rec.autos.simulators

by **Vintoo** » Fri, 15 Feb 2002 11:15:59

HUH? Can I have some of that stuff you're smoking?

I own GPL and N4 and I find absolutely nothing similar about the driving
physics.

Vintook

> For kiddies? Why, because it tries to simulate a stock car, instead of
a
> 1967 F1 car with stock car graphics? That's all N4 was.

> -John

> > I got it at Circuit City in No. Calif today. Must say I'm not very
> > impressed, but still don't have a problem supporting Papy.

> > This one's for the kiddies, maybe they're working on something really
neat
> > for us simmers....but I'm not going to say the "C" word :-)

> > > Anyone bought this yet? And where? Thanks

by **John Pancoas** » Fri, 15 Feb 2002 11:39:37

No, but I'll have some of that that you're smoking if you think N4
simulated anything other than a 1500 lb stock car on six inch
tires.........it sure didn't simulate stock cars............well, maybe
hovercraft, twitchy, no feeling of mass or ground contact stock cars.

-John

> HUH? Can I have some of that stuff you're smoking?

> I own GPL and N4 and I find absolutely nothing similar about the driving
> physics.

> Vintook

> > For kiddies? Why, because it tries to simulate a stock car, instead
of
> a
> > 1967 F1 car with stock car graphics? That's all N4 was.

> > -John

> > > I got it at Circuit City in No. Calif today. Must say I'm not very
> > > impressed, but still don't have a problem supporting Papy.

> > > This one's for the kiddies, maybe they're working on something really
> neat
> > > for us simmers....but I'm not going to say the "C" word :-)

> > > > Anyone bought this yet? And where? Thanks

by **Dave Henri** » Fri, 15 Feb 2002 12:23:57

?? No opengl? Or just not the updated texture handling that D3d got.
Remember, Eric said the "hoped" to get the compressed textures for opengl in
a patch. But are you saying that N2002 doesn't even have the N4 opengl?
dave henrie

by **Don Burnett** » Fri, 15 Feb 2002 12:48:06

> > Well after running just one track, Daytona, it's definitely harder to
save
> > your car now at high speeds. Sound is great, you don't have to let off
> the
> > gas in the turns because of the AI slowing. Enjoying it so far. Don't
> know
> > why there isn't any OpenGL support?

> > J. Janasov
> ?? No opengl? Or just not the updated texture handling that D3d got.
> Remember, Eric said the "hoped" to get the compressed textures for opengl
in
> a patch. But are you saying that N2002 doesn't even have the N4 opengl?
> dave henrie

It has Open GL, from what I hear the readme states it is not supported
however.

Don Burnette

by **J. Janaso** » Fri, 15 Feb 2002 13:27:59

My bad it has "unsupported OpenGL"? I is a smart fella!

J. Janasov

> > Well after running just one track, Daytona, it's definitely harder to
save
> > your car now at high speeds. Sound is great, you don't have to let off
> the
> > gas in the turns because of the AI slowing. Enjoying it so far. Don't
> know
> > why there isn't any OpenGL support?

> > J. Janasov
> ?? No opengl? Or just not the updated texture handling that D3d got.
> Remember, Eric said the "hoped" to get the compressed textures for opengl
in
> a patch. But are you saying that N2002 doesn't even have the N4 opengl?
> dave henrie

by **Brian Oste** » Fri, 15 Feb 2002 23:25:36

>HUH? Can I have some of that stuff you're smoking?

>I own GPL and N4 and I find absolutely nothing similar about the driving
>physics.

Well, one thing I always noticed about N4 was sometimes when you
touched tires with another car your car would go shooting up the track
like, oh I don't know, an open wheel car might do.

The other thing that bugged me about N4 (and this just may be my
driving skills), but when another car would come down on you and make
contact with your RF it would cause *your* car to spin out. Or if you
got in the back of someone *your* car would spin out. When I watch
the real thing ususually it is the other way around.

Brian Oster

by **Vintoo** » Sat, 16 Feb 2002 02:13:45

And from what I've read in posts over at the Sierra forums. IT STILL HAPPENS
IN 2002. All the bumping physics seem to have remained, as well as a few of
the AI issues. They seem to have alleviated quite a few of the AI problems
but unfortunately there are enouph left to classify 2002 as a patch and not
a new game worthy of the $50 price tag.

Vintook

> >HUH? Can I have some of that stuff you're smoking?

> >I own GPL and N4 and I find absolutely nothing similar about the driving
> >physics.

> Well, one thing I always noticed about N4 was sometimes when you
> touched tires with another car your car would go shooting up the track
> like, oh I don't know, an open wheel car might do.

> The other thing that bugged me about N4 (and this just may be my
> driving skills), but when another car would come down on you and make
> contact with your RF it would cause *your* car to spin out. Or if you
> got in the back of someone *your* car would spin out. When I watch
> the real thing ususually it is the other way around.

