on setups and have really enjoyed it.  The
only other tracks I have run at are Spa and Monacop where I have done a
couple of laps each.  Silverstone just seems right.  It is the only F1 track
I have been to and I was really impressed by some of the details.  For
example, I sat in a stand next to the BRDC building during part of the F1
test day I went to.  That stand is modelled as a track side object and even
has BRDC written in the seats.  A very nice touch that shows atention to
detail.

Cheers

Phil Lee

Legends Central Admin
http://www.racesimcentral.net/

Joe Marque

Honest opinions... F1 2001?

by Joe Marque » Thu, 11 Oct 2001 13:03:02

Glad you like it!  After reading many of your posts over the last couple of
years, I had a feeling you'd be impressed.

Although I haven't played F1 2001 for the PC, I do know that F1 2000 isn't
close to the PS2 F1 2001 in terms of FF, physics, feel and racing fun.
Someone mentioned that the PS2 version was developed in house by EA Sports
and not by ISI.  He claimed that in the credits there is a "special thanks"
to ISI.  Doesn't sound like the developer would thank themselves ;-) so this
must be an EA Sports production.

I haven't checked the credits yet but it makes sense that this is not ISI
based on the fact that the newest PC version has no FF while the PS2 not
only has FF but it's far better than last years PC version.  Hardly absolute
proof but certainly reasonable doubt.

Have fun with F1 2001 for PS2.

--
Joe Marques




> Joe, I just got this thing and I am in the middle of my 'tests'.
> I am SO impressed, I can hardly contain myself. I think a lot
> of people here will simply dismiss this as the 'PS2 version
> of F1-2001 PC'. As you know, nothing could be further off
> the mark. There is no similarity whatsoever. I encourage those
> that haven't seen this on PS2 to ...see it.

> I am more thrilled than a very thrilled thing. Thanks for
> taking the time to give me an idea of what this was like.

> To quote those much younger than myself:

> This r00lz!

> :)

> >Hey rrevved,

> >I'll save you some time with the PS2 versions: EA wins across the board.
> >Here's my comparison:

> >Physics:

> >EA: Feels the way I expect an F1 would except a bit grippy at times and
not
> >enough feeling of inertia when lifting and "gliding" through chicanes.
The
> >feel is one of tremendous power and speed with very tight control.  Easy
to
> >drive but hard to drive extremely well.  Control is very direct and
smooth.
> >FF is good, not GP3 and certainly not GPL but the best F1 after those.

> >Sony: Feels very similar to EA.  Major difference for me is the actual
wheel
> >control (using the Logitech Force GP).  The control isn't as direct or
> >immediate in this one.

> >EA wins here by transferring excellent physics to your hands via control
and
> >decent force feedback.  I did my standard F1 physics test: cut the wheel
and
> >pop into first gear.  This is the "celebration" dance where the car spins
in
> >circles.  EA looked and behaved exactly as expected, spinning around the
> >inside front tire.  Sony felt artificial, spinning slightly, moving
forward
> >and STOPPING then spinning again.  This just didn't feel real.

> >Graphics:

> >EA: I can't believe how good this looks with 22 cars on the track!  GT3
are
> >you listening?  Trade in some eye candy for more cars and damage.  Pure
> >racing experience is far more important than the color of the sky at
sunset.
> >Back to EA, the tracks aren't the most accurate but the graphics are
superb.
> >Great textures, lighting effects, particle effects, etc.  Best F1 visuals
on
> >a console by far.

> >Sony:  Looks dated but certainly still very nice.  Little too much
shimmer
> >and jaggies.  Colors muted and overall darker.  Gameplay impact, it's
harder
> >to see what's ahead.

> >EA wins handily again.

> >Sound:

> >EA: Best sound ever, period.  Won't waste too much time describing since
I
> >think it's not even close.

> >Sony: Sounds like a toy F1, not even close to reality.

> >EA wins again.

