rec.autos.simulators

* A tow truck that doesn't have a cloaking device
* A More realistic Pit Row, no wonder the stops are slow, my crew have  
to get their tools beamed over from those rigs!
* Wrecks that do not atomize themselves..but remain on the track until
somebody cleans up the mess, and a couple of wrecker-trucks stopping in
the general area with a few corner workers would be grand...

* More realistic sound effects (i.e random noises when engine or parts
of the car break, like knocking noises, hissing, scraping.., some diff
noise would be great..)
* More realistic breakdowns; flat tires without wearing them out, leaks
and other technicalities that can be fixed....race stoppage because of
rain:)), chips in the windscreen

All details, really:)) Can't complain!!!

Matt

--
------------------------------
Matthew Birger Patrick Knutsen
(http://www.racesimcentral.net/~matthebk)
"Racing cars is like dancing with a chainsaw"
-Cale Yarborough
Cheek Racing Cars (http://www.racesimcentral.net/~kareknut/)

Please Remove "NoSpam" from my E-mail adress when replying!
-------------------------------

I would like the next version of NASCAR allow you to climb from your
car and go rip the ARMS OFF the guy who just stuffed you into the
wall. Now that would be cool, especially in those pick up races.

Would you really want to sit through this event taking place? I think
most people would agree that sometimes sitting through the pace laps and
yellows are long enough. I can't imagine sitting at my computer, waiting
for the game to clean up the race track. I think the best part of it
being a simulation is that you can lessen some of the less glamorous
parts of racing.

race stoppage because of

again, do you want to be sitting there waiting for simulated rain to
stop falling? Do we get doppler with this?

I think more realism is great, but i think Papy's attention is better
spent on AI.

Jason Hamlett
Hamlett 0n Ten

What I saw on the preview video on the BGN track pack CD actually
didn't look as bad as I was expecting...

l8r
ronny

--
          |\      _,,,---,,_        I want to die like my Grandfather,
   ZZZzz /,`.-'`'    -.  ;-;;,_              in his sleep.
        |,4-  ) )-,_. ,\ (  `'-'     Not like the people in his car,
       '---''(_/--'  `-'\_)            screaming their heads off!

I would find it no more naff to end the race because of rain, wait for
wrecks to clean up etc, than having "something let go in my engine"
after 250 laps...but I still run with that option on. And it happened to
me today, and I still play N2, because it's pretty realistic...

Best,

Matt
--
------------------------------
Matthew Birger Patrick Knutsen
(http://sofus.hiof.no/~matthebk)
"Racing cars is like dancing with a chainsaw"
-Cale Yarborough
Cheek Racing Cars (http://home.sn.no/~kareknut/)

Please Remove "NoSpam" from my E-mail adress when replying!
-------------------------------

MW

Its not just a visual representation of your input, instead its more of
a mix of this input and the car's response to this input.  With it you
can 'feel' how the car is reacting much better than in any other sim to
date.  It just 'feels right', but until you've sat down and played it,
I'm not sure I ever accurately describe the sensation.

I sincerely hope that people don't go into this game with their minds
made up that they are going to hate the arms.  Like you, I couldn't
imagine how they could add anything to the game.  But after playing GPL,
I can't imagine playing without them.  Give it a chance, I think you'll
be pleasantly surprised...

--
Eric T. Busch

http://ebusch.akorn.net

Hypothetically speaking

</Inside Papyrus joke>

Let's say that 80% of the future GPL buyers don't have a steering wheel.
They will find this feature very very interesting. Papyrus is aiming very
big for GPL. This was a fact why some projects at papy were let down (N2
Manager, etc..).  They want GPL to be their Queen piece in the simracing
chess game against the other company.

I am "pro-Pay hands" and I know it will be a great feature for the game.
Some say "I don't want to see 4 hands".  Like if you will not buy it for
that. <g>.  We are maybe the best customers for Papyrus but not the mass
critic.  Do you really think that the 500 000 (+ the full installation
copys) people that buyed Nascar1 had a wheel for playing ??  If I had a
joystick or racing with my keyboard, I would be very happy about this
feature. SODA had a "preview" of those hand, and even if they weren't not
great I liked them.

Btw Eric, you really played GPL ?? you lucky SOB ! ! ! ! ;-)

With great respect,
May the downforce be with you,
Good race at the Brickyard,  (-o-)

Fran?ois Mnard, "ymenard" on NROS
Team member, Zombie Entreprise
Sponsored by AWPSS, http://www.awpss.com/

SimRacing director,  AWPSS
Official PR,         AWPSS
Director,            The SimRacing Hall-of-Fame
Co-director,         Light-Speed

- *Excuse me for my poor English(I'm French speaking) * -

you have some very good points here. how can we send them to the makers
of nascar 3?

ss

I admire Papyrus for their work, but instead of spending time on those
hands etc, how about adding:

* A tow truck that doesn't have a cloaking device
* A More realistic Pit Row, no wonder the stops are slow, my crew have
to get their tools beamed over from those rigs!
* Wrecks that do not atomize themselves..but remain on the track until
somebody cleans up the mess, and a couple of wrecker-trucks stopping in
the general area with a few corner workers would be grand...