> Brian Oster

by **John Pancoas** » Sat, 16 Feb 2002 04:46:41

Agreed; $50 should be for a new sim, not a rehash.

-John

> And from what I've read in posts over at the Sierra forums. IT STILL
HAPPENS
> IN 2002. All the bumping physics seem to have remained, as well as a few
of
> the AI issues. They seem to have alleviated quite a few of the AI problems
> but unfortunately there are enouph left to classify 2002 as a patch and
not
> a new game worthy of the $50 price tag.

> Vintook

> > >HUH? Can I have some of that stuff you're smoking?

> > >I own GPL and N4 and I find absolutely nothing similar about the
driving
> > >physics.

> > Well, one thing I always noticed about N4 was sometimes when you
> > touched tires with another car your car would go shooting up the track
> > like, oh I don't know, an open wheel car might do.

> > The other thing that bugged me about N4 (and this just may be my
> > driving skills), but when another car would come down on you and make
> > contact with your RF it would cause *your* car to spin out. Or if you
> > got in the back of someone *your* car would spin out. When I watch
> > the real thing ususually it is the other way around.

> > Brian Oster

by **Jon Nelso** » Sat, 16 Feb 2002 05:27:42

What constitutes a 'new' sim in your opinion?

> Agreed; $50 should be for a new sim, not a rehash.

> -John

> > And from what I've read in posts over at the Sierra forums. IT STILL
> HAPPENS
> > IN 2002. All the bumping physics seem to have remained, as well as a few
> of
> > the AI issues. They seem to have alleviated quite a few of the AI
problems
> > but unfortunately there are enouph left to classify 2002 as a patch and
> not
> > a new game worthy of the $50 price tag.

> > Vintook

> > > >HUH? Can I have some of that stuff you're smoking?

> > > >I own GPL and N4 and I find absolutely nothing similar about the
> driving
> > > >physics.

> > > Well, one thing I always noticed about N4 was sometimes when you
> > > touched tires with another car your car would go shooting up the track
> > > like, oh I don't know, an open wheel car might do.

> > > The other thing that bugged me about N4 (and this just may be my
> > > driving skills), but when another car would come down on you and make
> > > contact with your RF it would cause *your* car to spin out. Or if you
> > > got in the back of someone *your* car would spin out. When I watch
> > > the real thing ususually it is the other way around.

> > > Brian Oster

by **Vintoo** » Sat, 16 Feb 2002 06:19:15

N3 to N4 = New sim

N3 to N99 = N4 to N 2002 ; which = patch/$15 at the most......

Anything more = ripping off your base. At the least there should have been a
50% rebate coupon for those that have N4.

Vintook

> What constitutes a 'new' sim in your opinion?

> > Agreed; $50 should be for a new sim, not a rehash.

> > -John

> > > And from what I've read in posts over at the Sierra forums. IT STILL
> > HAPPENS
> > > IN 2002. All the bumping physics seem to have remained, as well as a
few
> > of
> > > the AI issues. They seem to have alleviated quite a few of the AI
> problems
> > > but unfortunately there are enouph left to classify 2002 as a patch
and
> > not
> > > a new game worthy of the $50 price tag.

> > > Vintook

> > > > >HUH? Can I have some of that stuff you're smoking?

> > > > >I own GPL and N4 and I find absolutely nothing similar about the
> > driving
> > > > >physics.

> > > > Well, one thing I always noticed about N4 was sometimes when you
> > > > touched tires with another car your car would go shooting up the
track
> > > > like, oh I don't know, an open wheel car might do.

> > > > The other thing that bugged me about N4 (and this just may be my
> > > > driving skills), but when another car would come down on you and
make
> > > > contact with your RF it would cause *your* car to spin out. Or if
you
> > > > got in the back of someone *your* car would spin out. When I watch
> > > > the real thing ususually it is the other way around.

> > > > Brian Oster

by **jason moy** » Sat, 16 Feb 2002 06:33:13

> And from what I've read in posts over at the Sierra forums. IT STILL HAPPENS
> IN 2002. All the bumping physics seem to have remained, as well as a few of
> the AI issues.

Can't speak for multiplayer, since latency will always make bumping a
chancy proposition (at least until the world is running on 100Mbps
fiber) but I can bump and rub the AI quite nicely. Had lots of 3 wide
action in my test Daytona 10% length/94% difficulty race and I traded
paint the whole time. Only wreck was when Jimmy Johnson came down on
bobby Labonte and then went for a wild barrell roll down the
backstretch.

In the demo, I felt the physics were almost exactly the same as N4's.
Playing the full version, I'm not so sure. The torque curve seems to
be more accurate, and even when I get a perfect line on most tracks
I'm nowhere near as fast as I am in N4 (with fast setups, anyway).
The driving tutorials are great, and often amusing (altho what Darrell
is saying doesn't always match up with what the driver is doing).
Haven't messed with the replay theater, but it looks really slick.
Heck, I rolled my eyes when I heard about the 3 mile fantasy track but
I have to admit it's more interesting than half the real tracks...that
banking is EVIL when the tires start to wear. I was able to get
enough of a run down the backstraight last night in a multiplayer race
that I managed to slingshot waaaay past the leaders and hit the
banking hard enough that POW engine gone, race over. Speaking of POW,
the damage model is niiiiice, and seems to be fairly balanced between
the AI and human cars.