> >Gameplay:

> >EA: Bottom line for me: fun.  The AI is a huge improvement over prior
years.
> >Competitive, sometimes daring, far from perfect.  I play sim mode, no
> >driving aids with EASY opponents.  For comparison, my avg. lap at monza
is
> >1:28.  I'm hardly an expert but on easy I'm in the race.  I qualify 12-13
> >and generally stay competitive throughout, finishing anywhere from top 10
to
> >last depending on the day I'm having.  The racing is tight and exciting,
> >probably more exciting than real F1 which is okay for me since 1 hour of
> >lapping alone is not my idea of racing.  I don't mind a slight departure
> >from pure F1 that includes more passing and action but still seems
realistic
> >and credible.  I really enjoy this game.  The challenge mode was a fun
bonus
> >that is worth going back to as a sort of driving school for the newbies.

> >Sony:  The AI is pretty good around the track but I can't get around the
> >first lap!  At monza I've crashed and restarted at least 30 times.  I'm
> >either too fast and rear-ending the car in front or too slow and getting
hit
> >from behind.  I know first turns can be treacherous but this is just
poor.
> >There are still hits and spins in EA but I get through the first chicane
in
> >EA at least 9/10 times.  The lack of a true***pit view is a big
negative
> >for me as well since I never feel like I'm actually IN a car.

> >EA takes this category as well.

> >Overall:

> >EA is my choice for best modern F1.  I won't spend anymore time with GP3
on
> >the computer since EA on my TV looks better (amazing considering the PC
> >resolution advantage), feels just as good if not better and is more fun
and
> >immersive.

Stephen Ferguso

Honest opinions... F1 2001?

by Stephen Ferguso » Thu, 11 Oct 2001 16:14:43

Rrevved,

When you've thrashed it around a bit, please post some in-depth comments.
Personally, as a notebook user, I cannot justify purchasing a desktop just
to run a game (which is what it would probably take to do the PC version
justice), but there is a conspicuously empty space under my TV which as of
yet does not contain a DVD player, and the PS2 just dropped to 440 SFr
(about 260 USD) here in Switzerland, and with WRC just around the corner as
well...

However, the F1 games to date on the PS2 (F1RC, Sony's F1-2001) left me flat
after a few laps.  There was no comparison to the perceived realism of a
PC-based sim.  Sure, GP3 is ugly as a brick compared to the newer PS2 and PC
games, but I still have a great feel of leaning on the car on a hot lap, and
of dicing with proper opponents (especially in GP3-2000).  GPL with all the
graphical updates still leaves me breathless, and I've yet to find a console
rally sim which approaches RallyMasters for car feel.

So, give me a shout when you come up for air.

Stephen




> Joe, I just got this thing and I am in the middle of my 'tests'.
> I am SO impressed, I can hardly contain myself. I think a lot
> of people here will simply dismiss this as the 'PS2 version
> of F1-2001 PC'. As you know, nothing could be further off
> the mark. There is no similarity whatsoever. I encourage those
> that haven't seen this on PS2 to ...see it.

> I am more thrilled than a very thrilled thing. Thanks for
> taking the time to give me an idea of what this was like.

> To quote those much younger than myself:

> This r00lz!

> :)

> >Hey rrevved,

> >I'll save you some time with the PS2 versions: EA wins across the board.
> >Here's my comparison:

> >Physics:

> >EA: Feels the way I expect an F1 would except a bit grippy at times and
not
> >enough feeling of inertia when lifting and "gliding" through chicanes.
The
> >feel is one of tremendous power and speed with very tight control.  Easy
to
> >drive but hard to drive extremely well.  Control is very direct and
smooth.
> >FF is good, not GP3 and certainly not GPL but the best F1 after those.

> >Sony: Feels very similar to EA.  Major difference for me is the actual
wheel
> >control (using the Logitech Force GP).  The control isn't as direct or
> >immediate in this one.

> >EA wins here by transferring excellent physics to your hands via control
and
> >decent force feedback.  I did my standard F1 physics test: cut the wheel
and
> >pop into first gear.  This is the "celebration" dance where the car spins
in
> >circles.  EA looked and behaved exactly as expected, spinning around the
> >inside front tire.  Sony felt artificial, spinning slightly, moving
forward
> >and STOPPING then spinning again.  This just didn't feel real.

