rec.autos.simulators

by **BGrauss9** » Thu, 10 Jul 1997 04:00:00

<sniped negative crybaby drivel>
Well in the mean Time TEN is making a fortune off of us since we all

Nice blanket generalizations. First of all, how do you know "TEN is
making a fortune off of us"? Have you audited TEN's books or something?
You do not have a clue as to what the financial health is at TEN. I
seriously doubt that the number of people who joined and have stayed on is
as high as you think.

When you say, we all signed on at the first of the year, you make it sound
like all of R.A.S. signed up. Speak for yourself, I didn't sign up and
have enough of a clue to wait until the thing is announced officially.
Geez, talk about cranial rectalitis!

Third and final flame, If "you have no other use for TEN" and have stuck
with it for all these months, why should anyone refund your money? Being
***/martyr/ignorant/too lazy to cancel your account, is no grounds
for a refund IMO. You are probably a great guy and all but your post
really makes me want to puke. Take responsibility for your own actions
and quit it with the small minded "us vs. them mentality".

Bryan Grauss
SF, CA

by **Jim Sokolof** » Thu, 10 Jul 1997 04:00:00

> Btw, some time back you mentioned that you did your Thesis on
> simulating a race car. I'd like to read that if possible. Is it
> archived at a University for public perusal?

Wasn't me. My thesis was on digital design tools, compiling text
descriptions of finite state machines, reducing boolean expressions, and
generating files to burn PALs... And I don't think my thesis is archived
at MIT, but maybe it is. I probably have the***files somewhere, but
honestly, it's not that interesting... (Now, if it were on vehicle
simulation, that would be another story...)

---Jim

by **SimRaci** » Fri, 11 Jul 1997 04:00:00

Most of the rumors piping from both TEN and Papyrus were hinting at a
Spring-97 start date, (quote from TEN tag inside N2 box: "NASCAR RACING
LEAGUE...COMING IN EARLY '97...ONLY ON TEN.") so signing on in December
didn't seem like such a bad thing - especially since TEN made an offer
for an additional savings of $15-off the regular $29.95 price...good
for the rest of '97...

I think at the time, many were tired of the long distance charges by
dialing into Hawaii, so the offer was an attractive one. From what I
can remember, TEN's offer for $14.95 expired in early January.

As the months passed, each new bit of news indicated a setback of only
a few weeks (to work-out a bug here, a bug there), so one could reason
that it was OK to hang onto the TEN account...

Personally, I don't think TEN should have to refund anything (vaporware
is vaporware), but perhaps they should have been more cautious in their
ads.

Not a flame, just my $.02

Cheers!

Marc

Marc J. Nelson
Sim Racing Online / Sim Racing News / The Sim Project
http://members.aol.com/simracing

by **Kurt Zem** » Tue, 15 Jul 1997 04:00:00

>> > Well in the mean Time TEN is making a fortune off of us since we all
>> >signed on at the first of the year .We are just paying for a spot I
>> >guess since I have no other use for TEN.I think we need to get some type
>> >of refund.Just a Thought
>> >--
>> >Paul Carillon

>> Have to agree with you Paul. I believed TENs' advertising back in December
>> during their membership drive and signed up. Seven months of paying was
>> reasonable enough time to expect some sort of explanation or progress.
>> The answer to my post was..." well you can quit and rejoin when NROS starts,
>> at a higher rate". Great answer, the type that would get one of my employees
>> fired on the spot if they dared use it on a customer.
>> That this type of marketing is the status quo doesn't make it right. They
>> really should have remained quiet on it. Sure it would have made some mad,
>> ( what doesn't ?) but at least it wouldn't have cost a lot of us 105 bucks
>> just to be told to quit and rejoin.

>> Regards,
>> Greg Avella

>Wanna light a fire under the ole boys??? get a class action suit going
>against them...
>I bet they wont be near as Smug when faced with paying back all the
>money they received
>to date.... hell, it Worked for AOL subscribers,,,,and Aol has gotten
>Much better since.
>I still remember when I first got NR2...I did the sign up
>thing,,,,searched all over the web,,,,,could not BELIEVE that it wasnt
>happening yet,,,,and finally decided it was just a higly planned money
>scam,,,,apparently... (havent seen anything to disprove me, yet)
>--
>Sit down,,Strap in,,Shut up,,Hang on,,Go fast,,Turn left,,Kiss Trophy
>Girl
>GGGGGGgoooo #3,,,31,,,28,,,94,,,6,,,5,,,18,,,8,,,
> Handy^man

I'd love to hear you explain in court during such a suit why you
signed up in December for something that was coming in Spring.

btw: Spring starts in late March.

