rec.autos.simulators

by **Tadej Krev** » Tue, 09 Mar 1999 04:00:00

Yeah !!

Now I'm sure that Jim Clark and Graham Hill were really talented guy
backthere in '67.
As I fired up GPL and went for an AI race (I was practicing for some
event where we had
to use default setups) at Glen. I did low 1:05.97 in quals with default
setup and on full fuel
load. I was pretty satisfied. But then a shock as I returned back to the
garage !!
The pole position time was 1:02.26 done by Mr. Clark with Mr. Hill
following him at 1:02.27sec
There was also a BRM in 1:02.6x and Brabham in 1:02.4x.

Ok, I thought...let's try this out :)

Started from the back of the pack I had a brilliant start and got from
10th place to 6th out of T3.
Then everything went fine through T4 but accelerating out of it (I had a
good line) looked like
I would only be feeding some 50% throttle. BRM and some others just blew
me on the straight ! :(
I was on Lotus btw. :) I was blocking off the usual backmarkers as hell
until I made a mistake unser instant pressure for 3 laps and in T4 spun
out on lap4. I never seen the AI's from then onwards....

The end of the race saw winning Jim Clark with fast lap of 1:02.37 !!

I think there should be some reality in Global Hype Scaling System ....
I mean, who can do those times ? :o)
Maybe if I attached wings to Lotti, hehe....

Weird is all I can say....

Tadej Krevh
Lotus Internet Racing
http://www.racesimcentral.net/

by **Jack Ramb** » Tue, 09 Mar 1999 04:00:00

Keep practicing, Tadej, the AI drivers are throttling back waiting on you!
Unconstrained by the Normalized Player Time system, the AI is capable of
results like these. At 1:02, they're just warming up!

Watkins Glen Race Results:

Practice

1 5 J. Clark LOT 55.98
2 6 G. Hill LOT 56.05
3 9 D. Gurney EAG 56.19
4 3 C. Amon FER 56.30
5 19 B. McLaren EAG 56.31
6 18 L. Bandini FER 56.38
7 2 D. Hulme REP 56.48
8 1 J. Brabham REP 56.50
9 14 J. Rindt COV 56.51
10 7 J. Surtees MUR 56.56
11 15 P. Rodriguez COV 56.60
12 20 M. Parkes FER 56.64
13 11 J. Bonnier COV 56.83
14 16 L. Scarfiotti FER 57.07
15 13 C. Irwin BRM 57.09
16 10 R. Ginther EAG 57.11
17 17 J. Siffert COV 57.11
18 8 J. Beltoise BRM 57.13
19 12 J. Ickx COV 57.60

Official Standings

1 5 J. Clark LOT 146.7 mph
2 6 G. Hill LOT 2.28
3 9 D. Gurney EAG 5.32
4 3 C. Amon FER 8.48
5 19 B. McLaren EAG 9.40
6 18 L. Bandini FER 11.08
7 1 J. Brabham REP 13.35
8 2 D. Hulme REP 14.58
9 14 J. Rindt COV 16.44
10 20 M. Parkes FER 18.44
11 15 P. Rodriguez COV 18.65
12 7 J. Surtees MUR 20.74
13 16 L. Scarfiotti FER 27.48
14 10 R. Ginther EAG 28.03
15 11 J. Bonnier COV 28.61
16 17 J. Siffert COV 29.64
17 8 J. Beltoise BRM 31.17
18 13 C. Irwin BRM 31.77
19 12 J. Ickx COV 37.48

Fastest Lap

5 J. Clark LOT 56.25

These numbers represent the limits of the cars and drivers as they're
modeled in GPL. Unrealistic for human drivers? Of course! But then 1:03.xx
at The Glen is pretty unrealistic too, isn't it? I think the difference can
be summed up like this:

67 F1 GPL GPL
Driver Expert AI

Computer-Like Close Not yet Yes
Decision Making

Fear Life on Fear of No
the line Failure

So until we have no fear (fear of failure, or any other kind) and always
maintain robot-like microsecond decision-making capability, the AI will just
keep waiting on us! Isn't it nice to know that there will always be somebody
that can glue themselves to your gearbox, waiting for you to make the
slightest little mistake?

