rec.autos.simulators

by **SpeedFree** » Sun, 16 Jan 2000 04:00:00

Okay, so LeMans 24hrs aint a realistic simulation. Apart from GPL,
what other racing "game" IS realistic? GPL has spoiled us by giving
us the most accurate physics yet and to be honest, I only need 1 game
like that. I mean, it's taken me a year to get half proficient at GPL, I
just don't have the time to "learn" to drive another class of racing car
accurately....

But, LeMans is great fun once you sort out the calibration! Forget all
the concentration needed for GPL, just go out there and drive the
thing! Its a great blast, and the changing light as the sun moves is real
cool. You get that feeling of being blinded by the low sun at dawn too!
Also, you have to drive to conserve your tyres and engine, and this is
implemented quite well. LeMans sure aint no sim, but there's a lot of
fun to be had without the 'hassle' of spending a year learning to drive
the cars!

I found approx 25% sensitivity works well.

Lol SpeedFreek

by **Marc Collin** » Sun, 16 Jan 2000 04:00:00

Sure non-sims (everything but GPL??) can be fun, but is this a N3 non-sim or
a SOS '37 non-sim? Most seem to think it's a lot closer to SOS '37 (or Test
Drive 5) than the other end of the spectrum.

Marc.

by **SpeedFree** » Sun, 16 Jan 2000 04:00:00

Nearer to N3 than SOS '37 definitely! I would put it just below TOCA2,
but way above NFS or Test Drive! It is more "realistic" than the original
GranTourismo, because the cars performance degrades after abuse!

Lol SpeedFreek

>Sure non-sims (everything but GPL??) can be fun, but is this a N3 non-sim
or
>a SOS '37 non-sim? Most seem to think it's a lot closer to SOS '37 (or
Test
>Drive 5) than the other end of the spectrum.

>Marc.

>> Okay, so LeMans 24hrs aint a realistic simulation. Apart from GPL,
>> what other racing "game" IS realistic? GPL has spoiled us by giving
>> us the most accurate physics yet and to be honest, I only need 1 game
>> like that. I mean, it's taken me a year to get half proficient at GPL, I
>> just don't have the time to "learn" to drive another class of racing car
>> accurately....

>> But, LeMans is great fun once you sort out the calibration! Forget all
>> the concentration needed for GPL, just go out there and drive the
>> thing! Its a great blast, and the changing light as the sun moves is real
>> cool. You get that feeling of being blinded by the low sun at dawn too!
>> Also, you have to drive to conserve your tyres and engine, and this is
>> implemented quite well. LeMans sure aint no sim, but there's a lot of
>> fun to be had without the 'hassle' of spending a year learning to drive
>> the cars!

>> I found approx 25% sensitivity works well.

>> Lol SpeedFreek

by **Andi Col** » Sun, 16 Jan 2000 04:00:00

Fun!!! how can a game be fun with no multiplayer, GT2 cars as fast as GT1 or
prototype, and no internal veiw. I played for 10 minutes last night (after I
sorted calibrating my FF wheel) driving from behind the car (a la console
crap) and when I read that the multiplayer code had been left off, I put it
all back in the box ready for Postman Pat on Monday to take it back.

Andi.

by **James Wohleve** » Sun, 16 Jan 2000 04:00:00

On the following date: Sat, 15 Jan 2000 13:10:12 -0000, said person(s)

Indycar, Indycar 2, NASCAR, NASCAR 2, NASCAR 3, Sports Car GT, MGPR,
Soda, DTR, need I go on?

Umm.. I don't like GPL.. so that idea is ummm... wrong.

And figure out that sex on a washing machine at full cycle really is
pretty damn cool.

And take 2 Prozacs and stand upside down in your chair.

No, the above line should read...
"Go out there and hold the joystick as if you were actually going to
get to drive the thing"

Ohhh buddy.. I tell you.. A moving sun is THE thing I look for in a
racing sim.

I can get the same effect by taking a flashlight and staring into it
while it's on.

LOL! Where?
Oh, you mean when you rub against the velcro walls?

...and it sure aint no fun neither.

You are definitely the target group they were looking for.
Let's see.. gas, brake, steering wheel.. No stop the insanity.. too
many variables.. Paradox, Paradox, Paradox!

