rec.autos.simulators

Help setting up Momo FF

Gary Bear

Help setting up Momo FF

by Gary Bear » Sat, 27 Dec 2003 07:39:07

Happy holidays all,
I received a Logitech Momo for Christmas, and have is set up, but I feel
very little, if any, ff while driving.  The only thing I feel is hitting a
wall or another car.  I have been playing NR2002 & DTR2.  Is there a setting
somewhere that I am missing?  I have the strength up to 97%, Damping to 0
and latency to 65ms (I believe) as per a web page I checked for specific
settings.  I'll check the settings in Windows and see if something there
helps, but if there's something I'm missing, please let me know.

--
Happy Holidays,
Gary Beard

1.4 ghz Athlon
128 Mb RAM
Win98se

Bob

Help setting up Momo FF

by Bob » Sat, 27 Dec 2003 11:10:09

Do a Google search on MOMO settings.  There have been quite a few posts
previously made that might be helpful.

Bob


Gary Bear

Help setting up Momo FF

by Gary Bear » Sat, 27 Dec 2003 11:51:07

Bob,
Should I feel more than just contact with a wall or car?  I seem to feel a
bit when going over some of the grass at Infineon, but it's not everywhere
and all the tracks feel as smooth as glass.
My real question is, should I be feeling more than this, or is this all that
is programmed into these games?  I really feel nothing in DTR2 other than
contact with other cars or walls.  Thanks again.

Happy Holidays,
Gary Beard

Mitch_

Help setting up Momo FF

by Mitch_ » Sat, 27 Dec 2003 12:21:04

You can get get more than enough effects in NR2003 but the problems is
most of these effects are just that and actually make it feel worse.

this adequately you need to turn down the effects until you find a
balance between notchy and weak feedback.  As Bob said do a  google
groups search for momo and sphanky.  Its about what I run now but I dont
have the .txt on the BeBox so cant post it ;)

Mitch

<<<<----Posted using Pineapple News for BeOS ---->>>>


> Bob,
> Should I feel more than just contact with a wall or car?  I seem to
> feel a
> bit when going over some of the grass at Infineon, but it's not
> everywhere
> and all the tracks feel as smooth as glass.
> My real question is, should I be feeling more than this, or is this
> all that
> is programmed into these games?  I really feel nothing in DTR2 other
> than
> contact with other cars or walls.  Thanks again.

> Happy Holidays,
> Gary Beard

Dave Henri

Help setting up Momo FF

by Dave Henri » Sat, 27 Dec 2003 12:26:43

   With the EA/ISI F1 sims and their mod's, you'll want to set the strength to
NEGATIVE values.  So instead of 67% you would set it to -67%.
This is not so with nr2k3 or other sims.  
  Calibrate in windows, then in the game.
Alot of what you do or do not feel comes from how the sim was programed.
So simple programs may not have much more than rumble strips or walls.
While other programs will have quite a-bit more.

dave henrie

B. Jon

Help setting up Momo FF

by B. Jon » Sat, 27 Dec 2003 13:49:34

Congrats on the Momo.
Many folks on this newsgroup say that the optimal setting for FF with
the Momo is in the negative range, for some odd reason. So, instead of
97%, try -97%.

> Happy holidays all,
> I received a Logitech Momo for Christmas, and have is set up, but I feel
> very little, if any, ff while driving.  The only thing I feel is hitting a
> wall or another car.  I have been playing NR2002 & DTR2.  Is there a setting
> somewhere that I am missing?  I have the strength up to 97%, Damping to 0
> and latency to 65ms (I believe) as per a web page I checked for specific
> settings.  I'll check the settings in Windows and see if something there
> helps, but if there's something I'm missing, please let me know.

Bamada

Help setting up Momo FF

by Bamada » Sat, 27 Dec 2003 13:55:27

<snip>

Here's the text that Mitch posted for me a while back.
Dan

Start/Settings/Control Panel/Game Controllers.

Then..

Double Left Click on the MOMO, then click the Settings button (bottom
right).

Then set these options...

Combined - unticked (ie: no checkmark) [this allows your brake and gas
pedals to be on a separate axis, which is important to have]

Enable Force Feedback - ticked (ie: checkmark it) [this allows force
feedback in games duh]

Overall Effects Strength - 97% [the reason for 97% and NOT 100% is a long
and complicated explanation, but in short it helps oscillations from
happening]

Spring Effects Strength - 0% [no Papyrus sims use this setting and oddly
enough, if you set it to anything other than 0% you will get undesirable
effects]

Damper Effects Strength - 0% [very VERY important to set this to 0%, this is
probably THE most important setting, as it will greatly increase notchiness
and wheel twitches, even though the Papyrus sims do not exactly enable it]