I think a lot of people underestimate the value of the AI as a training
tool. I can't imagine how anyone couldn't improve their ability by either
chasing or being hounded by those little AI minds. And the wonderful thing
is that GPL has the flexibility, with the NPT system and the optional INI
file overrides, to insure that the competition is always there and tailored
to your liking!

Don't you just love this sim!

Jack Rambo

by **David Ewin** » Tue, 09 Mar 1999 04:00:00

> The pole position time was 1:02.26 done by Mr. Clark with Mr. Hill
> following him at 1:02.27sec
> There was also a BRM in 1:02.6x and Brabham in 1:02.4x.
> I think there should be some reality in Global Hype Scaling System ...

Tadej, did you have a clock smash in an online race lately that resulted
in an inaccurate (and impossibly fast) lap time, perhaps? These can
really get the AI "hyped up", so to speak. Either that, or you're just
too fast for you're own good ;-).

Global Hype is a strange concept. I can see how it's a good thing to
keep the really fast guys interested (no one wants to pull away in the
distance from the top AI), but if you can never really improve in
relation to the AI, what's the point?

Dave Ewing

by **Jack Ramb** » Tue, 09 Mar 1999 04:00:00

Dave...

The point is that you're continually getting faster, so that you can beat
the guy online who's not training against the AI.

And if you're not satisfied with just getting faster, than lock down the NPT
system by setting an appropriate NPT Override value, and you'll gradually
move up through the field. In Tadej's case, this value, of course, would be
something substantially below 1.00. <G>

by **David Ewin** » Tue, 09 Mar 1999 04:00:00

> The point is that you're continually getting faster, so that you can beat
> the guy online who's not training against the AI.

> And if you're not satisfied with just getting faster, than lock down the NPT
> system by setting an appropriate NPT Override value, and you'll gradually
> move up through the field.

Hi Jack. Right. I think that a better scheme would have been to have
the hype not kick in until you are able to get to the top of the grid.
That way, you get more immediate feedback with your progression up the
grid.

Don't I know it.

Dave Ewing

by **Wosc** » Tue, 09 Mar 1999 04:00:00

It is the normal GPL thing, as you get faster, the AI gets faster, if you
have done low 04's, it will modify the AI and make them faster, normally it
makes them faster on teh straight more than turns. You can change a setting
in the gpl_ai which will increase the drag on the straights so they get less
top speed and are more realistic and have to do all their speed in the
turns.

Jesse

>Yeah !!

>Now I'm sure that Jim Clark and Graham Hill were really talented guy
>backthere in '67.
>As I fired up GPL and went for an AI race (I was practicing for some
>event where we had
>to use default setups) at Glen. I did low 1:05.97 in quals with default
>setup and on full fuel
>load. I was pretty satisfied. But then a shock as I returned back to the
>garage !!
>The pole position time was 1:02.26 done by Mr. Clark with Mr. Hill
>following him at 1:02.27sec
>There was also a BRM in 1:02.6x and Brabham in 1:02.4x.

>Ok, I thought...let's try this out :)

>Started from the back of the pack I had a brilliant start and got from
>10th place to 6th out of T3.
>Then everything went fine through T4 but accelerating out of it (I had a
>good line) looked like
>I would only be feeding some 50% throttle. BRM and some others just blew
>me on the straight ! :(
>I was on Lotus btw. :) I was blocking off the usual backmarkers as hell
>until I made a mistake unser instant pressure for 3 laps and in T4 spun
>out on lap4. I never seen the AI's from then onwards....

>The end of the race saw winning Jim Clark with fast lap of 1:02.37 !!

>I think there should be some reality in Global Hype Scaling System ....
>I mean, who can do those times ? :o)
>Maybe if I attached wings to Lotti, hehe....

>Weird is all I can say....

>Tadej Krevh
>Lotus Internet Racing
>http://members.xoom.com/LotusRacing/

by **Tadej Krev** » Wed, 10 Mar 1999 04:00:00

Hehe....Nah...I'm not that good.
I'm yet to break into 1:03's :)

On the clock smash laptime, yes, I've had it, 10sec lap at Glen, hehe...
Now AI thinks that I __actually__ did that lap, phew !! :-)

Not be able to pull away from AI ? Well.. I have no problems with that
as long as I have fun. But I usually don't race offline, I have only done
some 3 or 4 races till now. I race online, it's more fun.

