rec.autos.simulators

Rest in Peace Ratzenberger and Senna. Stay in Hell FIA White Sharks.

Tim Wheatle

Rest in Peace Ratzenberger and Senna. Stay in Hell FIA White Sharks.

by Tim Wheatle » Thu, 29 Apr 1999 04:00:00

Great Stats, great memories.

Senna and Ratzenberger I agree, should not of died.

On the two days of 'that' weekend I watched two people die on Live
Television, it made a mark on me which has not been removed, it hurt me, it
damaged me, and it dis-orientated me as to what life and living was.

You seem to have the crash statistics sorted out, what about the factor that
affects 99% of racing fatalities? The freak factor.
Freak Accidents happen my friend, if Formula One is to be 100% safe, then
let us stop it now, and all other motorsport, let motorsport be no more, let
us ban cars, ban journey's, let us all live in padded safe rooms where
nothing can hurt us. NO, that isn't it is it! Motorsport IS DANGEROUS, the
FIA make mistakes, but then again so do ALL Formula One driver's, I saw
Senna spin MANY MANY times, and 1994 was one of the FIA's 'spins.' We all
make mistakes, don't let the memory of 1st May 1994 bring anger, let it
bring memories of the man who made Formula One interesting to me up until
1st May 1994, the man who could make Michael Andretti look second ratein
1993, the man that I believe was THE greatest driver I ever had the pleasure
of having signed my t-shirt when i graced Silverstone with my presence, Let
1st May bring memories - Not anger.

Tim

--
________________________________________________

                                  Tim Wheatley
                "Yellow menacing helmet in the mirror"
                           http://www.racesimcentral.net/
    IGPS Driver - Ferrari Challenge Driver - NTT Participant
                      http://www.racesimcentral.net/

                  http://www.racesimcentral.net/~nascar
________________________________________________

Matthew Birger Knutse

Rest in Peace Ratzenberger and Senna. Stay in Hell FIA White Sharks.

by Matthew Birger Knutse » Thu, 29 Apr 1999 04:00:00


> Saturday will be 1 of May of 1994, pardon, of 1999

> Rest in Peace Ratzenberger and Senna.

FIY, mathematics and longer front ends can never stop a part of a rod
end flying through a drivers visor and through his eye, killing him.
This is what happened to Senna. A one in a million occurrence. I'm no
great fan of FIA either, but blaming them for Senna & Ratzenbergers
deaths are far fetched.
Senna would have been just fine if not for that little metal shrapnel.
As for Roland, he broke his neck. Motorsports is dangerous, has always
been, and will always be.

I also seem to remember a HUGE chicane in the place where Senna was
killed, built the year after that black weekend.
Check your refs before spamming next time, please!

Matt

--

Matthew Knutsen

"The Art of Legends" - GPL add-ons
http://www.cheekracing.electra.no/GPL/

Jarn

Rest in Peace Ratzenberger and Senna. Stay in Hell FIA White Sharks.

by Jarn » Thu, 29 Apr 1999 04:00:00

Senna and Ratzenberger both knew what the risks where if they didnt want to die
they shouldnt have been in motorsports

cya,
Jarno


> Saturday will be 1 of May of 1994, pardon, of 1999

> Rest in Peace Ratzenberger and Senna.

> Stay in Hell FIA White Sharks (you can find them at http://www.fia.com)

herb..

Rest in Peace Ratzenberger and Senna. Stay in Hell FIA White Sharks.

by herb.. » Thu, 29 Apr 1999 04:00:00


> Saturday will be 1 of May of 1994, pardon, of 1999

> Rest in Peace Ratzenberger and Senna.

> 6. Vinitial_braking_Senna=300Km/h, Gbraking_Senna=-3.75g so
> delta_x_braking_Senna=(300/3.6)^2 / (2*3.75*9.81)= 94 m and Senna escape was 5
> (FIVE) meters long. Deus o tenha!

My understanding was that he was a virtually unmarked corpse
and that the accident was completely survivable except that
the right front wheel pivoted around one unbroken upper
suspension piece and caught him right in the head (crushed
helmet just above eyehole).  Current spec F1 cars reputedly
would leave him with nothing but a lot of aches.
John Walla

Rest in Peace Ratzenberger and Senna. Stay in Hell FIA White Sharks.

by John Walla » Thu, 29 Apr 1999 04:00:00


>Saturday will be 1 of May of 1994, pardon, of 1999
>Rest in Peace Ratzenberger and Senna.
>Stay in Hell FIA White Sharks (you can find them at http://www.racesimcentral.net/)

To the best of my knowledge no-one (not even Bernie) controls fate,
and fate is what killed both Senna and Ratzenberger.

In the case of Senna no-one in the world knew better than he did what
risks he would face if he got in the***pit. A difficult car, an
emotional weekend, a tough opponent, an expectant audience. The final
judge of whether or not to risk YOUR life is you, and any driver can
walk away at any point as we have seen Prost and Lauda do in the past.

There was no-one like Senna before and certainly not since, and I've
missed him greatly in the races. Nothing could make be blame the
accident on anyone though - it was simply that, an accident.

To be honest I find your diatribe on the FIA quite disturbing.

