rec.autos.simulators

Hiya all

How come that if I take of steering help in f1gp the car is totally
uncontrollable?  How can I correct it?

Cya

The answers are there.  You just have to know where to look...
Check out my web page for all your links to F1GP,Indycar,ICR2,Nascar and
X-Files.
Do it know : http://www.racesimcentral.net/

Hi,

Steering help is included in F1GP so that a game which simulates
a real F1 car (which would normally be controlled by a real steering
wheel with a large "throw" of possible input ranges) can be controlled
using a computer keyboard (digital input). This is why the game  
doesn't allow you to play with keys with steering help off - each
time you pressed 'left' it would turn the cars wheels to full left
lock - it would be uncontrollable. Even an analog joystick has a
much narrower range of "throw" than a steering wheel device, so it
is quite difficult to control the car by this means with steering
help off. Basically, if you want to play F1GP without steering help,
you need to buy a steering wheel (now I just wait for all of those
joystick users to disagree with me!!).

Cheers,

Fraser

: Hiya all

: How come that if I take of steering help in f1gp the car is totally
: uncontrollable?  How can I correct it?

: Cya

: The answers are there.  You just have to know where to look...
: Check out my web page for all your links to F1GP,Indycar,ICR2,Nascar and
: X-Files.
: Do it know : http://members.aol.com/ARobe85580/home.html

It depends what you're using. I use a CH Pro yoke with CH pro pedals
with steering help and traction help both switched off. I find that
the cars are quite controllable, but that you can't get anywhere
near the `hot' laps. What areyou using?

Alan

--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The views/opinions expressed here are my own and do not
in any way reflect the views/opinions of my employer.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Andrew Easter

: >: How come that if I take of steering help in f1gp the car is totally
: >: uncontrollable?  How can I correct it?

: I just want to say that, without all the steering and traction help, you
: are simulating a real F1 car, don't ever think that driving the real
: thing is easy, not that I ever had myself.

I just want to say, don't ever think that it is that hard to drive a real
F1 car.  Do you honestly think that just breathing on the steering wheel
will cause the car to do an instantaneous 90 degree turn.  Driving F1GP
with a joystick and SA off is the most UNrealistic experience that was
ever written for the PC (unless you count driving flat out through the
turn 11 sickane at Australia in ICR).

Please don't post that ***about a joystick not being a steering wheel.

wheel 2 degrees does not equal 90 degrees of turning ability.

: : >: How come that if I take of steering help in f1gp the car is totally
: : >: uncontrollable?  How can I correct it?

: : I just want to say that, without all the steering and traction help, you
: : are simulating a real F1 car, don't ever think that driving the real
: : thing is easy, not that I ever had myself.

: I just want to say, don't ever think that it is that hard to drive a real
: F1 car.  Do you honestly think that just breathing on the steering wheel
: will cause the car to do an instantaneous 90 degree turn.  Driving F1GP
: with a joystick and SA off is the most UNrealistic experience that was
: ever written for the PC (unless you count driving flat out through the
: turn 11 sickane at Australia in ICR).

: Please don't post that ***about a joystick not being a steering wheel.

: wheel 2 degrees does not equal 90 degrees of turning ability.

I think you're right here, watching the Canadian GP yesterday Jacques
Villeneuve's steering wheel was all over the place on some of the bumpy
corners, and he wasn't spinning out.

--
Tim Barnes                              |   Dept. of Mathematics,

http://www.racesimcentral.net/~BarnesT  |   Bristol, U.K.
Tel: +44 (0)117 928 7780                |   BS8 1TW

: : : >: How come that if I take of steering help in f1gp the car is totally
: : : >: uncontrollable?  How can I correct it?

: : : I just want to say that, without all the steering and traction help, you
: : : are simulating a real F1 car, don't ever think that driving the real
: : : thing is easy, not that I ever had myself.

: : I just want to say, don't ever think that it is that hard to drive a real
: : F1 car.  Do you honestly think that just breathing on the steering wheel
: : will cause the car to do an instantaneous 90 degree turn.  Driving F1GP
: : with a joystick and SA off is the most UNrealistic experience that was
: : ever written for the PC (unless you count driving flat out through the
: : turn 11 sickane at Australia in ICR).

