rec.autos.simulators

by **Robert Berryhi** » Thu, 05 Sep 1996 04:00:00

>But, I do think there is a problem with the spin model. Right now, the only
>way to recover a spin is to slam on the brakes.

Not true, if you apply the accelerator at the appropriate time, you
can recover & keep going - I've done it many a time.

Austin, Tx http://www.racesimcentral.net/~indyfan/
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Scott Pruett 1997 PPG Cup Champion!
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by **Greg Cis** » Thu, 05 Sep 1996 04:00:00

>This drives me NUTS. I don't know if it is due to pre-programmed spins, or
>simply poor physics, but when a car goes off at 180.. gets sideways and hits
>the wall, it spins all over the place (i.e. ICR2), and it just feels so
>darn un-natural the way GP2 loses momentum.

>I've done 360's in weird situations, but more often than not I end up
>backwards. It also seens that gp2 has pre-programmed behavior for
>when you drop a wheel off course... it seems NEVER to be recoverable,
>as if the code says:

> if (wheelDropped()) {
> BeginOutOfControlSequence();
> }

>Now... who *really* knows what is to blame, but it sure isn't satisfying
>as it is.

Who *REALLY* is to blame, is the driver that put the wheel off course. DUH.
Sheesh. More people blaming someone else for their problems :-)

- Show quoted text -

>> >>Well Torgeir.. It seems, In my and othes opinion, that Microprose, in
>> >>their infinite wisdom , decided it was easier to program spins in
>> >>a (not sure of the correct terminology here) loop program instead
>> >>of modelling proper physics. In other words, everytime you loose
>> >>the rear end, the same thing happens over and over again..

>> I've done a 360 and kept right on going, and have had spins of < 180.
>> Maybe you're just spinning at the same speed at the same place.
>> Consistent anyway.

>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>> Bob Bruss

>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

by **Ian M Ra** » Thu, 05 Sep 1996 04:00:00

> This drives me NUTS. I don't know if it is due to pre-programmed spins, or
> simply poor physics, but when a car goes off at 180.. gets sideways and hits
> the wall, it spins all over the place (i.e. ICR2), and it just feels so
> darn un-natural the way GP2 loses momentum.

> I've done 360's in weird situations, but more often than not I end up
> backwards. It also seens that gp2 has pre-programmed behavior for
> when you drop a wheel off course... it seems NEVER to be recoverable,
> as if the code says:

> if (wheelDropped()) {
> BeginOutOfControlSequence();
> }

> Now... who *really* knows what is to blame, but it sure isn't satisfying
> as it is.

Get a grip man. The spinning things seem just fine to me - you can
recover even monumental ones if you have the slightest clue how to drive
a road car.

And as for "dropping a wheel" (you mean getting a wheel off the tarmac
right ?) it is more than controllable. You can't lose the traction of
one tire and expect to take the rest of the corner as normal - but you
can back off the throttle and ease up on the steering a bit.

By the way that bit of code there - sims are nothing like that. It's
going to be a very complex physics model with inputs about such things
as tire grip, rotation, orientation, throttle etc etc.. when you go on
the grass you just end up with less grip at one corner and a good clout
to the suspension...

--
Ian Rae, DSP Firmware Engineer, | Tel No: +44 1793 565159
Motorola GPD, 16 Euro Way, | E-mail:

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by **Ashraf Ghebranio** » Fri, 06 Sep 1996 04:00:00

>Subject: Re: Why does spins always end up backwards ? (GP2)
>Date: Wed, 4 Sep 1996 14:00:25 +0200

>(Randy Peppler) says...
>> I find in gp2 the only way to save a spin is to hammer on the brakes...
>No, you CAN recover from a spin using opposite lock and a trim on the
>accelerator. I can send you a replay if you want.
>--
>Nicola Salmoria

Hmmmm. I will try this.

Usually, what I do is try to fight it till it starts to spin, but once it
spins, anything you do will actually cause MORE problems. I take the foot of
the accelator but I do not brake (unless I am heading for a wall!). As the car
starts to spin back to position, slightly accelerate. Depending on your wing
setup, you should be able to smoothly get back into position. If you miss time
it, you end up going into another spin!