Cheers!
John

Tim Wheatle

Rest in Peace Ratzenberger and Senna. Stay in Hell FIA White Sharks.

by Tim Wheatle » Fri, 30 Apr 1999 04:00:00

Another point, if there was no FIA, where would safety be in Formula One? It
wouldn't exist.

Tim

--
________________________________________________

                                  Tim Wheatley
                "Yellow menacing helmet in the mirror"
                           http://start.at/igps_stats
    IGPS Driver - Ferrari Challenge Driver - NTT Participant
                      http://drive.to/grandprixlegends

                  http://website.lineone.net/~nascar
________________________________________________

Stephen Gree

Rest in Peace Ratzenberger and Senna. Stay in Hell FIA White Sharks.

by Stephen Gree » Fri, 30 Apr 1999 04:00:00


>Great Stats, great memories.

>Senna and Ratzenberger I agree, should not of died.

<SNIP SNIP SNIP>

Nicely put Tim, I could not have said it better.

SteveG

Jim Bob, Budd

Rest in Peace Ratzenberger and Senna. Stay in Hell FIA White Sharks.

by Jim Bob, Budd » Fri, 30 Apr 1999 04:00:00

I was in Hockenheim, Germany on the day that
Jim Clark died in a silly little Formula 2 or 3
race.  Hit a tree on the long straight.  Thousands
of people in the stands crying.  That was over
thirty years ago and it's still clear to me.

I've raced sprint cars since I was 17 and have lost
some friends.

Come to think of it, I lost more in Vietnam and none
of them wanted to be there.

Life goes on.

Rich Koehle

Rest in Peace Ratzenberger and Senna. Stay in Hell FIA White Sharks.

by Rich Koehle » Fri, 30 Apr 1999 04:00:00


> Great Stats, great memories.

> Senna and Ratzenberger I agree, should not of died.

> On the two days of 'that' weekend I watched two people die on Live
> Television, it made a mark on me which has not been removed, it hurt me, it
> damaged me, and it dis-orientated me as to what life and living was.

> You seem to have the crash statistics sorted out, what about the factor that
> affects 99% of racing fatalities? The freak factor.
> Tim

> --
> ________________________________________________

That person has been posting under various names ever since Senna's
accident. He always posts pages and pages of equations and blames
the FIA. Normally I catch his posts in rec.autos.sport.nascar (I
thought Senna was in F1 :-). Looks like he's spread out now. He is
in need of psychiatric help. I can only imagine what he would post
if Senna had been a soccer player! God forbid!

My feeling is that Senna was not forced into the car and thus he
bears as much responsibility, much more so to me, as anyone else.

He posts about every two months or so. Watch for him!

--
Rich Koehler
rgkoehler(at)lucent(dot)com
killerk(at)home(dot)com

John Walla

Rest in Peace Ratzenberger and Senna. Stay in Hell FIA White Sharks.

by John Walla » Fri, 30 Apr 1999 04:00:00


>ayrton senna was at times a very uncalcuable pilot......his many on
>track shunts have been well documented...as well as his unserviceable
>attitude towards his fellow racers.When you strive as hard as he did to
>be the best.....you leave many people in your wake......i remember one
>instance very well at portugal in 1990 when he purposely ran allessandro
>nannini off the road and to me....that said alot about his sportmansship
>and his laizez fare attitude when he got behind the wheel.

You obviously don't remember the instance all that well, since as far
as memory serves me Nannini finished 6th in Portugal and wasn't even
lapped - I don't think he was close to Senna in the whole race.

Perhaps you're thinking of Alliot closing the door on Mansell and
spinning off into the armco?

Tire pressure is monitored and would have been noticed if it was
leaking at all.

The track sloped upward at the edge and served to launch the cars over
the first portion of the gravel trap, thereby minimising any effect it
could have. There was minimal run off. There was a concrete wall. It
was an accident, and a freak one at that, but to say the track didn't
have anything to do with it is plain wrong.

Cheers!
John

Tim Wheatle

Rest in Peace Ratzenberger and Senna. Stay in Hell FIA White Sharks.

by Tim Wheatle » Fri, 30 Apr 1999 04:00:00

Gravel trap? there was NO gravel trap at Tambarello in 1994.

Tim

--
________________________________________________

                                  Tim Wheatley
                "Yellow menacing helmet in the mirror"
                           http://start.at/igps_stats
    IGPS Driver - Ferrari Challenge Driver - NTT Participant
                      http://drive.to/grandprixlegends

                  http://website.lineone.net/~nascar
________________________________________________

UnserFan

Rest in Peace Ratzenberger and Senna. Stay in Hell FIA White Sharks.

by UnserFan » Sat, 01 May 1999 04:00:00

True... but if you think that's dangerous, take a look back to the tracks of
the past.  I don't think that the old 14 mile Nburgring is safe to drive on at
60 mph, much less 160 (like you could go that fast there!!!  <g>)  But I'm
gonna have to say that I think that Imola should stay on the schedule as it is
a well-designed, competitive race track, unlike Estoril IMHO....

Dan Belcher
Team Racing Unlimited


rec.autos.simulators is a usenet newsgroup formed in December, 1993. As this group was always unmoderated there may be some spam or off topic articles included. Some links do point back to racesimcentral.net as we could not validate the original address. Please report any pages that you believe warrant deletion from this archive (include the link in your email). RaceSimCentral.net is in no way responsible and does not endorse any of the content herein.