Tadej

> > The pole position time was 1:02.26 done by Mr. Clark with Mr. Hill
> > following him at 1:02.27sec
> > There was also a BRM in 1:02.6x and Brabham in 1:02.4x.

> > I think there should be some reality in Global Hype Scaling System ...

> Tadej, did you have a clock smash in an online race lately that resulted
> in an inaccurate (and impossibly fast) lap time, perhaps? These can
> really get the AI "hyped up", so to speak. Either that, or you're just
> too fast for you're own good ;-).

> Global Hype is a strange concept. I can see how it's a good thing to
> keep the really fast guys interested (no one wants to pull away in the
> distance from the top AI), but if you can never really improve in
> relation to the AI, what's the point?

> Dave Ewing

by **Paul Jone** » Wed, 10 Mar 1999 04:00:00

Yeah - I have a similar problem at Rouen where I did a 4 second lap with a
clock smash.
How can I put this right?
Also can I turn global hype scaling off or at least turn it down. It's very
frustrating that the faster I go, the faster they go, so I can never win
because although I can do a few reasonable laps (nowhere near your league, TK)
I will never be as consistent as the AI.
Cheers,
Paul

> Hehe....Nah...I'm not that good.
> I'm yet to break into 1:03's :)

> On the clock smash laptime, yes, I've had it, 10sec lap at Glen, hehe...
> Now AI thinks that I __actually__ did that lap, phew !! :-)

> Not be able to pull away from AI ? Well.. I have no problems with that
> as long as I have fun. But I usually don't race offline, I have only done
> some 3 or 4 races till now. I race online, it's more fun.

> Tadej

> > > The pole position time was 1:02.26 done by Mr. Clark with Mr. Hill
> > > following him at 1:02.27sec
> > > There was also a BRM in 1:02.6x and Brabham in 1:02.4x.

> > > I think there should be some reality in Global Hype Scaling System ...

> > Tadej, did you have a clock smash in an online race lately that resulted
> > in an inaccurate (and impossibly fast) lap time, perhaps? These can
> > really get the AI "hyped up", so to speak. Either that, or you're just
> > too fast for you're own good ;-).

> > Global Hype is a strange concept. I can see how it's a good thing to
> > keep the really fast guys interested (no one wants to pull away in the
> > distance from the top AI), but if you can never really improve in
> > relation to the AI, what's the point?

> > Dave Ewing

by **David Noona** » Wed, 10 Mar 1999 04:00:00

This could only be the result of a 'warp' lap.
The AI scaling works very well normally.
What happens is the back of the field speed up to match your lap speed while the front
of the field
only gain a little speed. If you were really lapping at 1.02 I doubt Clark and Hill
would be that near you.
It's also worth mentioning that the scaling only kicks in if you are within 20% of the
target time for a track but
most folks reading this will easily be inside that.

The drastic solution is to go to your sub-directory within PLAYERS and delete the
PLAYER.STS file.
You will reset the AI scaling for all the tracks doing this so your next race will be a
dream :)

Dave

by **UnserFan** » Wed, 10 Mar 1999 04:00:00

Damnit, you guys are really starting to make me feel r e a l l y s l o w
at Watkins Glen! My best lap is a 1:07! =(

by **Ian Parke** » Wed, 10 Mar 1999 04:00:00

Hi Paul, to reset the global hype rating, just delete the "player.sts" file
out of the folder "C:\SIERRA\gpl\players\Jones__Paul".
This will reset all the tracks though.
I have a program called AI Tweak 103 which can be used to alter/ fix the AI
strength if you find that the AI are constantly running away from you :) I
forget where it's from but can mail you a copy if you want it.

--
Ian Parker

ICQ 21772592

>Yeah - I have a similar problem at Rouen where I did a 4 second lap with a
>clock smash.
>How can I put this right?
>Also can I turn global hype scaling off or at least turn it down. It's very
>frustrating that the faster I go, the faster they go, so I can never win
>because although I can do a few reasonable laps (nowhere near your league,
TK)
>I will never be as consistent as the AI.
>Cheers,
>Paul

by **ddjhenri** » Wed, 10 Mar 1999 04:00:00

Well does it work in reverse as well? I just got this thing and the ONLY
time
I see the AI is when they come flying by...:) If the AI can speed up, maybe
it should be able to slowwwwwww down as well. :)
dave henrie

>It is the normal GPL thing, as you get faster, the AI gets faster, if you
>have done low 04's, it will modify the AI and make them faster, normally it
>makes them faster on teh straight more than turns. You can change a
setting
>in the gpl_ai which will increase the drag on the straights so they get
less
>top speed and are more realistic and have to do all their speed in the
>turns.

