rec.autos.simulators

Then I download the mod, the patch, the track, the patch for the track,
and install them. Fire up RFactor and theres a giant stock car looking
at me. Browse the racing list, looking for a race. SCE... no thats not
it... JXVWRS no thats not it... oh theres the track i just downloaded...
let me join.

Weird, my car is blank, I wonder what's wrong. Well it still lets me
join so there must be no problem. Finally, I am connected to a server. I
just barely caught a glimpse of the error. INVALID CAR. DISCONNECTING. Oops.

I go back, trying to figure out what the problem is. Oh, I forgot to buy
a free car. I pick a car, look for a server, join. INVALID CAR.
DISCONNECTING. Oops, I picked a BGN car not a Winston Nextel Sprint Cup
car. Go back, get another car, join the race. Five people online.

For some reason you start in the trailer park in the middle of the
infield. Cute. Get on the track, its like driving on ice. My car must
have Parkinsons because the whole car vibrates like there's no tomorrow.
Default setup is junk. Oh but theres a spotter now... cute.

Gee, only 50 more minutes of practice left. Can I handle all the fun?

Sim racing is in a sad, sad state.

Cheers, uwe

--
GPG Fingerprint:  2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F  67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61

Most people are learning how to setup, let alone drive the new mods, so you
will see 50 minutes of practice lots of times, but some will do votes to
move on.

and BTW, the TPSCC (which apparently they didnt like how the other mods for
stock cars felt, so they wanted it to feel more like NR03?) does feel very
light (baby deer on ice thingy).  I cant drive it either just doesnt feel
right...  But I been racing the other mods a lot more now I have trouble
with NRO3 by papy at times.

FYI, there are 2 more major NASCAR iterations out there (that I am aware of)
PLUS the basic mod that was built into rFactor (technically is just a stub,
for the nascar modders).

IMHO the 2 best are: #1 for driving but, not necessarily the easiest find
download let alone install, is SCE .098 (which is still technically beta).
RFSTOCKCARS.net  This mod IMHO so far is the best feeling mod, but I again
say you have to get used to rFactor as a whole before you can appreciate it.
Your wheel will not be perfect the 1st time you load rFactor, I have been
tweaking mine a little all the time, once I got most of it usable.  I have
raced the hell out of this version, on the tracks I like (I HATE DEGA-TONA
headed tracks)...  I don't mind speedways you know tx, lowes etc, but I love
the other tracks where you have to Drive the S.O.B.s.  Phoenix,
martinsville, darlington, milwaukee richmond etc..  so as far as this MOD
goes, there was 2 versions you could find to download, one with an installer
that  installs to it's own dir, and has its own exe to start the game, or
the RAR that you just unpack to the regular rfactor dir...

Then the NROS mod, it has like 3 BIG downloads right now, if I recall
correctly, it was pretty easy installs, & installs to it's own dir, and has
its own exe to start the game (so dont foregt to allow it to run like you
did for other rfactor.exe in windows and any antivirus), which is HANDY for
G25 wheels and profiles for the "mods" and that way includes all the ***
you need, tracks cars, etc in that 1.2 gigs worth.  ***  However, I was in
Martinsville last night after reinstalling all of this last week, (new
update was out since my earlier install of this mod) & running with "given"
setup (you have to load the setups, default cars are "default NO setup" in
all of rFactor), and I was doing 99 MPH in the turns at martinsville.  I
have not turned any laps anywhere else in this mod.

2 other noteable mods, KIWIDIRTRACING has Dirt late models, freaking fun,
but the dirt tracks need some tweaks (also at that site) to race really
well,  and the ORR mod by MADCOWIE (found for download at
http://www.racesimcentral.net/ Again this is NOT complete yet, but damn it is
fun!!  ))

timmy thompson enlightened us with:

It's just too damned hard to keep up with.