Enable Centering Spring - ticked [you are going to find this strange,
because in the next setting I tell you to set it to 0%, which is odd because
why not just untick it? well, there's a reason and here it is... if you
don't tick this option and also don't have Damping set -which if your going
with these settings you won't- then a strange phenomenon happens, you will
find that if you turn your wheel rather sharply, the resistance of the wheel
just "gives out" which is not something you want to happen. I will also
admit that having this unchecked does appear to give slightly better
forces -SLIGHTLY- but the repercussions just aren't worth it for the payoff.
so in the end check this option]

Centering Spring Strength - 0% [this is IMPORTANT! i know it's weird, but
you must set it to 0% -  read above option for better explanation]

Then in your Logitech Wingman Profiler, create a Nascar 2003 profile and
then set these settings as follows...

Steering Wheel Sensitivity to 33% [the reason you want to go down from the
default 50% to 33% is because at 50% the wheel is too sensitive to tiny
wheel adjustments... which is not realistic. drive your car and notice how
far you have to turn your wheel... the MOMO have a large radius to turn,
it's a shame most people only move it 5 degrees to either side. this setting
should allow more precise driving and overall smoothness as well - and you
can go down even lower if you wish, to say, 25% if you want to have even
more movement, but i suggest 33% for starters at least, get used to that and
go more later if you like the effect]

Steering Wheel Dead Zone - 2% [another long explanation would be needed and
I don't feel like telling, but in short this also helps oscillations and
twitchiness]

Accelerator Sensitivity - 55% [strangely, this option is the exact opposite
of the Steering, INCREASING this option from the default 50% to 55% makes
the gas less sensitive to the immediate input, in other words, you have to
push down farther before the car gets more power. the default 50% is a
little touchy - when you barely touch the pedal the car can spin out. 55%
helps this from happening and overall gives a more natural and fine tune
approach]

Accelerator Dead Zone - 2% [much the same reasoning as above, this helps
from keeping your car getting to much gas too fast]

Brake Sensitivity - 55% [exact same reasons as accelerator, increasing this
to 55% helps your brakes from locking up to fast. one word of note though is
that I have modified my brake pedal to include the squash ball instead of
the spring, so that may make a difference in your setup. just note that
increasing this gives less immediate braking and can help if your tires are
locking up too easily under braking]

Brake Dead Zone - 2% [same reasons as all the others dead zones]

Now, in Nascar 2003, enable the Force Feedback option under the Controls tab
and you should run this setting in between 35-65 (50 being most common
setting) depending on the track and more importantly, on your setup for that
track. I know this is a pain to have to do at each individual track, but
depending on your setup you will need to adjust the strength of the forces
in game between each track change.

Just start out from 50 and work from there. the key to adjusting strength is
this... if the wheel has a "notchy" feel, lower the setting till it JUST
goes away, if it doesn't have a notchy feel, then raise it till you feel the
notchyness and then lower it till it just goes away again. In essence giving
you the most forces while remaining smooth.

Leave Damping completely off in game... but *IF* and only if you are
oscillating exiting a corner on the straight, then you can slightly and
slowly increase it in game till you stop oscillating, but I doubt many of
you will have oscillation problems because the settings we set up earlier
should rid you of any. This is the only good thing Damping is good for, so
try not to use it unless you have to because it hurts your performance
elsewhere. and again, NEVER EVER EVER use the Damping setting in windows,
the one found in the control panel... and only use the in-game damping if
you absolutely must (as this can mask the real forces and it also increases
notchiness by a factor of 3 fold).

Leave latency off in game (0%). It only provides fake and incorrect forces
at usually the wrong time anyways and can definitely get in the way of
things and effect the overall impressions of the wheel with the rest of
these settings described here. if you honestly feel like forces are
literally coming too late (which I find very hard to believe) and you feel
like you absolutely have to add to this setting, go ahead and increase it...
with 25 being your absolute max (15 the preferred max) and 0% being the
optimal.

Gary Bear

Help setting up Momo FF

by Gary Bear » Sun, 28 Dec 2003 00:15:51

Dan,
I noticed that post and set my system up as he suggested.  But I'm running
NR2002, not 2003 and I was really wondering how good the ff is in NR2002 to
determine if I'm feeling all there is to feel.  I can't feel the car get
loose which is what I wanted the ff for.  Thanks for your help though, I
printed that message for future reference.

--
Happy Holidays,
Gary Beard

rcmr

Help setting up Momo FF

by rcmr » Sun, 28 Dec 2003 00:17:25

Does all of this apply to the Momo Racing (black) or just to the Momo
Force (red)?

I have a new Momo Racing (black) and it seems to do fine with NR2003
with no profile at all in the Logitech profiler. Admittedly I am not
very experienced with the subject, but I thought I had read elsewhere
that Logitech profiler adjustments were not necessary for the black
Momo.