With Trojan Gold sensitive you get about 33% more sensitivity.

Speedfreek, the fact remains. they should not have advertised the game
being a sim that has the most accurate physics model "unsurpassed" by
any other sim.
hell, NASCAR Revolution has better physics model than this total piece
of cow dung.

- James "Gunslinger" Wohlever

Techware Motorsports
http://techware.gtinsider.com

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by **Andre Warring** » Sun, 16 Jan 2000 04:00:00

It's more of a Grand Turismo non-sim. It's FAR better than SoS '37,
and I really can't compare it to N3. N3 is a sim which fails to be a
really great sim like GPL is, Lemans doesn't pretend to be a sim.
It's an arcade game, it's presented as an arcade game, and it plays
like an arcade game. But a damn good arcade game.

But they really should remove the 'real world physics' hype from their
site, that's simply not true.

Andre

On Sat, 15 Jan 2000 14:39:42 GMT, "Marc Collins"

>Sure non-sims (everything but GPL??) can be fun, but is this a N3 non-sim or
>a SOS '37 non-sim? Most seem to think it's a lot closer to SOS '37 (or Test
>Drive 5) than the other end of the spectrum.

>Marc.

>> Okay, so LeMans 24hrs aint a realistic simulation. Apart from GPL,
>> what other racing "game" IS realistic? GPL has spoiled us by giving
>> us the most accurate physics yet and to be honest, I only need 1 game
>> like that. I mean, it's taken me a year to get half proficient at GPL, I
>> just don't have the time to "learn" to drive another class of racing car
>> accurately....

>> But, LeMans is great fun once you sort out the calibration! Forget all
>> the concentration needed for GPL, just go out there and drive the
>> thing! Its a great blast, and the changing light as the sun moves is real
>> cool. You get that feeling of being blinded by the low sun at dawn too!
>> Also, you have to drive to conserve your tyres and engine, and this is
>> implemented quite well. LeMans sure aint no sim, but there's a lot of
>> fun to be had without the 'hassle' of spending a year learning to drive
>> the cars!

>> I found approx 25% sensitivity works well.

>> Lol SpeedFreek

by **Andre Warring** » Sun, 16 Jan 2000 04:00:00

Try the bumper vieuw, that's a lot more fun, gives you a much better
feel of speed.
The lack of multiplayer is a real shame indeed.

Andre

On Sat, 15 Jan 2000 15:15:41 -0000, "Andi Cole"

>Fun!!! how can a game be fun with no multiplayer, GT2 cars as fast as GT1 or
>prototype, and no internal veiw. I played for 10 minutes last night (after I
>sorted calibrating my FF wheel) driving from behind the car (a la console
>crap) and when I read that the multiplayer code had been left off, I put it
>all back in the box ready for Postman Pat on Monday to take it back.

>Andi.

>> Okay, so LeMans 24hrs aint a realistic simulation. Apart from GPL,
>> what other racing "game" IS realistic? GPL has spoiled us by giving
>> us the most accurate physics yet and to be honest, I only need 1 game
>> like that. I mean, it's taken me a year to get half proficient at GPL, I
>> just don't have the time to "learn" to drive another class of racing car
>> accurately....

>> But, LeMans is great fun once you sort out the calibration! Forget all
>> the concentration needed for GPL, just go out there and drive the
>> thing! Its a great blast, and the changing light as the sun moves is real
>> cool. You get that feeling of being blinded by the low sun at dawn too!
>> Also, you have to drive to conserve your tyres and engine, and this is
>> implemented quite well. LeMans sure aint no sim, but there's a lot of
>> fun to be had without the 'hassle' of spending a year learning to drive
>> the cars!

>> I found approx 25% sensitivity works well.

>> Lol SpeedFreek

by **SpeedFree** » Sun, 16 Jan 2000 04:00:00

Hmmm I'm being flamed for expressing an opinion. I said nothing offensive,
but here I am having the***taken out of me......

>On the following date: Sat, 15 Jan 2000 13:10:12 -0000, said person(s)

>>Okay, so LeMans 24hrs aint a realistic simulation. Apart from GPL,
>>what other racing "game" IS realistic?

>Indycar, Indycar 2, NASCAR, NASCAR 2, NASCAR 3, Sports Car GT, MGPR,
>Soda, DTR, need I go on?