Ashraf

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by **Nicola Salmor** » Sat, 07 Sep 1996 04:00:00

('John' Joao Silva) says...

No it isn't!
Replay available on request.

--
Nicola Salmoria

by **'John' Joao Sil** » Sun, 08 Sep 1996 04:00:00

>('John' Joao Silva) says...
>> Right now, the only
>> way to recover a spin is to slam on the brakes.

>No it isn't!
>Replay available on request.

Nicola,

Could you please explain a bit more on how to recover from the spins then?

I would greatly love to be able to stop stomping on the brakes, but so
far that is the only consistent way I have found to recover a spin.

Thanks.

Cheers.

--John
--
-------------------
John (Joao) Silva
http://weber.u.washington.edu/~jsilva
Seattle, Washington USA.

by **Michael Knowle** » Tue, 10 Sep 1996 04:00:00

> ('John' Joao Silva) says...
> > Right now, the only
> > way to recover a spin is to slam on the brakes.

> No it isn't!
> Replay available on request.

> --
> Nicola Salmoria

I must agree with the first poster. There *IS* something wrong with the
way the game handles the car going backwards, since the momentum is not
kept. You will find that if you get into a fairly decent spin in the
middle of the tarmac, you will not be able to steer whilst the car is
going backwards, and also the back wheels don't seem to break traction
whilst this is happening, so you end up with the car facing backwards.
i.e. if you have sufficient backwards movement then you should be able
to J-turn your car by turning the steering wheel and tapping the
brakes so that the front wheels slide and you are heading the right way,
but this isn't true.
There's also another bug that I don't seem to have seen many people
writing about in that when you're coming up behind someone else and
slipstreaming them, when you pull out to pass you will be flung sideways
as the steering help screws up. This is really pissing me off!

Mike.

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by **Terje Wold Johans** » Wed, 11 Sep 1996 04:00:00

...

Turn off steering help. Btw turn off all aids.

--
--- Terje Wold Johansen

--- http://www.ifi.uio.no/~terjjo/
--- "I am your inferior superior." O.W.

by **Nicola Salmor** » Wed, 11 Sep 1996 04:00:00

('John' Joao Silva) says...

> >('John' Joao Silva) says...
> >> Right now, the only
> >> way to recover a spin is to slam on the brakes.

> >No it isn't!
> >Replay available on request.

> Nicola,

> Could you please explain a bit more on how to recover from the spins then?

> I would greatly love to be able to stop stomping on the brakes, but so
> far that is the only consistent way I have found to recover a spin.

Apply opposite lock and slightly accelerate. Of course you have to do
this as soon as the car starts to spin - and if the spin is a major one
you will not be able to recover from it. Don't expect a 100% success
rate. Much depends on the car setup, if it's well balanced the chances to
recover are greater.

I consider the ability to stop a spin by braking a bug in the simulation,
and I categorically refuse to take advantage of it. I'd rather go into
the gravel than take advantage of a simulation flaw. After all, if I'm
not able to recover from the spin, it means that I don't deserve to. Next
time I'll be more careful.

--
Nicola Salmoria

by **'John' Joao Sil** » Fri, 13 Sep 1996 04:00:00

>Apply opposite lock and slightly accelerate. Of course you have to do
>this as soon as the car starts to spin - and if the spin is a major one
>you will not be able to recover from it. Don't expect a 100% success
>rate. Much depends on the car setup, if it's well balanced the chances to
>recover are greater.

>I consider the ability to stop a spin by braking a bug in the simulation,
>and I categorically refuse to take advantage of it. I'd rather go into
>the gravel than take advantage of a simulation flaw. After all, if I'm
>not able to recover from the spin, it means that I don't deserve to. Next
>time I'll be more careful.

>--
>Nicola Salmoria

Fair Enough.

Thanks I will give that acceleration method a try, maybe my setups need
to be adjusted to make better use of that.

The slam the brakes on method does feel very unrealistic I will be glad
to give that up.

Thanks again.

Cheers.

--John
--
-------------------
John (Joao) Silva
http://weber.u.washington.edu/~jsilva
Seattle, Washington USA.