Overall, I think N2002 is well worth the money so far. Throw in the
512x512 textures and fantastic sound engine (the tire scrubbing puts
F1 2001 to shame) and I'm pretty happy with my $50 purchase. Next
year it may take some serious changes to get me to buy the game, but
at least I've got a full year of play ahead of me.

Jason

by **Gerald Moo** » Sat, 16 Feb 2002 06:58:47

Yes, sadly, the collision physics are still pretty weak, at least
online. I had made my way through trouble in a race last night when a
car "warped into being" right in front of me. I got down to about
20mph before t-boning it. We locked together for a brief moment,
almost stopped on the track, then the other car bounced 100 yards down
the track at about 90 mph before coming to a rest on its roof.

Sigh. Maybe next time.

Maybe this is just a symptom of position prediction code. I havent
messed around with single player much to find out.

Even so, it is still a pretty dang cool game, and well worth the $50.

Gerald

> All the bumping physics seem to have remained,

> > Well, one thing I always noticed about N4 was sometimes when you
> > touched tires with another car your car would go shooting up the track
> > like, oh I don't know, an open wheel car might do.

> > The other thing that bugged me about N4 (and this just may be my
> > driving skills), but when another car would come down on you and make
> > contact with your RF it would cause *your* car to spin out. Or if you
> > got in the back of someone *your* car would spin out. When I watch
> > the real thing ususually it is the other way around.

by **SimRace** » Sat, 16 Feb 2002 07:12:43

I agree with you John, the cars seem to be more correct in the weight and
tire size department now. Still easy to spin, but not like GPL4 err I mean
N4 was.

The damage model has been beefed up too, I saw more car parts on the track
last night than any other night online with the NR series. Even saw a few
rearends pushed all the way up to the C pillar, nice touch. Its also nice
that a tap from someone beside and in front of you doesn't wreck 'you' as
easily now. That seems like it should have been an open wheel
characterisitic anyway, glad it is gone/toned down.

by **John Pancoas** » Sat, 16 Feb 2002 09:06:27

Anything other than a rehash. I already have NR1999, guess I'll get
another. N1 to N2 was a new sim. N2 to N4 was a new sim. N4 to N2002
isn't. Three new Nascar sims in N1, N2, N4. Three rehashes in N1999, N3,
and N2002.

No big deal, I accept it as part of business. Just don't say it's a new
sim :)

-John

> What constitutes a 'new' sim in your opinion?

> > Agreed; $50 should be for a new sim, not a rehash.

> > -John

> > > And from what I've read in posts over at the Sierra forums. IT STILL
> > HAPPENS
> > > IN 2002. All the bumping physics seem to have remained, as well as a
few
> > of
> > > the AI issues. They seem to have alleviated quite a few of the AI
> problems
> > > but unfortunately there are enouph left to classify 2002 as a patch
and
> > not
> > > a new game worthy of the $50 price tag.

> > > Vintook

> > > > >HUH? Can I have some of that stuff you're smoking?

> > > > >I own GPL and N4 and I find absolutely nothing similar about the
> > driving
> > > > >physics.

> > > > Well, one thing I always noticed about N4 was sometimes when you
> > > > touched tires with another car your car would go shooting up the
track
> > > > like, oh I don't know, an open wheel car might do.

> > > > The other thing that bugged me about N4 (and this just may be my
> > > > driving skills), but when another car would come down on you and
make
> > > > contact with your RF it would cause *your* car to spin out. Or if
you
> > > > got in the back of someone *your* car would spin out. When I watch
> > > > the real thing ususually it is the other way around.

> > > > Brian Oster

by **John Pancoas** » Sat, 16 Feb 2002 09:11:06

Yep, agreed. However, I haven't noticed if the damage affects car
handling/performance much, have you? That needed much improvement. Haven't
spent as much time with it yet as I wish :(

-John

> > For kiddies? Why, because it tries to simulate a stock car, instead
of
> a
> > 1967 F1 car with stock car graphics? That's all N4 was.

> > -John

> I agree with you John, the cars seem to be more correct in the weight and
> tire size department now. Still easy to spin, but not like GPL4 err I mean
> N4 was.

> The damage model has been beefed up too, I saw more car parts on the track
> last night than any other night online with the NR series. Even saw a few
> rearends pushed all the way up to the C pillar, nice touch. Its also nice
> that a tap from someone beside and in front of you doesn't wreck 'you' as
> easily now. That seems like it should have been an open wheel
> characterisitic anyway, glad it is gone/toned down.

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