<snip>

j[nospam]ca..

Help setting up Momo FF

by j[nospam]ca.. » Sun, 28 Dec 2003 11:22:53

As someone mentioned previously,

Get on google, and go back at least 1 year and search this newsgroup.
There were a lot of posts some time ago with long
dialogues/suggestions about setting up a Momo Racing in N2002 and GPL.

I spent the better part of a sat afternoon dialing it in, and I like
it *alot*.  Nice amount of feedback with the wheel responding in a way
i would imagine a real wheel would respond.  For example, when I go
over hills in GPL or N2002 (road courses), the wheel actually gives
very nicely as the suspension gives way and the grip falls off.

Using someone else value's is not all that helpful.  Your settings
(particularly latency), are highly dependent on your system (i.e. how
fast it is).  So you need to understand what all the settings are for,
then you start tweaking them, 1 at a time, until you got all three
dialed in to your liking.  And this may take awhile, but for me it was
well worth the effort.

good luck,
jeff



Bamada

Help setting up Momo FF

by Bamada » Sun, 28 Dec 2003 13:46:27

The settings as posted worked well for me in NR2002 Gary. I've done a little
tweaking since installing NR03. I agree with Jeff about tweaking the latency
first to see if that heps the feel.
Good luck
Dan
bhoeni

Help setting up Momo FF

by bhoeni » Sun, 28 Dec 2003 23:08:27

Whether to use the Profiler is all a matter of prerference, really.  And it's
probably sim-dependent, as well.  For example, I use the Profiler for GPL, but I
don't use it for NR2003.  You have to experiment with and without and go with the
best feel for you.  (BTW -- I have a MOMO Force [red case, black wheel]).

> Does all of this apply to the Momo Racing (black) or just to the Momo
> Force (red)?

> I have a new Momo Racing (black) and it seems to do fine with NR2003
> with no profile at all in the Logitech profiler. Admittedly I am not
> very experienced with the subject, but I thought I had read elsewhere
> that Logitech profiler adjustments were not necessary for the black
> Momo.

> <snip>
> > >For the MOMO people, do this.

> > Start/Settings/Control Panel/Game Controllers.

> > Then..

> > Double Left Click on the MOMO, then click the Settings button (bottom
> > right).

> > Then set these options...

> > Combined - unticked (ie: no checkmark) [this allows your brake and gas
> > pedals to be on a separate axis, which is important to have]

> > Enable Force Feedback - ticked (ie: checkmark it) [this allows force
> > feedback in games duh]

> > Overall Effects Strength - 97% [the reason for 97% and NOT 100% is a long
> > and complicated explanation, but in short it helps oscillations from
> > happening]

> > Spring Effects Strength - 0% [no Papyrus sims use this setting and oddly
> > enough, if you set it to anything other than 0% you will get undesirable
> > effects]

> > Damper Effects Strength - 0% [very VERY important to set this to 0%, this is
> > probably THE most important setting, as it will greatly increase notchiness
> > and wheel twitches, even though the Papyrus sims do not exactly enable it]

> > <snip>

Mitch_

Help setting up Momo FF

by Mitch_ » Tue, 30 Dec 2003 13:39:34

There is settings in multiple locations.  He does want to use 97% for the
Windows control panel/game
controllers/Momo/settings/Overall_effects_strength and also 97% in NR2002
efffect strength.  In ISI sims I also crank up spring effects strength and
Centering spring force to around 20%.  I dont think Ive ever used the
latency option in any game.  Inside ISI based sim/mod he wants to set the
controller strength to a negative number.  I use -100.  In the DTM mod we
now have a bunch of more advanced controller settings beyond whats in
previous mods but I really havent played with em yet.   I also use the Logi
profiler which gives me a bunch more options including the contol panel
settings under global options.

Mitch


> Congrats on the Momo.
> Many folks on this newsgroup say that the optimal setting for FF with
> the Momo is in the negative range, for some odd reason. So, instead of
> 97%, try -97%.




Gary Bear

Help setting up Momo FF

by Gary Bear » Tue, 30 Dec 2003 14:13:03

Happy holidays all,
My play time is getting much more enjoyable as I am figuring out this wheel
slowly but surely.  With all your help I'm understanding these settings a
bit more and once I figured out I needed to reverse the polarity on the
wheel it's been a lot easier to figure out :-)
Thanks again for all the help.

--
Happy Holidays,
Gary Beard


rec.autos.simulators is a usenet newsgroup formed in December, 1993. As this group was always unmoderated there may be some spam or off topic articles included. Some links do point back to racesimcentral.net as we could not validate the original address. Please report any pages that you believe warrant deletion from this archive (include the link in your email). RaceSimCentral.net is in no way responsible and does not endorse any of the content herein.