-Larry

? The Pits hits 6,000,000! - , Sat 14-Apr-2007 00:10:37
? rF: TPSCC Fort Worth track released... - , Mon 09-Apr-2007 17:16:31
? N2003 remakes, Shiloh & Lodi - , Sun 08-Apr-2007 15:08:34
? Panoz for rFactor - Race2Play pre-release - , Tue 03-Apr-2007 01:28:02
? New N2003 tracks... - , Sun 01-Apr-2007 23:07:45
? rF: TPSCC ***ia released! - , Mon 26-Mar-2007 09:21:16
? N2003: New & updated tracks! - , Tue 20-Mar-2007 11:05:06
? N2003: Langhorne Speedway 1960 Dirt & 1970 Paved... - , Mon
12-Mar-2007 14:59:09
? ProSimRacing.com 150 at PSRL, March 10th... - , Wed 07-Mar-2007 09:37:28
? TPSCC tracks updated to v1.1... - , Tue 06-Mar-2007 10:41:38
? New N2003 track site... - , Sat 03-Mar-2007 22:11:48
? TPSCC v1.1 patch released! - , Sat 03-Mar-2007 22:11:11
? New Versions of SimED and TrkMaker - , Thu 01-Mar-2007 16:38:33
? rf: Diablo Hills track released... - , Mon 26-Feb-2007 15:31:22
? OWR2007 Mod Released! - , Sun 25-Feb-2007 13:47:16
? Graphics 101 Tutorial released... - , Wed 21-Feb-2007 12:19:35
? Carolina Sim Racer meet... - , Fri 16-Feb-2007 12:36:59
? rF: CTS v1.5 released... - , Tue 13-Feb-2007 19:51:33

So lets see... just on the front page there's rF: TPSCC, N2003, 1.1,
SimED, TrkMaker, OWR2007, and then later down the page, TPTCC (which I
still cant figure out what sim that is even for). Then TPSCC is split
into BGN, separate tracks both with 1.0 and 1.1 versions, set up your
controller, set up your car, and finally, race against 5 people.

And meanwhile, the only feedback RFactor ever gives you is: MISMATCH,
DISCONNECTED.

LOLOLOLOLOLOL

I agree with Timmy rFactor was a great idea and has some good mods.
All the BS you have to go through to install and patch everything and
then try to find a race you can join without mismatches, wrong car,
wrong track is too time consuming and frustrating. So then you think
***that I'll do some offline racing, wrong the AI sucks soooooo bad
it's not worth doing that either! That's why I pretty much gave up on
it.
If it's used for a league it is probably good because the net code is
supposed to be good and you eliminate many of the headaches discribed
above, but to do some pickup races or race the AI forget it.

Yeah I know it is frustrating, just as frustrating as the new mods for CALL
OF DUTY, were.  yeah it is better now.

No, I was being "smart assed" with quips like "go back to the console" at
the time I thought it was funny, inside joke ya know, and I truely am sorry,
maybe I should not post like that, albeit sometimes a guy has to have fun,
or he sits quietly in rage, reading and never helping.

Yeah, you do have a point, if you blindly "new dear in the headlight"
thoughts lead you to "huh, wha?" when you see a site like the Pits, with
mods for a lot of stuff.  I look at it differently because I been
downloading thier stuff for oh I believe 7 years, probably as long as they
been around, ok?  that "body of work" they leave up on the website is kind
of a trophy room of accomplishments, and I can guarantee you there used to
be a crapload more for some other sims too on that site.

SO FYI, the original TP_T_CC mod, was an add-on road course for NRXX, now
TP_S_CC it is add on 'Nextell Nascar' addon for rFactor, which is inherntly
a road racing game, (after patching rFactor to what is it, 1150?).  Trust
me, I feel your pain.  I have been where you are at each and every time I
want to get a mod for something, even rFactor.  Difference is 2 fold, I read
and read and read, where I can to figure stuff out.  and when I cant
comprehend the written, I get on Teamspeak and beg for help, very humbly

I dont mind you asking for help, I dont even mind you bellyache'n about the
strife you entail when doing so, and how crappy you think all of this is at
this point in time.  But, It pisses me off to see the "tone" you put off on
all this great, free, and mostly well worthy mods ands stuff,  so please
dont mind me slaggin off in little bits, to you.  You opened the door,
pissin and moaning, so I'll be fine, after all it is just fun.

To your point about hunting this stuff down,

Oh and beyotching about there bing updates is like being pissed that the
clouds cleared up and the sun came out, aint it?  especially when they
achieved an improvement?