Nascar3? realistic? Hahahahah!!! ROTFL!!! My 8 year old nephew can handle
Nascar3!!!! No way is Nascar 3 realistic!
MGPR???? The tracks have no camber!! And very little elevation. The cars do
NOT
handle at all realistically... the way the setups affect the car handling is
dubious to say
the least.... okay so both these "games" are a little more accurate
than LeMans, But they sure aint realistic. I have no experience of the other
titles,
so I cannot comment on how realistic they are, although Ive never heard SCGT
being
referred to as an accurate simulation either. So yes, you do need to go on,
and find
a REALISTIC sim apart from GPL.

Nevertheless, GPL DOES have the most accurate physics of any racing
sim. So people HAVE been spoiled by it. Now it seems nothing less
will do. (Unless you include games like Nascar3, which are a LOT less
accurate than GPL!) So that idea is NOT wrong.

Whatever turns you on eh?

Now you are just talking nonsense.

Well, if you are gonna be like that then NOTHING is as accurate as doing
it for real..... doh!!! BTW, most racers use a steering wheel, not a
joystick,
as joysticks aint REALISTIC.

So Im not allowed to point out anything about the way the game looks?
Oh, the irony! The sarcasm! I'm cut to the bone here.

Maybe try using a high powered Laser beam next time.

Your tyres go off if you lean on them too much.. you lose power from the
engine and eventually blow it up if you don't "watch those gauges".
Where? THERE!!!!!

Fun = light hearted entertainment. You obviously like your fun REAL
SERIOUS.

HAHAHAH!!!! You picked the wrong man to level that one at!!!
I am a well known GPL online racer, right from when GPL came
out. You don't like GPL? Scared of a REAL sim eh? I'm not. I like
a little light hearted entertainment now and then (Le Mans), but I am
a die-hard GPL nutter, and we all know just how hard GPL is, don't
we......

Ahh... an attempt at *** humour.. anyone laughing?

Yes, this is true, I have to admit.. the first level headed thing you said
in the
whole mail so far...

Yup. I said the physics werent accurate right from the off... i.e. see the
subject heading of my mail.... my point was that accuracy isn't always
required for a game to be enjoyed.... have you addressed this point
at all??? NO!!!

SpeedFreek

by **SpeedFree** » Sun, 16 Jan 2000 04:00:00

>Fun!!! how can a game be fun with no multiplayer, GT2 cars as fast as GT1
or
>prototype, and no internal veiw. I played for 10 minutes last night (after
I
>sorted calibrating my FF wheel) driving from behind the car (a la console
>crap) and when I read that the multiplayer code had been left off, I put it
>all back in the box ready for Postman Pat on Monday to take it back.

The GT2 cars are at least 3-5 seconds a lap slower than the GT1 cars.
The "internal" view is the bonnet cam. Or the bumper cam. Only a fool
would drive using the "behind" view! No multiplayer IS crap, it's true.

Lots of games have no multiplayer, but are still fun.
10 minutes? An in depth trial then?

by **George M. Smile** » Sun, 16 Jan 2000 04:00:00

> GPL has spoiled us by giving us the most accurate physics yet
> and to be honest, I only need 1 game like that. I mean, it's
> taken me a year to get half proficient at GPL, I just don't have
> the time to "learn" to drive another class of racing car
> accurately....

I would say then that you are missing the point. Once you
master a realistic simulation there should be very little in
the way of 'retraining' necessary to master another sim
of equal quality. The laws of physics themselves are
after all immutable. Different simulations will of course
model those laws in different fashions, but as the accuracy
of simulations increase the differences between any two
simulations decrease until the simulations themself become
immutable.

Do you really think A.J Foyt, Dan Gurney, or Mario Andretti
really had to sit down and think hard about the differences
between driving a stock car, an open wheel car, and a sports
car? They were (well are if Andretti does indeed return to
Le Mans this year) drivers, the have mastered the art of
driving. Isn't that the goal of simulation racing as well?

- George

by **SpeedFree** » Sun, 16 Jan 2000 04:00:00

Okay, you got me! In my case it's actually learning how to set up
the GPL cars for my style that has taken all the time, not learning
to drive them. And the other problem is how simulations convey
the attitude of the car to the driver. You can't feel the car through
your ***like in a real car, so the sim has to convey everything
through sight and sound alone. This means that racing simulations
may end up being harder to learn than real cars!! ;-) So learning how
to find the limit in a new sim is less instinctive than in real life!

