rec.autos.simulators

by **Dave Henri** » Mon, 18 Mar 2002 14:43:42

We've all been thru the arguments for and against driving from the
***pit. But I had some random thoughts today that might add to the
discussion. I won't be using racing examples tho...
Recently saw a publicity screen shot of Star Trek Bridge Commander. The
trouble was...there was NO BRIDGE. Just the familiar Tailgunner view so
many of us know. A nice picture of the "D" Enterprise exchanging phaser
fire with another Wessel...errrr Vessel. But the dang title is called
"Bridge Comander" not "I'm floating behind the ship in an escape pod
Commander."
I can only imagine what the title isn't going to have. Instead of crisp
console views that have specific purposes, you merely point and click your
ship at another enemy. Couldnt' they have made an entire Bridge crew that
carries out your orders? Imagine the mulitplayer possiblities...instead of
Quake Clans, you could have a fully trained Bridge crew of your friends
battling Borg or other humans. But instead...it's floating out behind your
ship all by yourself...
Has the 'training' that console buyers received with tailgunner arcade
driving bled over to other genre?
Think about the Quake & Tomb Raider titles...Quake, is first person, in
the***pit as-it-were. TR is Laura Croft's behind staring at you. Which
series has stood the test of time?
For many of the new Special Ops titles like Ghost Recon you can have both
first person(in the***pit) and third person(tail gunner) views. But when
you need that long sniper shot, that desperate kill shot, do you stay in
third person and try to aim looking over the shoulder? Nope! You switch to
scope or sniper views(cockpit) to get a good aim.
So has the arcade training of consoles diluted racing and other forms of
***? Or has it suplimented a rigid format?
Dave henrie

by **Txl** » Mon, 18 Mar 2002 18:33:29

Well, the "outside" view makes the "slide detection" easier for me, I see
the slide sonner and can TRY to catch it, it also make the "driving on the
curbs" easier...
It might also be because I'm used to it...

by **Targano** » Mon, 18 Mar 2002 20:21:13

Great Veiwpoint! Wow your right.

We all should be in the Wessel oops..***pits. I make no appolligee I'm a
pro***pit person! YOu don't see Peter Brock or*** Johnson, or Micheal
Schumacer gliding along behind the car on a hang glider or sitting on the
bonet.

by **lane** » Mon, 18 Mar 2002 21:10:15

I haven't played this game, but I did look at the screenshots on the box and
it showed a bridge with crew on board so there must be a bridge view also.

by **Jonny Hodgso** » Tue, 19 Mar 2002 01:27:05

> "Bridge Comander" not "I'm floating behind the ship in an escape pod
> Commander."

Does Racer have a***pit view yet?

D/l'd the latest version last night and had a go, but the graphics
weren't great on my system (some odd textures on the car, and not
enough fps) and I don't find it easy to drift a car through a corner
from 'tailgunner' view...

Jonny

by **MadDAW** » Tue, 19 Mar 2002 02:04:46

No you don't. You also don't see them sitting at a desk looking at a 17"
(15.8 viewable) screen either. They also don't try to use simulated FF thru
only a steering wheel to make up for what they can feel thru their bodies.

MadDAWG

by **MadDAW** » Tue, 19 Mar 2002 02:10:42

I've said it before and I'll say it again: we are a long way from realistic
in any of the games you mentioned. The different POV help make up for what
you don't have in a game vs. real life. I personly use the***pit view for
single seater types of cars like GPL, but the offest seating position of a
stockcar or rally car always has me clipping something with my RF corner. I
can't count the number of times I clipped those darn road signs in the Rally
Trophy demo. I don't care if there is its 3d modeled we are still looking at
a 2d image. As long as a game gives you the choice of the view you want who
cares what someone else uses.

MadDAWG

by **Uncle Feste** » Tue, 19 Mar 2002 02:56:15

> So has the arcade training of consoles diluted racing and other forms of
> ***? Or has it suplimented a rigid format?

I'd say you've hit the nail on the head. The Nintendo/PlayStation crowd
has been polluting it.