> >Graphics:

> >EA: I can't believe how good this looks with 22 cars on the track!  GT3
are
> >you listening?  Trade in some eye candy for more cars and damage.  Pure
> >racing experience is far more important than the color of the sky at
sunset.
> >Back to EA, the tracks aren't the most accurate but the graphics are
superb.
> >Great textures, lighting effects, particle effects, etc.  Best F1 visuals
on
> >a console by far.

> >Sony:  Looks dated but certainly still very nice.  Little too much
shimmer
> >and jaggies.  Colors muted and overall darker.  Gameplay impact, it's
harder
> >to see what's ahead.

> >EA wins handily again.

> >Sound:

> >EA: Best sound ever, period.  Won't waste too much time describing since
I
> >think it's not even close.

> >Sony: Sounds like a toy F1, not even close to reality.

> >EA wins again.

> >Gameplay:

> >EA: Bottom line for me: fun.  The AI is a huge improvement over prior
years.
> >Competitive, sometimes daring, far from perfect.  I play sim mode, no
> >driving aids with EASY opponents.  For comparison, my avg. lap at monza
is
> >1:28.  I'm hardly an expert but on easy I'm in the race.  I qualify 12-13
> >and generally stay competitive throughout, finishing anywhere from top 10
to
> >last depending on the day I'm having.  The racing is tight and exciting,
> >probably more exciting than real F1 which is okay for me since 1 hour of
> >lapping alone is not my idea of racing.  I don't mind a slight departure
> >from pure F1 that includes more passing and action but still seems
realistic
> >and credible.  I really enjoy this game.  The challenge mode was a fun
bonus
> >that is worth going back to as a sort of driving school for the newbies.

> >Sony:  The AI is pretty good around the track but I can't get around the
> >first lap!  At monza I've crashed and restarted at least 30 times.  I'm
> >either too fast and rear-ending the car in front or too slow and getting
hit
> >from behind.  I know first turns can be treacherous but this is just
poor.
> >There are still hits and spins in EA but I get through the first chicane
in
> >EA at least 9/10 times.  The lack of a true***pit view is a big
negative
> >for me as well since I never feel like I'm actually IN a car.

> >EA takes this category as well.

> >Overall:

> >EA is my choice for best modern F1.  I won't spend anymore time with GP3
on
> >the computer since EA on my TV looks better (amazing considering the PC
> >resolution advantage), feels just as good if not better and is more fun
and
> >immersive.

Damien Smit

Honest opinions... F1 2001?

by Damien Smit » Thu, 11 Oct 2001 19:22:48

Heh, GPL, GP3 and Rally Masters - all games that I hated at first but now I
can't get enough of them.  Can't wait to try F1 2001 - PC or PS2 if it's as
great as people say it is.
Eldre

Honest opinions... F1 2001?

by Eldre » Sat, 13 Oct 2001 09:55:31




>> You didn't run that many laps in GP3 and F1CS2k?  Why - were they that
>> difficult, or just that bad?  If they were that bad, why do you think so?
>I
>> have them both.  I'm not GOOD at them(no surprise), but I think they're
>ok...

>I'd better start by saying that I buy almost all the race sims around so
>that I can post about them at Legends Central if required.  This means that
>I have a pretty extensive collection so inevitably sims get left by the way
>side.  My main sim of choice is GPL with N4 as a backup.  In the last 3 or 4
>months I can't recall running another sim apart from these two.

That's cool.  Most of the time(when I *have* time), I'm running GPL.

Maybe I knew the AI was there because I'm used to being lapped, and thus use my
mirrors more than you?<g>
I guess I never got good enough to actually RACE with the AI.  Or, I attributed
any accidents to my lack of skill.  I haven't run the GPxPatch yet.

It's probable that I didn't notice the graphics in F1CS2K because I was too
busy just trying to stay on the TRACK.<g>  I don't have a FF wheel, so that's
not an issue.

Eldred
--
Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001
Homepage - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~epickett
F1 hcp. +16.36...Monster +360.54...

Never argue with an idiot.  He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Damien Smit

Honest opinions... F1 2001?

by Damien Smit » Tue, 16 Oct 2001 08:14:18

The AI cars in GP3 aren't too bad - if you're too aggressive, you'll be
pounded.  The 3D sound in GP32000 does make quite a difference - much easier
to hear when a car is making an overly ambitious overtaking manoeuvre.

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