rec.autos.simulators

I decided I wanted to buy a Wingman Formula Force a couple of days
ago. Sort of a semi-impulse buy, since I've ruled out all the other
wheels, and swore I wasn't going to buy the Logitech until they
improved the pedals.
I've been using a creaky old T2 for almost 3 years.

I saw the $110 price on Buy.com, but figured I didn't mind spending a
little more for instant gratification from a local store.
I'll also admit that I'm still not real cozy with internet shopping.
Since Buy.com's trick is to lure you with a lowball price, then beat
you to death on shipping, I set my target local-store price at a
relatively high $150.

I knew Best Buy had them, since that's where I originally saw the
wheel... $180. Same price I remember seeing it for and balking at it
when it first came out.

Off to CompUSA. They had the Microsoft wheel, (not interested), and a
whole slew of hokey looking wheels with everything from tilting
steering columns to full 6 button video game pads built into the hubs.
The box on one of the wheels didn't even say Force Feedback, instead
proudly proclaiming "It Vibrates!" Whee.
CompUSA had every screwball mouse/trackball/no-ball-at-all input
device Logitech ever made (think the only thing they haven't made is
one you set on the floor and roll with your ass)  but no Wingman FF
wheels. Not even an empty spot on the shelf where they used to be.
Hmmm.

This happens every time I want something bad!
It happened when I bought my Voodoo2, it happened when I bought my
Riva TNT, happened when I wanted a SBLive! Value, it happens whenever
I want a game title really bad.
Can't find it anywhere, or one place has it for nearly twice the price
of the places that don't.

I notice that Thrustmaster must have 5 mildly different non-FF
wheel/pedal combos. Seems like a waste.
I also notice that neither Best Buy or CompUSA is selling the Force
GT, despite selling all 5 similar non-FF wheels with different names.

Desperation sets in. On the way home I swing by Sams club.
A complete waste of time, and I knew it.

Then I go to Target. Really scraping the bottom now.
The most interesting thing I see there is 3D Shark Hunter.
I guess all of the virtual land animals have been exterminated, so
it's time to plunder the ocean.
I look at Shark Hunter, and wish I had the programming skills to make
something like Baby Seal Clubber 3D.
That should really whip the knee-jerk crowd into a frenzy, and I'd be
proud to single-handedly topple the hunting game market.

Finally, I go to Circuit City. I swore I'd never buy anything there
until Div-X killed them dead, and they were  having a bankruptcy
liquidation sale.
It was almost a relief that their barren shelves were devoid of the
Wingman wheel. I'd be torturing myself for weeks if I gave them $150.

I went back to Best Buy on the way home, only to find out they didn't
have any Wingman wheels in stock anyway. I really don't think I would
have paid $180, but the fact that I was considering it shows how
desperate I was. Guess there were a lot of more-desperate suckers that
beat me to it.

Anyway, that's it. Here I sit, still staring at the rickety old T2,
when I was hoping to be rubbing fenders in SCGT and crushing/drowning
dozens of hapless virtual Viper drivers.

Hope this kind of shit doesn't just happen to me. =8^/

--

        http://www.racesimcentral.net/~fusion1
    (dirt bikes, rat bikes, rental car abuse...)

Do you have a phone?

--
Jason

IMHO save your time and money and wait for forcefeedback version 2.  I just
finished repackaging my Wingman force for the trip back to Fry's to return.
In short it feels like a badly rebuilt T2 that occasionally jumps around as
if a defective bungee cord.  The throw on the pedals is so short that I
think I could do just as well w/KB.  While racing when in the groove there
is almost no forces at all, the only time it feels vaguely realistic is when
you go over the berm and you can feel the high freq bumps.  As far as being
able to feel whether your car is tight of loose you are better off using
non-FF and using your imagination..<VBG>.  Bear in mind I have only used for
a very few minutes using only the demo of SCGT so it may work better in
other games.  I also read that the newer driver v3.12 I think improves the
forces, after I installed the new drv and noticed no difference I realized
that this ***aint worth nearly $200.  Prolly not worth $50 IMHO.  I also
installed Ubisofts F1Rs and it caused my sys to lock when I tried to run it
so away it went as well.

regards
Mitch
Naman TEN/NROS

You can't even get a straight answer on things like SCSI/IDE CD ROM
drives or PC100 memory.
Since Logitech likes to call every game controller some variation of
Wingman, I'd bet the odds of getting a correct answer on the Formula
Force at about 1 in 50.