Really guys, I also wanted to sign up real bad back then, thinking
NROS was right around the corner, but after going to TEN's website,
reading the press releases, learning that NROS would require TEN
v.1.2, waiting for 1.2, figuring out that a Spring release could be
anywhere from late March to late June, seeing 1.2 released, reading
the N2 newsgroup that started at TEN, hearing the news that late July
was a possibility, reading the announcement that late July might not
happen, etc., etc. Still waiting like everyone else.

The information was there. Unfortunately, I'll admit, it did take a
bit of work to get, but it was there.

Kurt

by **David Hudso** » Tue, 15 Jul 1997 04:00:00

> >> > Well in the mean Time TEN is making a fortune off of us since we all
> >> >signed on at the first of the year .We are just paying for a spot I
> >> >guess since I have no other use for TEN.I think we need to get some type
> >> >of refund.Just a Thought
> >> >--
> >> >Paul Carillon

> >> Have to agree with you Paul. I believed TENs' advertising back in December
> >> during their membership drive and signed up. Seven months of paying was
> >> reasonable enough time to expect some sort of explanation or progress.
> >> The answer to my post was..." well you can quit and rejoin when NROS starts,
> >> at a higher rate". Great answer, the type that would get one of my employees
> >> fired on the spot if they dared use it on a customer.
> >> That this type of marketing is the status quo doesn't make it right. They
> >> really should have remained quiet on it. Sure it would have made some mad,
> >> ( what doesn't ?) but at least it wouldn't have cost a lot of us 105 bucks
> >> just to be told to quit and rejoin.

> >> Regards,
> >> Greg Avella

> >Wanna light a fire under the ole boys??? get a class action suit going
> >against them...
> >I bet they wont be near as Smug when faced with paying back all the
> >money they received
> >to date.... hell, it Worked for AOL subscribers,,,,and Aol has gotten
> >Much better since.
> >I still remember when I first got NR2...I did the sign up
> >thing,,,,searched all over the web,,,,,could not BELIEVE that it wasnt
> >happening yet,,,,and finally decided it was just a higly planned money
> >scam,,,,apparently... (havent seen anything to disprove me, yet)
> >--
> >Sit down,,Strap in,,Shut up,,Hang on,,Go fast,,Turn left,,Kiss Trophy
> >Girl
> >GGGGGGgoooo #3,,,31,,,28,,,94,,,6,,,5,,,18,,,8,,,
> > Handy^man

> I'd love to hear you explain in court during such a suit why you
> signed up in December for something that was coming in Spring.

> btw: Spring starts in late March.

> Really guys, I also wanted to sign up real bad back then, thinking
> NROS was right around the corner, but after going to TEN's website,
> reading the press releases, learning that NROS would require TEN
> v.1.2, waiting for 1.2, figuring out that a Spring release could be
> anywhere from late March to late June, seeing 1.2 released, reading
> the N2 newsgroup that started at TEN, hearing the news that late July
> was a possibility, reading the announcement that late July might not
> happen, etc., etc. Still waiting like everyone else.

> The information was there. Unfortunately, I'll admit, it did take a
> bit of work to get, but it was there.

> Kurt

AS I SAID in an earlier post : the best way to benefit the consumer
is for some competition between companies : Is it feasible for an
Alternative to NRO ?? Would we REALLY care whether the gods of NASCAR
endorsed it or not ? If twenty racers could race against each other
that would soothe the cravings . Perhaps we should all check with
a tech support person working for our ISP's and really find out what
is involved .

David Hudson

by **Kurt Zem** » Tue, 15 Jul 1997 04:00:00

I totally agree with you on the consumer benefitting from competition.
Unfortunately, I don't think anybody could do it (more than 2/3 racers
going head-head) for N2 without Papy helping. Papy also has an
agreement with Ten that gives Ten some sort of sole source to online
*** with N2. It looks like if any serious competition is going to
come along it would have to be another game. Haven't heard anything
serious from any other games.

Would I really care if Nascar didn't endorse it? Probably not too
much. When this thing gets going on Ten, there will be many leagues
and pickup races in addition to the NROS. The NROS will just be the
big cheese of all the leagues.

Kurt

by **Tallsota** » Wed, 30 Jul 1997 04:00:00

I signed up for TEN for approxamitly 10 minutes after I found there was no
support for N2 or NROS at the time and I am still waiting, but they didnt
get a red cent from me and when it comes time to re-subcribe to get in the
nros then I will...until then I'll spend my money on better things....like
beer!
Drive hard...turn left...and by all means...use the draft!

Team Buttless Motorsports
#61 Pohanka Auotomotive Group Chevy Monte Carlo

rec.autos.simulators

NRO - Going towards 1998

NRO - Going towards 1998

NRO - Going towards 1998

NRO - Going towards 1998

NRO - Going towards 1998

NRO - Going towards 1998

NRO - Going towards 1998

NRO - Going towards 1998