: : Please don't post that ***about a joystick not being a steering wheel.

: : wheel 2 degrees does not equal 90 degrees of turning ability.

: I think you're right here, watching the Canadian GP yesterday Jacques
: Villeneuve's steering wheel was all over the place on some of the bumpy
: corners, and he wasn't spinning out.

I don't use steering help or traction control and do just fine (I use
CH Pro pedals and Yoke). You basically have to forget about emulating those
hot laps, which were done using the keyboard with steering help and traction
on. So it's a case of more wing. What I've had to do is use GPEditor to
massage the AI car parameters otherwise they rocket off into the wild blue
yonder (if they don't take you out first that is). I'll send you some of my
setups if you like.

Alan

: --
: Tim Barnes                              |   Dept. of Mathematics,

: http://www.racesimcentral.net/~BarnesT  |   Bristol, U.K.
: Tel: +44 (0)117 928 7780                |   BS8 1TW

--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The views/opinions expressed here are my own and do not
in any way reflect the views/opinions of my employer.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

The arguement that the steering accurately models a real F1 car's steering is
not valid. An F1 car at low speed is very precisely controllable. (Analog
steering does not act like a switch.) The steering problem in F1GP was just
as severe at low speed as high. Something was definately not right.

I suspect an oversight in the calibration/gameport or steering routines
caused the problem for many users. There is no other explanation as to why
the steering quickly went to full lock before the limits in the joystick
potentiometer were reached.

I would bet F1GP2 will have no such problems when it is released.

 Dan

: >I don't use steering help or traction control and do just fine (I use
: >CH Pro pedals and Yoke). You basically have to forget about emulating those
: >hot laps, which were done using the keyboard with steering help and traction
: >on.

: Close, but no cigar. Traction help is OFF for virtually all the fastest
: HOF laps.
: --

 I stand partially corrected then ;-).

But the point I was trying to make was that using a wheel and pedals
is a very different proposition to using the keyboard. You could
set the grip levels very high I suppose (mine is set to one, the lowest).
Having driven a formula ford on a number of occassions, the setup
I currently have gives the best comparison with the `real thing'.

Alan

--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The views/opinions expressed here are my own and do not
in any way reflect the views/opinions of my employer.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

iRichard

Actually I didn't write this - it was reply to one that I wrote. I use pedals
and wheel with no steering hep or traction help. I get a bit of a problem
with excessive tyre wear, but otherwise it's perfectly controllable.

Alan

: > Erratic control is one reason I never used F1GP with out steering help. A VERY
: > SMALL amount of joystick movement (based on the percentage of total usable
: > resistance range in the pot) was all that was needed to turn the front wheels
: > to full lock to either side. This was not a flaw in the joystick or the game
: > port as EVERY other program that I used the stick for worked well. Calibration
: > settings in the game and gameport compensation changes did not cure the
: > problem. It was truely undrivable and unrealistic with steering help off.
: > That was one reason I boxed the game after ICR came out.
: >
: > The arguement that the steering accurately models a real F1 car's steering is
: > not valid. An F1 car at low speed is very precisely controllable. (Analog
: > steering does not act like a switch.) The steering problem in F1GP was just
: > as severe at low speed as high. Something was definately not right.
: >
: > I suspect an oversight in the calibration/gameport or steering routines
: > caused the problem for many users. There is no other explanation as to why
: > the steering quickly went to full lock before the limits in the joystick
: > potentiometer were reached.
: >
: > I would bet F1GP2 will have no such problems when it is released.
: >
: >  Dan
: >
: I always thought that steering help was only for joystick users. If you use a wheel, then it's fine without steering help. Well...it's a bit twitchy, but no more than I would imagine a real F1 is :-))
: --
:         Cheers,

:                 Richard.

:      m     m
:     mmm   mmm      Richard Beckett,       GSM Systems Engineer
:    mmmmm mmmmm     Motorola Ltd,
:   mm   mmm   mm    16 Euroway, Blagrove,  Tel: +44 (0)1793 545136
:  m      m      m   Swindon, Wiltshire,    Fax: +44 (0)1793 432745

: "And the first five places are filled by five different cars."
:  
:  MURRAY WALKER

--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The views/opinions expressed here are my own and do not
in any way reflect the views/opinions of my employer.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~