Lastly, they went to a lot of work, you know creating the mod, testing
uploading, fixing, then you download for free, dont you suppose you could
honor thier hard work, by having just a little bit of work to do to enjoy
it, for free?  I dont just mean TPSCC I mean any mod.

timmy thompson enlightened us with:

For example, in most other games, if you don't have the correct map, the
game or server browser lets you know BEFORE you join the server. Yet in
GTR, RFactor, etc, its a guessing game. In GTR it just listed the wrong
track. In RFactor you just have to remember every version of every track
you have installed. Why dont they just let the software do a simple check?

The same could be done with mods. If I installed a mod three months ago,
do you think I will remember what abbreviation and what version I had?
There should be a standard numbering system, and RFactor should check
whether it is installed or not before you join the race, or visually
indicate it on the server browser.

I have been playing racing games since Indy 500 and Papyrus was the only
ones that didnt have their heads up their asses when it came to online
racing. When you didnt have the right track, didnt it show up in red so
you would know to download it? And the server browser only listed one
mod at a time, so you had to have it installed already to join a race.

Then there is the simple things the mod-makers could do. Why on earth do
you have to buy a car. Why cant you get assigned a default car until you
decide to change it... especially when the interface already shows a big
giant car to you? Then as if everything online wasnt fractured enough,
they included Cup cars and BGN cars.

And what the hell is this "start in the trailer park in the infield"
phenomenon. It adds nothing but frustration. Also the pit speed limit is
like a secret they keep from you, it flashes on the corner of the screen
for three seconds. Then I get on the track and I dont know what place
I'm in, how I'm doing, how much time is left, who else is racing, it
just feels so vague.

When I play RFactor online I just feel so disconnected from everyone and
everything. The interface is awful, and it doesnt give enough
information. I mean, for gods sake, Papyrus has tackled so many of these
issues already, but it's like ISI is ignorant of them. I'm sure theres
stuff I'm leaving out, but its stuff like this that drives me crazy. I
know mods are difficult to deal with but there are simple changes that
could be made that could make this whole process a lot easier. Online
*** is pretty mature (even with mods) in all other genres except this
one and I cant figure out why.

And dont forget, imagine someone new trying to get into this. I dont
even bother introducing anyone to racing games anymore, because its just
too tedious.

timmy thompson enlightened us with:

Fine line with "copy rights" and ***like that you understand, in a
country, where people can file suit and win for spilling coffee on
themselves.  The whole Damn thing with sims, advertizing is backwards from
day one, Freaking nextel, Chevy etc, should pay to have it's likeness used
in Papy tittles, and other quality tittles, instead of the other way around,
it is freaking advertising that I see everytime a race...  but I digress.

Again some of us have been asking to be able to do this since NR2, more
or less, it still is not implemented realistically as some {me} would like,
I would like to see... Id like that you go back there to get more major
repairs when damaged more than just little bits.  in a couple leagues
difference between 1st and 4th were a DNF caused by a lapper who blew a tire
etc...

Secondly, BTW, you start there during practice sessions just as they do in
real life, come race session you start in the pits, so what is the big
freaking deal here?  Some is realism, some are big on it, then some arent.

Anyone can say Alpo is the greatest dog food, even if they happen to be the
best by some judging constraints (no I am just using that name for a point),
some dogs just wont eat that shit, mine wouldnt.  Same goes with either Papy
or rFactor, gtr etc.

Papy raised the bar very early...  Erm, well you and I think so anywho,
but??   Or since they were it, did we just accept it, got used to it now
expect it?  Yeah, I think so at least some aspects...   Rfactor, well I
agree by "default" or "as Installed" pre tweaking, seems lacking, but really
the problem you describe is the learning curve.  I have customised MY
CONTROLS and CONTROLLER to a T, mimicking what I was used to, Papy games for
my league since after all we moved from years of NRXX it seems the right
thing to do.

Some of the newbies will find it easier, honestly & IMHO, less expectations,
nothing "inherntly learned"  from the older sims that DID shortcut some
aspects for sake of "gamability".  Case in point, hell my kid (now 13) loves
need for speed lol and stuff on Playstations and cannot "get" siming.  Oh
and relatedly, hey, I been one in the arguement, with many people with the
opinion that forcefeedback sux so bad, when in {my} reality, they just have
NOT been exposed to properly configed feedback systems therefore, they will
scream FF sux, but those of us who have had FF, cannot see how those without
FF can drive neither, lol...

Keep tweaking

--
David G Fisher