--

Fester

"Beware the leader who bangs the drums of war in order to whip the
citizenry into a patriotic fervor, for patriotism is indeed a
double-edged sword. It both emboldens the ***, just as it narrows the
mind. And when the drums of war have reached a fever pitch and the
*** boils with hate and the mind has closed, the leader will have no
need in seizing the rights of the citizenry. Rather, the citizenry,
infused with fear and blinded by patriotism, will offer up all of their
rights unto the leader and gladly so. How do I know? For this is what I
have done. And I am Caesar." -- Julius Caesar

by **Jim Seamu** » Tue, 19 Mar 2002 05:12:47

Racer cars have 10 cameras (number keys 1 through 0) and they're placed
wherever the car.ini maker decides to put them. So***pit views ARE
possible (see Stecki's Alpine A110, for example).... the dials on the (3d
modelled) dash work properly and the steering wheel turns...... no mirrors
yet though.

by **Gerry Aitke** » Tue, 19 Mar 2002 06:54:32

> > So has the arcade training of consoles diluted racing and other forms of
> > ***? Or has it suplimented a rigid format?
> > Dave henrie

> I've said it before and I'll say it again: we are a long way from realistic
> in any of the games you mentioned. The different POV help make up for what
> you don't have in a game vs. real life. I personly use the***pit view for
> single seater types of cars like GPL, but the offest seating position of a
> stockcar or rally car always has me clipping something with my RF corner. I
> can't count the number of times I clipped those darn road signs in the Rally
> Trophy demo. I don't care if there is its 3d modeled we are still looking at
> a 2d image. As long as a game gives you the choice of the view you want who
> cares what someone else uses.

I've never had any of that trouble. Maybe there's something wrong with
your brain?

by **Gerry Aitke** » Tue, 19 Mar 2002 06:56:53

> >YOu don't see Peter Brock or*** Johnson, or Micheal
> > Schumacer gliding along behind the car on a hang glider or sitting on the
> > bonet.

> No you don't. You also don't see them sitting at a desk looking at a 17"
> (15.8 viewable) screen either. They also don't try to use simulated FF thru
> only a steering wheel to make up for what they can feel thru their bodies.

Really?! What about when they drive computer based racing sims?

by **MadDAW** » Tue, 19 Mar 2002 09:45:51

Maybe your just an *** too

MadDAWG

by **Christopher J. Sypa** » Tue, 19 Mar 2002 14:25:09

Let it be known that on Sun, 17 Mar 2002 05:43:42 GMT, "Dave Henrie"

> Recently saw a publicity screen shot of Star Trek Bridge Commander. The
>trouble was...there was NO BRIDGE. Just the familiar Tailgunner view so
>many of us know. A nice picture of the "D" Enterprise exchanging phaser
>fire with another Wessel...errrr Vessel. But the dang title is called
>"Bridge Comander" not "I'm floating behind the ship in an escape pod
>Commander."
> I can only imagine what the title isn't going to have. Instead of crisp
>console views that have specific purposes, you merely point and click your
>ship at another enemy. Couldnt' they have made an entire Bridge crew that
>carries out your orders? Imagine the mulitplayer possiblities...instead of
>Quake Clans, you could have a fully trained Bridge crew of your friends
>battling Borg or other humans. But instead...it's floating out behind your
>ship all by yourself...

The entire point of Bridge Commander is that you are the captain and you do in
fact sit in the captain's chair. You move your mouse around and aim it at your
crew members to give them orders.

Next time you want to badmouth a title, you may want to read a little about it
first. Then you won't look like such a fool.

[ The Domestic Anime CD Guide ]
[ http://www.radiks.net/csypal/cds/ ]

by **Dave Henri** » Tue, 19 Mar 2002 15:16:37

"Christopher J. Sypal" > The entire point of Bridge Commander is that you
are the captain and you do in
Chris, I've never worried about looking or sounding the fool. It's good
that the title does seem to fulfill some of it's declared intentions. But
why then use 3rd person views for publicity stills? I know I didn't do ANY
real research for the post, but my point was/is...we have an entire
generation of gamers that seem to have been trained to accept outside views,
whether from fps titles like Laura Tomb Raider Croft or the newer tactical
ops titles. Of course there has always been that group of flight simmers
that use outside views.(shameful)
But thanks again for clairifying the gameplay. Now do they have any
multiplayer posibilities???
dave henrie

by **Gerry Aitke** » Tue, 19 Mar 2002 16:51:49

> > Maybe there's something wrong with
> > your brain?

> Maybe your just an *** too

> MadDAWG

There's no need to be like that! I'm merely stating that your brain
might be harder to fool into thinking it's looking at a 3d image. Mine,
on the other hand, is very easily fooled by a 2d image on screen. That,
of course, will give me an advantage in driving games.

Some people have poor depth perception in real life too. Maybe that's
your problem? Do you have trouble parking you road car?

rec.autos.simulators

Cockpits: From the outside

Cockpits: From the outside

Cockpits: From the outside

Cockpits: From the outside

Cockpits: From the outside

Cockpits: From the outside

Cockpits: From the outside

Cockpits: From the outside

Cockpits: From the outside

Cockpits: From the outside

Cockpits: From the outside

Cockpits: From the outside

Cockpits: From the outside

Cockpits: From the outside

Cockpits: From the outside

Cockpits: From the outside