Hehe.. so now I can drive GPL, does that mean I can drive any sim?
It probably does, but with each new sim it's a case of finding out how
to set up the car to be fastest that takes all the effort... (except for
Nascar3, one of the few sims to give you decent setups to begin with!)

Maybe what I meant was that I can't be bothered spending all the time it
takes to get up to speed... I thought I knew how to drive racing sims before
GPL came along, but it has shocked me how hard it is to go really fast
in GPL. It's like I got up to 95% speed in the first 3 months, and the other
5%
has taken 9 months! (Ouch!) And I'm still not fast enough....

Good point well made though, George.

From Lol SpeedFreek

>> GPL has spoiled us by giving us the most accurate physics yet
>> and to be honest, I only need 1 game like that. I mean, it's
>> taken me a year to get half proficient at GPL, I just don't have
>> the time to "learn" to drive another class of racing car
>> accurately....

>I would say then that you are missing the point. Once you
>master a realistic simulation there should be very little in
>the way of 'retraining' necessary to master another sim
>of equal quality. The laws of physics themselves are
>after all immutable. Different simulations will of course
>model those laws in different fashions, but as the accuracy
>of simulations increase the differences between any two
>simulations decrease until the simulations themself become
>immutable.

>Do you really think A.J Foyt, Dan Gurney, or Mario Andretti
>really had to sit down and think hard about the differences
>between driving a stock car, an open wheel car, and a sports
>car? They were (well are if Andretti does indeed return to
>Le Mans this year) drivers, the have mastered the art of
>driving. Isn't that the goal of simulation racing as well?

> - George

by **Andi Col** » Sun, 16 Jan 2000 04:00:00

How do you get the bumper view? I can find nothing that tells you how to.

Andi.

> Try the bumper vieuw, that's a lot more fun, gives you a much better
> feel of speed.
> The lack of multiplayer is a real shame indeed.

> Andre

> On Sat, 15 Jan 2000 15:15:41 -0000, "Andi Cole"

> >Fun!!! how can a game be fun with no multiplayer, GT2 cars as fast as GT1
or
> >prototype, and no internal veiw. I played for 10 minutes last night
(after I
> >sorted calibrating my FF wheel) driving from behind the car (a la console
> >crap) and when I read that the multiplayer code had been left off, I put
it
> >all back in the box ready for Postman Pat on Monday to take it back.

> >Andi.

> >> Okay, so LeMans 24hrs aint a realistic simulation. Apart from GPL,
> >> what other racing "game" IS realistic? GPL has spoiled us by giving
> >> us the most accurate physics yet and to be honest, I only need 1 game
> >> like that. I mean, it's taken me a year to get half proficient at GPL,
I
> >> just don't have the time to "learn" to drive another class of racing
car
> >> accurately....

> >> But, LeMans is great fun once you sort out the calibration! Forget all
> >> the concentration needed for GPL, just go out there and drive the
> >> thing! Its a great blast, and the changing light as the sun moves is
real
> >> cool. You get that feeling of being blinded by the low sun at dawn too!
> >> Also, you have to drive to conserve your tyres and engine, and this is
> >> implemented quite well. LeMans sure aint no sim, but there's a lot of
> >> fun to be had without the 'hassle' of spending a year learning to drive
> >> the cars!

> >> I found approx 25% sensitivity works well.

> >> Lol SpeedFreek

by **Andi Col** » Sun, 16 Jan 2000 04:00:00

How do you get to the bumber view?

Andi.

> Try the bumper vieuw, that's a lot more fun, gives you a much better
> feel of speed.
> The lack of multiplayer is a real shame indeed.

> Andre

> On Sat, 15 Jan 2000 15:15:41 -0000, "Andi Cole"

> >Fun!!! how can a game be fun with no multiplayer, GT2 cars as fast as GT1
or
> >prototype, and no internal veiw. I played for 10 minutes last night
(after I
> >sorted calibrating my FF wheel) driving from behind the car (a la console
> >crap) and when I read that the multiplayer code had been left off, I put
it
> >all back in the box ready for Postman Pat on Monday to take it back.

