rec.autos.simulators

Cockpits: From the outside

MadDAW

Cockpits: From the outside

by MadDAW » Tue, 19 Mar 2002 19:33:45

Hate to admit it but your right.

You might be right on this but its not because of a "brain problem". I run
CAD/CAM software which includes 3d solid modeling daily. I will say that
NR2002 does a better job than previous versions, but is still lacking
something.

not at all

MadDAWG

MadDAW

Cockpits: From the outside

by MadDAW » Tue, 19 Mar 2002 19:41:11

Now I  have not seen anything on the game in question, but IMO third person
views make a "prettier" picture. The first person views have a smaller FOV
which will make any given model take up a larger portion of the screen,
therefore more of the rough edges in a model will show up. In short the
graphics look better, and we all know the better the graphics the more
attention a game will get, and lead to more sales.

MadDAWG

Gerry Aitke

Cockpits: From the outside

by Gerry Aitke » Tue, 19 Mar 2002 20:06:13


> > There's no need to be like that!

> Hate to admit it but your right.

Hehe, NP. I should have put a ;) in.

But does your CAD work demand that you judge distance to an object while
moving in the first person towards it?

Ok, so you have no problem with depth and distance perception in RL. Of
course our brains are being fooled by computer 3D, so I'm not surprised
that same aren't fool so easily as others. That's not to infer such
brains are inferior, but when it comes to sim racing they will make
driving harder for their owners.

If the roof cam or F10 makes it easier for those people, then fine. But
it's not far for them to judge the effectiveness or realism of the in
care view on the basis of faulty perception.

Gerry

MadDAW

Cockpits: From the outside

by MadDAW » Tue, 19 Mar 2002 22:10:13

Its also not fair for those that use***pit cam to look down their nose at
those that don't. Its this arrogant attitude that pisses me off.  There is
plenty of reasons someone may not use the***pit view even if they want to.
For example I have a friend that can't use the***pit view because of the
fps hit with the***pit view.  I don't think you'll find to many people
that will tell you sitting on the roof or flying behind the car are
realistic. But then again sitting at a desk staring at a 17 screen isn't
driving a 3400 lb stock car at speed either. Either way its about enjoying
what your doing. If your not enjoying it why bother doing it. There are tons
of compromises in these sims to make up for what you don't get in real life.
And if someone needs a different POV to make up for something thats fine by
me and I don't think any less of them than someone that doesn't. I'll never
understand the human desire to force other people to be just like them, and
be little them if they are not.

MadDAWG

Christopher J. Sypa

Cockpits: From the outside

by Christopher J. Sypa » Wed, 20 Mar 2002 14:47:14

Let it be known that on Mon, 18 Mar 2002 06:16:37 GMT, "Dave Henrie"


>that the title does seem to fulfill some of it's declared intentions.  But
>why then use 3rd person views for publicity stills?   I know I didn't do ANY

Simply put, it looks pretty and will sell the game.   That is the preferred
view to use during combat sequences, but the way I look at it, that view is
what the tactical officer would be looking at on his display.

Tomb raider is not a FPS.  It is an adventure game that is closer to platform
games than FPS's.

Yes, but not in the way you mentioned.  Each person gets a ship.  The game
wouldn't work well with multiple people on one bridge, as only one person
(tactical) will be doing all the work.


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Eldre

Cockpits: From the outside

by Eldre » Thu, 21 Mar 2002 02:52:59




>> > Maybe there's something wrong with
>> > your brain?

>> Maybe your just an *** too

>> MadDAWG

>There's no need to be like that! I'm merely stating that your brain
>might be harder to fool into thinking it's looking at a 3d image.

I have to admit, I thought you were 'slamming' him, too...  Maybe you should
have elaborated on your statement...

Eldred
--
Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001
Homepage - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~epickett
GPLRank - under construction...

Never argue with an idiot.  He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
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jason moy

Cockpits: From the outside

by jason moy » Thu, 21 Mar 2002 13:27:47


> We've all been thru the arguments for and against driving from the
>***pit.  But I had some random thoughts today that might add to the
> discussion.  I won't be using racing examples tho...

Here are my thoughts on playing games from a first-person perspective
(I snipped most of your post because it's not wholly relative, but
I've avoided these threads until I could elucidate my thoughts).

I buy a racing simulator because I want to experience something I
can't do in real life.  Part of the experience of driving a car is
sitting in the***pit.  That means having my hands and a wheel in
front of me, a proper dashboard, a view-limiting windshield and a
mirror.

Now, IMHO people who drive from 'arcade' views aren't doing anything
wrong.  They have a difference set of expectations and are trying to
have a different experience than I am.  Someone may prefer a hood view
or a behind-the-car-view or a nose view because it makes the game
easier and/or more enjoyable.  For me, I want to experience the same
visual limitations as a real driver and have the same sense of
perspective as I do in a real car and whether I'm faster or slower is
irrelevant.

The "I can't do this in real life but I can on a computer" aspect is
why nearly everything I buy is a simulation in some sense, whether
it's Nascar 2002, Mig Alley, Operation Flashpoint, Out of the Park 4,
or even the Civilization games.  Being able to drive in the***pit in
my racecar or have a limited field of view in my F-51 or look through
the scope of an AK-47 is why I buy these games, it's why I bought
Sublogic's Jet and Flight Simulator for my Apple ][.  For me, it's not
about fun or playability, it's about makebelieve. =)

Oh yeah, I also play Space Channel 5 because I don't look good in a
cute little plastic dress and still haven't found any martians to
shoot while dancing to funk music.

Jason

Gunnar Horrigm

Cockpits: From the outside

by Gunnar Horrigm » Thu, 21 Mar 2002 18:19:39


> Oh yeah, I also play Space Channel 5 because I don't look good in a
> cute little plastic dress and still haven't found any martians to
> shoot while dancing to funk music.

you play Space Channel 5 in first person? :D

--
Gunnar
    #31 SUCKS#015 Tupperware MC#002 DoD#0x1B DoDRT#003 DoD:CT#4,8 Kibo: 2
        gnus don't kill people.  gnus-summary-lower-score kills people.

jason moy

Cockpits: From the outside

by jason moy » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 05:49:33


> you play Space Channel 5 in first person? :D

What my girlfriend and I choose to do when we're alone is none of your business. =p

Jason

Eldre

Cockpits: From the outside

by Eldre » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 23:39:44



>the scope of an AK-47 is why I buy these games, it's why I bought
>Sublogic's Jet and Flight Simulator for my Apple ][.  For me, it's not
>about fun or playability, it's about makebelieve. =)

Flight Simulator for Apple II?!?  Wow, someone who's been *** as long as *I*
have...<g>

WTF?!?  That's not a real game, right?

Eldred
--
Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001
Homepage - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~epickett
GPLRank - under construction...

Never argue with an idiot.  He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
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