>Jesse

>>Yeah !!

>>Now I'm sure that Jim Clark and Graham Hill were really talented guy
>>backthere in '67.
>>As I fired up GPL and went for an AI race (I was practicing for some
>>event where we had
>>to use default setups) at Glen. I did low 1:05.97 in quals with default
>>setup and on full fuel
>>load. I was pretty satisfied. But then a shock as I returned back to the
>>garage !!
>>The pole position time was 1:02.26 done by Mr. Clark with Mr. Hill
>>following him at 1:02.27sec
>>There was also a BRM in 1:02.6x and Brabham in 1:02.4x.

>>Ok, I thought...let's try this out :)

>>Started from the back of the pack I had a brilliant start and got from
>>10th place to 6th out of T3.
>>Then everything went fine through T4 but accelerating out of it (I had a
>>good line) looked like
>>I would only be feeding some 50% throttle. BRM and some others just blew
>>me on the straight ! :(
>>I was on Lotus btw. :) I was blocking off the usual backmarkers as hell
>>until I made a mistake unser instant pressure for 3 laps and in T4 spun
>>out on lap4. I never seen the AI's from then onwards....

>>The end of the race saw winning Jim Clark with fast lap of 1:02.37 !!

>>I think there should be some reality in Global Hype Scaling System ....
>>I mean, who can do those times ? :o)
>>Maybe if I attached wings to Lotti, hehe....

>>Weird is all I can say....

>>Tadej Krevh
>>Lotus Internet Racing
>>http://members.xoom.com/LotusRacing/

by **Paul Jone** » Thu, 11 Mar 1999 04:00:00

Hi Ian,
Yes, please,
Cheers,
Paul

> Hi Paul, to reset the global hype rating, just delete the "player.sts" file
> out of the folder "C:\SIERRA\gpl\players\Jones__Paul".
> This will reset all the tracks though.
> I have a program called AI Tweak 103 which can be used to alter/ fix the AI
> strength if you find that the AI are constantly running away from you :) I
> forget where it's from but can mail you a copy if you want it.

> --
> Ian Parker

> ICQ 21772592

> >Yeah - I have a similar problem at Rouen where I did a 4 second lap with a
> >clock smash.
> >How can I put this right?
> >Also can I turn global hype scaling off or at least turn it down. It's very
> >frustrating that the faster I go, the faster they go, so I can never win
> >because although I can do a few reasonable laps (nowhere near your league,
> TK)
> >I will never be as consistent as the AI.
> >Cheers,
> >Paul

by **Tadej Krev** » Thu, 11 Mar 1999 04:00:00

Relax... I only did 1:04.06 till now :)

Tadje

> Damnit, you guys are really starting to make me feel r e a l l y s l o w
> at Watkins Glen! My best lap is a 1:07! =(

by **Paul Jone** » Thu, 11 Mar 1999 04:00:00

Only 1:04.06, Tadej, I thought you were quick but now I realise that you're just a
slowpoke like me :-)
Cheers,
Paul

> Relax... I only did 1:04.06 till now :)

> Tadje

> > Damnit, you guys are really starting to make me feel r e a l l y s l o w
> > at Watkins Glen! My best lap is a 1:07! =(

rec.autos.simulators

1:02.26 at Watkins Glen !!!

1:02.26 at Watkins Glen !!!

1:02.26 at Watkins Glen !!!

1:02.26 at Watkins Glen !!!

1:02.26 at Watkins Glen !!!

1:02.26 at Watkins Glen !!!

1:02.26 at Watkins Glen !!!

1:02.26 at Watkins Glen !!!

1:02.26 at Watkins Glen !!!

1:02.26 at Watkins Glen !!!

1:02.26 at Watkins Glen !!!

1:02.26 at Watkins Glen !!!

1:02.26 at Watkins Glen !!!

1:02.26 at Watkins Glen !!!

1:02.26 at Watkins Glen !!!

1:02.26 at Watkins Glen !!!