> >Andi.

> >> Okay, so LeMans 24hrs aint a realistic simulation. Apart from GPL,
> >> what other racing "game" IS realistic? GPL has spoiled us by giving
> >> us the most accurate physics yet and to be honest, I only need 1 game
> >> like that. I mean, it's taken me a year to get half proficient at GPL,
I
> >> just don't have the time to "learn" to drive another class of racing
car
> >> accurately....

> >> But, LeMans is great fun once you sort out the calibration! Forget all
> >> the concentration needed for GPL, just go out there and drive the
> >> thing! Its a great blast, and the changing light as the sun moves is
real
> >> cool. You get that feeling of being blinded by the low sun at dawn too!
> >> Also, you have to drive to conserve your tyres and engine, and this is
> >> implemented quite well. LeMans sure aint no sim, but there's a lot of
> >> fun to be had without the 'hassle' of spending a year learning to drive
> >> the cars!

> >> I found approx 25% sensitivity works well.

> >> Lol SpeedFreek

by **SpeedFree** » Sun, 16 Jan 2000 04:00:00

In the controller options screen under define controllers you set a
button/key to change views with... there are 3 views.. behind, bonnet
and bumper (well, more like front of bonnet if you ask me!)

by **Andre Warring** » Sun, 16 Jan 2000 04:00:00

In the joystick calibration screen, I assigned the view cam to one of
my firebuttons.

Andre

On Sat, 15 Jan 2000 17:46:16 -0000, "Andi Cole"

>How do you get the bumper view? I can find nothing that tells you how to.

>Andi.

>> Try the bumper vieuw, that's a lot more fun, gives you a much better
>> feel of speed.
>> The lack of multiplayer is a real shame indeed.

>> Andre

>> On Sat, 15 Jan 2000 15:15:41 -0000, "Andi Cole"

>> >Fun!!! how can a game be fun with no multiplayer, GT2 cars as fast as GT1
>or
>> >prototype, and no internal veiw. I played for 10 minutes last night
>(after I
>> >sorted calibrating my FF wheel) driving from behind the car (a la console
>> >crap) and when I read that the multiplayer code had been left off, I put
>it
>> >all back in the box ready for Postman Pat on Monday to take it back.

>> >Andi.

>> >> Okay, so LeMans 24hrs aint a realistic simulation. Apart from GPL,
>> >> what other racing "game" IS realistic? GPL has spoiled us by giving
>> >> us the most accurate physics yet and to be honest, I only need 1 game
>> >> like that. I mean, it's taken me a year to get half proficient at GPL,
>I
>> >> just don't have the time to "learn" to drive another class of racing
>car
>> >> accurately....

>> >> But, LeMans is great fun once you sort out the calibration! Forget all
>> >> the concentration needed for GPL, just go out there and drive the
>> >> thing! Its a great blast, and the changing light as the sun moves is
>real
>> >> cool. You get that feeling of being blinded by the low sun at dawn too!
>> >> Also, you have to drive to conserve your tyres and engine, and this is
>> >> implemented quite well. LeMans sure aint no sim, but there's a lot of
>> >> fun to be had without the 'hassle' of spending a year learning to drive
>> >> the cars!

>> >> I found approx 25% sensitivity works well.

>> >> Lol SpeedFreek

rec.autos.simulators

LeMans 24hrs aint no SIM, but it's FUN!

LeMans 24hrs aint no SIM, but it's FUN!

LeMans 24hrs aint no SIM, but it's FUN!

LeMans 24hrs aint no SIM, but it's FUN!

LeMans 24hrs aint no SIM, but it's FUN!

LeMans 24hrs aint no SIM, but it's FUN!

LeMans 24hrs aint no SIM, but it's FUN!

LeMans 24hrs aint no SIM, but it's FUN!

LeMans 24hrs aint no SIM, but it's FUN!

LeMans 24hrs aint no SIM, but it's FUN!

LeMans 24hrs aint no SIM, but it's FUN!

LeMans 24hrs aint no SIM, but it's FUN!

LeMans 24hrs aint no SIM, but it's FUN!

LeMans 24hrs aint no SIM, but it's FUN!

LeMans 24hrs aint no SIM, but it's FUN!

LeMans 24hrs aint no SIM, but it's FUN!