rec.autos.simulators

JoWooD/Bugbear: Poor Attitude!

Gerry Aitke

JoWooD/Bugbear: Poor Attitude!

by Gerry Aitke » Mon, 25 Mar 2002 17:25:26

I got RT before Xmas, controllers wouldn't work! I waited for a patch.
Patch came out. Patch contained input.ini file. Input.ini file hard to
understand and pretty much unexplained in the read.me text.

So I did some fiddling and managed to unravel it's hidden secrets. I
popped along to JoWooD's forum, which was stuffed full of people with
controller problems. I saw little evidence of peoples problems being
resolved. The odd one was, but was quickly replaced by two more people
with similar troubles. I posted what I know about the input.ini along
with a small critique on RT's controller set-up. The whole post was
removed!

Today RT goes back to it's point of purchase for a refund!

Gerry

Kyle Robert

JoWooD/Bugbear: Poor Attitude!

by Kyle Robert » Mon, 25 Mar 2002 17:50:14


Jowood was very helpful with the few problems that I had with Rally Trophy.

Kyle

Gerry Aitke

JoWooD/Bugbear: Poor Attitude!

by Gerry Aitke » Mon, 25 Mar 2002 18:16:09

Kyle


> Jowood was very helpful with the few problems that I had with Rally Trophy.

Glad to hear that, but...

If they'd done a proper job of the controller set-up, it would have
saved a lot of people, including themselves, a lot of trouble. AND
they're not big enough to admit it.

Just out of interest, what was your problem?

Gerry

Phil Le

JoWooD/Bugbear: Poor Attitude!

by Phil Le » Mon, 25 Mar 2002 19:44:27


> So I did some fiddling and managed to unravel it's hidden secrets. I
> popped along to JoWooD's forum, which was stuffed full of people with
> controller problems. I saw little evidence of peoples problems being
> resolved. The odd one was, but was quickly replaced by two more people
> with similar troubles. I posted what I know about the input.ini along
> with a small critique on RT's controller set-up. The whole post was
> removed!

> Today RT goes back to it's point of purchase for a refund!

> Gerry

Gerry

Please post what you know about the controller config file here so we can
all learn from what you have found out.  It would be great if you could also
post it on the Rally Simulations forum at Racesim Central.  I promise we
won't delete the thread.

Phil Lee
---
Racesim Central Administrator
http://www.racesimcentral.com

David Er

JoWooD/Bugbear: Poor Attitude!

by David Er » Mon, 25 Mar 2002 21:03:33


<snip>!

You know a place that will refund on software you bought over three months
ago!!? Amazing

David

Gerry Aitke

JoWooD/Bugbear: Poor Attitude!

by Gerry Aitke » Mon, 25 Mar 2002 22:04:55




> <snip>!

> > Today RT goes back to it's point of purchase for a refund!

> > Gerry

> You know a place that will refund on software you bought over three months
> ago!!? Amazing

I know my rights under the sale of goods act.
Gerry Aitke

JoWooD/Bugbear: Poor Attitude!

by Gerry Aitke » Mon, 25 Mar 2002 22:37:59





> > <snip>!

> > > Today RT goes back to it's point of purchase for a refund!

> > > Gerry

> > You know a place that will refund on software you bought over three months
> > ago!!? Amazing

> I know my rights under the sale of goods act.

And so, it would appear, do the shop. Because they said 'no problem,
just bring it back for a full refund'.
David Er

JoWooD/Bugbear: Poor Attitude!

by David Er » Mon, 25 Mar 2002 22:56:31






> > > <snip>!

> > > > Today RT goes back to it's point of purchase for a refund!

> > > > Gerry

> > > You know a place that will refund on software you bought over three
months
> > > ago!!? Amazing

> > I know my rights under the sale of goods act.

> And so, it would appear, do the shop. Because they said 'no problem,
> just bring it back for a full refund'.

Thats very good of them. Must be some sort of customer relations policy
though. Somehow I can't see the removal of a post on a bulletin board the
resaler doesn't control as being sufficient reason for the refund of a
purchased good. I congratulate you on your choice of retailers.

David

Gerry Aitke

JoWooD/Bugbear: Poor Attitude!

by Gerry Aitke » Mon, 25 Mar 2002 23:19:42








> > > > <snip>!

> > > > > Today RT goes back to it's point of purchase for a refund!

> > > > > Gerry

> > > > You know a place that will refund on software you bought over three
> months
> > > > ago!!? Amazing

> > > I know my rights under the sale of goods act.

> > And so, it would appear, do the shop. Because they said 'no problem,
> > just bring it back for a full refund'.

> Thats very good of them. Must be some sort of customer relations policy
> though. Somehow I can't see the removal of a post on a bulletin board the
> resaler doesn't control as being sufficient reason for the refund of a
> purchased good. I congratulate you on your choice of retailers.

I just said that patch RT was still screwed in the controller
configuration department. Which it is. I didn't mention all the time i
spent waiting for the patch, or all the time i spent figuring out the
input.ini file.

But *** it, i think i'll ask for compensation too!

BTW, I phoned Dixons, EB, PC world and Currys pretending to have bought
RT from each, and they all offered a refund.

So there you go boys, take those bug ridden, piles of shit some
developers call games, back to the shop months later for your money
back. In the UK anyway.

David L. Coo

JoWooD/Bugbear: Poor Attitude!

by David L. Coo » Mon, 25 Mar 2002 23:38:05


Phil -

The answer to most of your questions lies with JoystImm.exe a little utility
that comes with Racer and gives you accurate raw data from your controllers
so that you can plug the values into RT's input.ini.  That plus a little
reading on the JW forums to get the optimal values for the other settings
and you and your readers should be off to the track.

