rec.autos.simulators

> I wasn't referring to the sliding behaviour of the cars.  I agree that at
> the limit, and on the ground, you get this dancing on ice feel.  So, the GT3
> cars are fine as long as you have all four wheels on the ground.  However,
> as soon as you crest a hump at speed, things go to hell.  Instead of a
> natural jump, like you get in GPL, RallyMasters and even NFS-Porsche, you
> get this absolutely bizarre instant wheelie.  I've had a Celica rally car
> stand right up on its tail on the Smoky Mountain circuit at the jump after
> the S/F, despite purposely hammering the brakes just before the crest.
> Experience from real-world driving and hours of GPL and RallyMasters
> dictates that the car should certainly not rotate backwards, and especially
> not until the thing is vertical!  I think it's a bizarre bug with the
> downforce.

>> Hehe, cool. Perhaps they saw too many videos where F1 cars would fly
>> backwards. Perhaps they had an equation wrong (one negative sign can
>> really***everything up).

>Ruud, it looks more like downforce is calculated without regard to the
>car's, uh, aspect (good word?  angle of attack?  you know what I mean?).

> >> Hehe, cool. Perhaps they saw too many videos where F1 cars would fly
> >> backwards. Perhaps they had an equation wrong (one negative sign can
> >> really***everything up).

> >Ruud, it looks more like downforce is calculated without regard to the
> >car's, uh, aspect (good word?  angle of attack?  you know what I mean?).

> Yes, I know what you mean. Still, a big thing in aerodynamics seems to
> be the pitching of the car relative to the wind. As soon as you pitch
> too much, things are really beginning to look ugly and it might tip
> you over. Just like a *** boat on the sea on a windy day. :)

> You would say then that GT3 might be right; as soon as you go too far,
> the problem worsens quickly.

> > Got a new PS2 today with the Logitech FF wheel.  GT3 is a joke.  The cars just
> > slide around like crazy as if you are driving on ice.  My copy of F1 2001 is
> Apparently, this is exactly what it feels like if you model
> the tyres realistically.  You need mu (friction) values
> around 2.0 to make it "feel" right; witness also the 'realistic'
> tyres in GT2.

>> >> Hehe, cool. Perhaps they saw too many videos where F1 cars would fly
>> >> backwards. Perhaps they had an equation wrong (one negative sign can
>> >> really***everything up).

>> >Ruud, it looks more like downforce is calculated without regard to the
>> >car's, uh, aspect (good word?  angle of attack?  you know what I mean?).

>> Yes, I know what you mean. Still, a big thing in aerodynamics seems to
>> be the pitching of the car relative to the wind. As soon as you pitch
>> too much, things are really beginning to look ugly and it might tip
>> you over. Just like a *** boat on the sea on a windy day. :)

>> You would say then that GT3 might be right; as soon as you go too far,
>> the problem worsens quickly.

>I don't think it is. :)
...
>there are even a few screenshot of this happening here:
>http://www.racesimcentral.net/