rec.autos.simulators

GTR: First Look Review

Steve Smit

GTR: First Look Review

by Steve Smit » Wed, 03 Nov 2004 20:40:30

Well stated, Fran?ois!



> > I sure like the sound of the warp free collision detection.  No more
cars
> > flying off the track with a slight touch :-)   Thats one thing I sure
wont
> > miss from Papy multi.

> I don't see why you hated it for Papy, as what they wrote is *exactly* the
> same thing as what Papy does.  "Warp free collision detection" =
eliminated
> the zig-zagging with a prediction code.  Prediction coding smoothes
> everything but adds an element where cars can for an instant turn inside
> each other if they reappear correctly and create impossible physical
> collisions.

> No prediction coding simply make for something else... WARP.  Perhaps in a
> perfect network with unlimited bandwidth it's possible (ex : a LAN type
> system which btw even isn't perfect and still needs a prediction code),
but
> on the Internet you have to have a prediction code.

> It's the basis that makes any simracing community live.  Without this,
> multiplayer racing will never be good even if there's a good set of
> community tools.  Without it, when the server loses a fraction of where
> somebody is or misses a fraction of the relay of somebody else, the cars
> will be shown erratically (warping).  Prediction code, smoothes everything
> out and eliminated extreme warping.  You often see that in GPL as they
> increase the bandwidth requirement.  Cars zig-zag around the corners, they
> turn in a very "stairway" style.

> --
> -- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard>
> -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez
> Corporation - helping America into the New World...

Steve Simpso

GTR: First Look Review

by Steve Simpso » Thu, 04 Nov 2004 00:26:32

From what I'm told, the reactions to warp induced collisions are handled a
fair bit better in GTR than N2003.  Netkar & LFS are also better than N2003
in that respect.
Mitch_

GTR: First Look Review

by Mitch_ » Thu, 04 Nov 2004 01:59:40

You missed my point completely, or I missed yours but to say Papy is the
same is the opposite of what Ive seen.

Slight touch and you opponent goes flying off the track and the magic cars
that blend with each other quite happily till collision detection catches up
then whaaaammmm.  Off you both go spinning round and round.

On the other hand GTR sounds like when the cars rub they actually do rub and
not blend with each other then the resulting crash.

Mitch



>> I sure like the sound of the warp free collision detection.  No more cars
>> flying off the track with a slight touch :-)   Thats one thing I sure
>> wont miss from Papy multi.

> I don't see why you hated it for Papy, as what they wrote is *exactly* the
> same thing as what Papy does.  "Warp free collision detection" =
> eliminated the zig-zagging with a prediction code.  Prediction coding
> smoothes everything but adds an element where cars can for an instant turn
> inside each other if they reappear correctly and create impossible
> physical collisions.

> No prediction coding simply make for something else... WARP.  Perhaps in a
> perfect network with unlimited bandwidth it's possible (ex : a LAN type
> system which btw even isn't perfect and still needs a prediction code),
> but on the Internet you have to have a prediction code.

> It's the basis that makes any simracing community live.  Without this,
> multiplayer racing will never be good even if there's a good set of
> community tools.  Without it, when the server loses a fraction of where
> somebody is or misses a fraction of the relay of somebody else, the cars
> will be shown erratically (warping).  Prediction code, smoothes everything
> out and eliminated extreme warping.  You often see that in GPL as they
> increase the bandwidth requirement.  Cars zig-zag around the corners, they
> turn in a very "stairway" style.

> --
> -- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard>
> -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez
> Corporation - helping America into the New World...

JP

GTR: First Look Review

by JP » Thu, 04 Nov 2004 04:36:03

  Anything would be an improvement over that flaw in the Papy net code.
They had the best around (so far), but that part stinks.

  Other games don't/didn't do it, so something is messed up besides just
warp.


> You missed my point completely, or I missed yours but to say Papy is the
> same is the opposite of what Ive seen.

> Slight touch and you opponent goes flying off the track and the magic cars
> that blend with each other quite happily till collision detection catches
up
> then whaaaammmm.  Off you both go spinning round and round.

> On the other hand GTR sounds like when the cars rub they actually do rub
and
> not blend with each other then the resulting crash.

> Mitch




> >> I sure like the sound of the warp free collision detection.  No more
cars
> >> flying off the track with a slight touch :-)   Thats one thing I sure
> >> wont miss from Papy multi.

> > I don't see why you hated it for Papy, as what they wrote is *exactly*
the
> > same thing as what Papy does.  "Warp free collision detection" =
> > eliminated the zig-zagging with a prediction code.  Prediction coding
> > smoothes everything but adds an element where cars can for an instant
turn
> > inside each other if they reappear correctly and create impossible
> > physical collisions.

> > No prediction coding simply make for something else... WARP.  Perhaps in
a
> > perfect network with unlimited bandwidth it's possible (ex : a LAN type
> > system which btw even isn't perfect and still needs a prediction code),
> > but on the Internet you have to have a prediction code.

> > It's the basis that makes any simracing community live.  Without this,
> > multiplayer racing will never be good even if there's a good set of
> > community tools.  Without it, when the server loses a fraction of where
> > somebody is or misses a fraction of the relay of somebody else, the cars
> > will be shown erratically (warping).  Prediction code, smoothes
everything
> > out and eliminated extreme warping.  You often see that in GPL as they
> > increase the bandwidth requirement.  Cars zig-zag around the corners,
they
> > turn in a very "stairway" style.

> > --
> > -- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard>
> > -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez
> > Corporation - helping America into the New World...

JP

GTR: First Look Review

by JP » Thu, 04 Nov 2004 04:37:20



> > I sure like the sound of the warp free collision detection.  No more
cars
> > flying off the track with a slight touch :-)   Thats one thing I sure
wont
> > miss from Papy multi.

> I don't see why you hated it for Papy, as what they wrote is *exactly* the
> same thing as what Papy does.  "Warp free collision detection" =
eliminated
> the zig-zagging with a prediction code.  Prediction coding smoothes
> everything but adds an element where cars can for an instant turn inside
> each other if they reappear correctly and create impossible physical
> collisions.

> No prediction coding simply make for something else... WARP.  Perhaps in a
> perfect network with unlimited bandwidth it's possible (ex : a LAN type
> system which btw even isn't perfect and still needs a prediction code),
but
> on the Internet you have to have a prediction code.

> It's the basis that makes any simracing community live.  Without this,
> multiplayer racing will never be good even if there's a good set of
> community tools.  Without it, when the server loses a fraction of where
> somebody is or misses a fraction of the relay of somebody else, the cars
> will be shown erratically (warping).  Prediction code, smoothes everything
> out and eliminated extreme warping.  You often see that in GPL as they
> increase the bandwidth requirement.  Cars zig-zag around the corners, they
> turn in a very "stairway" style.

> --
> -- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard>
> -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez
> Corporation - helping America into the New World...

  Other games handled this better (Heat, i.e.) so Papy should have been able
to you'd think.

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