You can get JoystImm.exe here (I up'd it to my site for you)
http://www.racesimcentral.net/, it is a
Logitech Momo which I wired to my TSW2 pedals (took about 15 minutes) along
with an RS Shifter.

The raw data looks like this in JoystImm:

Throttle (Z axis) 0 up to 1000 down
Brake (Z Rotation) -1000 up to 1000 down
Wheel (X axis) -1000 left to +1000 right

Here's how my input.ini shakes out with those numbers:

# How many control events are buffered
BufferSize  = 8;
#----------------------------------------------------------------------
# Converts analog steering to digital
# (for gamepads that are reported as analog)
ForceDigitalSteering = 0;
#----------------------------------------------------------------------
# Minimum & maximum values for input devices
AxisMinValue  = -1000;
AxisMaxValue  =  1000;
#----------------------------------------------------------------------
# Values for exponential functions
# ( 1.0 = no effect, bigger values give less sensitivity, smaller more)
SteeringExponent = 1.2;
ThrottleExponent = 1.0;
BrakeExponent  = 1.5;
#----------------------------------------------------------------------
# Set this to 1 if you want to use following custom ranges
OverrideRanges  = 1;
#----------------------------------------------------------------------
AnalogXAxisRange = { -1000, 1000};
AnalogYAxisRange = { -1000, 1000};
AnalogZAxisRange = { 0, 1000};
# Rotational
AnalogRXAxisRange = { 1000, -1000};
AnalogRYAxisRange = { 1000, -1000};
AnalogRZAxisRange = { -1000, 1000};

#---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Those settings along with my***driver, wire cutter and electrical tape
allow me to use my TSW2 pedals in split axis mode with RT (and all other
titles).  I used feedback from other drivers on the JW board to come up with
these settings:

SteeringExponent = 1.2;
ThrottleExponent = 1.0;
BrakeExponent  = 1.5;

They work very well for me and others have posted in agreement.

Hope this helps!

- David Cook

Dave Henri

JoWooD/Bugbear: Poor Attitude!

by Dave Henri » Mon, 25 Mar 2002 23:40:20

  The good ol USA has a much more limited refund policy I would think.  Most
big shops like CompUSA only refund unopened products and then only within 15
days or so.  An open defective product can be exchanged for the same title.
  If you popped in about some law or the other, the sales clerk would most
likely respond with:
  "huh?????"
dave henrie








> > > > > <snip>!

> > > > > > Today RT goes back to it's point of purchase for a refund!

> > > > > > Gerry

> > > > > You know a place that will refund on software you bought over
three
> > months
> > > > > ago!!? Amazing

> > > > I know my rights under the sale of goods act.

> > > And so, it would appear, do the shop. Because they said 'no problem,
> > > just bring it back for a full refund'.

> > Thats very good of them. Must be some sort of customer relations policy
> > though. Somehow I can't see the removal of a post on a bulletin board
the
> > resaler doesn't control as being sufficient reason for the refund of a
> > purchased good. I congratulate you on your choice of retailers.

> I just said that patch RT was still screwed in the controller
> configuration department. Which it is. I didn't mention all the time i
> spent waiting for the patch, or all the time i spent figuring out the
> input.ini file.

> But *** it, i think i'll ask for compensation too!

> BTW, I phoned Dixons, EB, PC world and Currys pretending to have bought
> RT from each, and they all offered a refund.

> So there you go boys, take those bug ridden, piles of shit some
> developers call games, back to the shop months later for your money
> back. In the UK anyway.

Ken Bear

JoWooD/Bugbear: Poor Attitude!

by Ken Bear » Tue, 26 Mar 2002 00:11:44


Don't they do that in response to EVERYTHING at CompUSA ? ;-)

--
9/11/01....Never forget

Ken

Bob

JoWooD/Bugbear: Poor Attitude!

by Bob » Tue, 26 Mar 2002 00:38:41

That's really too bad they saw fit to remove your post.  Do you still have a
copy of the tweaks you came up with, and if so, could you post it here?

TIA,
Bob


Gerry Aitke

JoWooD/Bugbear: Poor Attitude!

by Gerry Aitke » Tue, 26 Mar 2002 00:43:00


> That's really too bad they saw fit to remove your post.  Do you still have a
> copy of the tweaks you came up with, and if so, could you post it here?

Bob -- see David's reply to Phil, in this thread. It pretty much covers
it.

Good luck

Gerry

jbod

JoWooD/Bugbear: Poor Attitude!

by jbod » Tue, 26 Mar 2002 01:59:23



> > So I did some fiddling and managed to unravel it's hidden secrets. I
> > popped along to JoWooD's forum, which was stuffed full of people with
> > controller problems. I saw little evidence of peoples problems being
> > resolved. The odd one was, but was quickly replaced by two more people
> > with similar troubles. I posted what I know about the input.ini along
> > with a small critique on RT's controller set-up. The whole post was
> > removed!

> > Today RT goes back to it's point of purchase for a refund!

> > Gerry

> Gerry

> Please post what you know about the controller config file here so we can
> all learn from what you have found out.  It would be great if you could also
> post it on the Rally Simulations forum at Racesim Central.  I promise we
> won't delete the thread.

> Phil Lee
> ---
> Racesim Central Administrator
> http://www.racesimcentral.com

It really helps to know what kind of wheel you're using, and whether
you're having problems with combined or split axis controls.

FWIW, the SINGLE best piece of info regarding controller issues was
found here:

http://forum.jowood.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=27245&t=7356#post27245

Check out the second post in the thread, from "Cooknn" -- his
input.ini settings TRANSFORMED the game for me.  Your mileage may vary
. . .

;-)

-- JB


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