* More realistic sound effects (i.e random noises when engine or parts
of the car break, like knocking noises, hissing, scraping.., some diff
noise would be great..)
* More realistic breakdowns; flat tires without wearing them out, leaks
and other technicalities that can be fixed....race stoppage because of
rain:)), chips in the windscreen

All details, really:)) Can't complain!!!

Matt

l8er
ronny

--
          |\      _,,,---,,_        I want to die like my Grandfather,
   ZZZzz /,`.-'`'    -.  ;-;;,_              in his sleep.
        |,4-  ) )-,_. ,\ (  `'-'     Not like the people in his car,
       '---''(_/--'  `-'\_)            screaming their heads off!

That's exactly right and here's my open statement to Papyrus.  "I won't buy
anything that purports to be a "simulator" that has onscreen hands.  I already
have Test Drive II" So there.

You know, all this rationalization reminds me of the hoopla that went on when
it was "learned" that N2 wasn't going to have a "speedometer" (as if any
Winston Cup car ever did).  Papyrus made the correct move then, with a one-key
'off' switch that's saved in your prefrences.  If common sense prevails, that's
what will happen here.

MW

i hope that is what happens here (with n3)

You know, all this rationalization reminds me of the hoopla that went on
when
it was "learned" that N2 wasn't going to have a "speedometer" (as if any

Winston Cup car ever did).  Papyrus made the correct move then, with a
one-key
'off' switch that's saved in your prefrences.  If common sense prevails,
that's
what will happen here.

%    I don't think we need rain in N3, (although they ran in the rain in
% practice and qualifying at Sukuka).  It would be nice to have a
% windsheilf that gets progressivly dirty, or sun glare, some of the
% things NASCAR drivers have to contend with on a regular basis.  With
% computer getting faster all the time, and 3dfx cards, etc, I don't see
% why any of this wouldn't be possible (I believe sun glare was excluded
% from NASCAR 2 because the hardware wasn't quite up to par for
% handeling it when the game was released.)

Let's see.... Falcon 3.0 (circa 1991) did a find job of modeling
sunglare in the***pit as well as the view (well that is once they got
the bug worked out that had the sun on the wrong horizion for the day of
time).  I think it was just one of the things that made the cutting room
floor in order to get the product out.  
--
**************************** Michael E. Carver *************************
     Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./.  [-  < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

<snip discussion on N3 wants/don't wants>
% >
% >I think more realism is great, but i think Papy's attention is better
% >spent on AI.

% After racing on NROS, the AI will never be realistic enough for me.

While I can't argue your point.  Papyrus could make great strides in AI.
Their AI engine is pretty good and could be improved by adding a couple
more instruction sets.  To see what I mean, go to the CCG NASCAR2 AI
Project's site and try the Michigan or C***te AI enhancements.  You
will also need the driver skills numbers from my ftp site.  This
combination of Papyrus's AI engine, CCG AI files, and competitive driver
skills really shows off the possibilities of AI in a simulation.  While
it may not be NROS, it is the second best thing (and I don't hesitate to
say not a distant second either).  As a matter of fact, I think this
combination is the best AI I've seen in a racing sim to date.  Of course
you do understand that this is In My Humble Opinion. ;-)

CCG NASCAR2 AI Project:
        http://www.racesimcentral.net/
Driver Skill Numbers:
        ftp://ftp.teleport.com/users/mcarver/AutoSim/ccg_ai10.zip

--
**************************** Michael E. Carver *************************
     Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./.  [-  < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

% Its not just a visual representation of your input, instead its more of
% a mix of this input and the car's response to this input.  With it you
% can 'feel' how the car is reacting much better than in any other sim to
% date.  It just 'feels right', but until you've sat down and played it,
% I'm not sure I ever accurately describe the sensation.

% I sincerely hope that people don't go into this game with their minds
% made up that they are going to hate the arms.  Like you, I couldn't
% imagine how they could add anything to the game.  But after playing GPL,
% I can't imagine playing without them.  Give it a chance, I think you'll
% be pleasantly surprised...

Eric, I believe you.  Well, I believe that it worked for you.  It might
even work for me.  But being the old skeptical fart I am, I still want
the option to turn it off.  Give me a proper implementation of force
feedback for my own arms and wheels.  Why do I say this?  In my opinion,
in order for the wheel/arms on the screen to give me feedback about how
the car is reacting or handling, it must react differently than my own
hands and wheel.  If the on screen visual simply mirrors my own input, I
don't need it.  If it is mirroring another input entirely, I am not
really sure I want to see it.  When I'm driving in a real car, I don't
watch my hands, I watch the road/dash/other cars.  I do however, drive
by the seat of my pants.  Maybe what we really need is a 3D on screen
sphincter! <G>
--
**************************** Michael E. Carver *************************
     Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./.  [-  < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=