Basically, it's quicker to see for yourself. =8^/

Tim

Tim, I'd agree that was a little demented.  I am not going to tell you
buy.com is the best store on earth, there are many users who have
purchased from them and have complained after returning a product.

But, I purchased an NEC 870 printer for $290+shipping.  I added a IEEE
printer cable and a Bitronics parrallel port switch.  To my surprise,
I knew the shipping was always a ripoff.  But when I added the items
the shipping only went up $1.  It seems the more you have on the order
the more reasonable it becomes.  Their price for the cable was super
cheap, and they had by far the cheapest price on the bitronics switch.
After making sure all the items were correct, I called and telephoned
the order to their toll-free number.  Everything went smoothly, and to
my surprise I received all the products the next day (their warehouse
is really close to me).  To date everything is working perfectly.

Now yesterday, after looking for a wheel, a friend of mine ordered the
Logitech Wingman Formula Force for $104 (yes the price has dropped).
In addition, he ordered 2 DVD's and the new ATI GL128 All-In-Wonder
(not delivering until the end of the month) and the shipping was a
total of $19.50 (17.50 for the wheel alone, followed by 75 cents for 2
DVDs anbd another $1 for the video card.  I have to tell you that is
reasonable, since if you bought the items say at real.com and necx.com
(1) the items cost a heck of allot more, and (2) the shipping in the
end, ordering from two different stores would add to the same amount.
By the way he placed his order via the net, and everything was
accepted without a hitch.

I do not work for buy.com if you were wondering.  But I guess for
every person that may have complained about them, there are some of us
who are satisfied.  One warning though, do not forget anything when
ordering, sometimes if you call back to add an item, they may need to
create a new orer, in which you then get screwed by the
shipping/handling thing.

Remember you can always just use a phone.

Ex

I would like to have purchased the wheel locally, just to have
somewhere to easily return it if it craps out, but the $70 price
difference between Buy.com and Best Buy was just too much.

If there is a problem, I have 30 days from Buy.com (they say they
cross ship and refund shipping charges on defective items), then the 1
year warranty from Logitech after that.
Hopefully I don't need to use it, but I'm satisfied with it.

Tim

I own the Logitech FF myself. Just a few remarks:
FF Version2 - What's that?
Driver V3.12 is compulsory, the CD driver is ***
MGPRS2 is outstanding with Logi-FF (F1RS was not good)
Pedal throw is a little short, but you get used to it
SCGT I don't have - so no comment on this

The wheel IS worth the money

See you

Jens

I would suggest going to www.wingmanteam.com and
getting the 3.20 beta drivers.

If you have tried the Logitech wheel in both games can you
please give me some examples? I have probably put close
to 25-30 hours into F1RS with the Logitech wheel so I know
what it does/doesn't do. I feel the main area it needs
improvement is the inertia effects going around corners.
With the MS FF wheel you could definately feel  the wheel
lighten up as you lost grip in the corners. The Logitech
seems to do this occasionally. So if this effect is more
pronounced I may give MGPRS2 another shot.

Yep.

--

Header address intentionally scrambled to ward off the spamming hordes.

cisko [AT] ix [DOT] netcom [DOT] com

I'm confused about MGPRS2.  Electronic Boutique's website says it's release
date is 6/7/99 -- yet, I've seen messages from many people who have this
sim, some who have said they've had it for a long time, and others who found
it in the bargain bins.

What's up with this sim?  Is it out in the US?

Thanks,

bill

Whats also great: The response is extremely quick: no delay-feeling at
all.

I LOVE IT

Jens

BTW: Any other MGPRS2-FF comments in this NG?
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--

Header address intentionally scrambled to ward off the spamming hordes.

cisko [AT] ix [DOT] netcom [DOT] com

MGPRS2 is out definitely since a long time

Jens

<snip>>

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