rec.autos.simulators

by **flow** » Fri, 23 Jun 2000 04:00:00

Last night I stumbled across a tape of "The Ringmasters - 1967"
that I had made over a year ago off of a Speedvision broadcast.
In watching the real cars travel around the 'Ring, one thing
notably struck me.

Very few cars were shown taking to the air over Flugplatz.

For example, Dan Gurney, who won the race and established a new
track record, is never seen going over Flugplatz with more than
an inch or two under his tires. This got me to wondering whether
the common practice in GPL of launching over Flugplatz at 150+
mph is truly reflective of the historical technique.

There are two good reasons I can think of for not flying over
Flugplatz (despite its name). First, the landing is brutal on the
equipment. The 1967 race saw no fewer than 7 retirements (not
counting the F2 cars), so preserving the cars at this track is
clearly of great importance. Second, the landing must be equally
brutal on the drivers. 1967***pits were not built with driver
comfort in mind. I would think that the buffeting a driver would
experience from the landing, particularly with no restraints
securing him in place, would take quite a physical toll after
several laps. In addition, I can imagine it being very difficult
keeping one's feet correctly on the pedals while being jarred on
the landing.

Any other thoughts on this?

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by **Coli** » Fri, 23 Jun 2000 04:00:00

If you're in the air, you're out of control. It's that simple.
In a rolling petrol bomb at 150 mph you don't want that. No sirree Bob =)
...Colin

by **Arto Wik** » Fri, 23 Jun 2000 04:00:00

I have some of the "Duke video"'s "Profile of a legend" videos (Brabham,
G. Hill and Clark). There certainly are sevaral clips from the place,
and certainly airborne!

Arto

by **Kevin Gavit** » Fri, 23 Jun 2000 04:00:00

If you are in the air, you are braking. If you are braking, you are slowing
down. The more time you spend in the air, the slower you go.

The trick to the Flugplatz is to go fast enough, but not too fast. The real
drivers certainly got air there, but the FAST one's never got too high, or
too out of control when they landed again.

If you're trying to control the twitch when you land, you arn't on the gas
either.

by **Andre Warring** » Fri, 23 Jun 2000 04:00:00

On Thu, 22 Jun 2000 22:35:29 GMT, "Kevin Gavitt"

>If you are in the air, you are braking. If you are braking, you are slowing
>down. The more time you spend in the air, the slower you go.

Interesting at Flugplatz. You're faster on the ground than in the air,
logical. But to stay on the ground, you have to drive much slower at
the beginning of Flugplatz, before the jump point. Thus you will lose
time. the advantage again is that you can exit the corner faster when
you stay on the ground, and there's a long full speed road after
flugplatz. So in the end, which way would theoretically be faster?

I downloaded a replay from Schubi's site, I believe it was the one
from Andreas Wilke, a great sub-8 lap. He enters Flugplatz fast in 4th
gear, just before the jump he drops to third while staying on the gas.
Tried it, seems the best way to take Flugplatz, allthough it still
stays one of the hardest corners in GPL to get right. Eau Rouge seems
easy compared to Flugplatz!

Andre

by **Bryon Lap** » Fri, 23 Jun 2000 04:00:00

Same thing in downhill ski racing. The fastest racers find a way to slow down
just enough to minimize "air time" over the big digs in the course.

> If you are in the air, you are braking. If you are braking, you are slowing
> down. The more time you spend in the air, the slower you go.

> The trick to the Flugplatz is to go fast enough, but not too fast. The real
> drivers certainly got air there, but the FAST one's never got too high, or
> too out of control when they landed again.

> If you're trying to control the twitch when you land, you arn't on the gas
> either.

by **Bruce Kennewel** » Sat, 24 Jun 2000 04:00:00

For Gurney NOT to be taking off over that rise is what is unusual. The
majority of F1 drivers, not only in 1967, did attain some degree of altitude
greater than an inch or two.

The landings were not "brutal".......suspensions had travel back then.

--
Regards,
Bruce Kennewell,
Canberra, Australia.
---------------------------

by **Jeff Salzman** » Sat, 24 Jun 2000 04:00:00

JYS mentioned something about upshifting while airborne to save wear
on the gearbox...

by **Eldre** » Sat, 24 Jun 2000 04:00:00

>If you are in the air, you are braking. If you are braking, you are slowing
>down. The more time you spend in the air, the slower you go.

>The trick to the Flugplatz is to go fast enough, but not too fast. The real
>drivers certainly got air there, but the FAST one's never got too high, or
>too out of control when they landed again.

>If you're trying to control the twitch when you land, you arn't on the gas
>either.

You're SUPPOSED to be on the gas???

Eldred
--
Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
GPL hcp. +85.99

Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

by **Eldre** » Sat, 24 Jun 2000 04:00:00

>For example, Dan Gurney, who won the race and established a new
>track record, is never seen going over Flugplatz with more than
>an inch or two under his tires. This got me to wondering whether
>the common practice in GPL of launching over Flugplatz at 150+
>mph is truly reflective of the historical technique.

150?!? Geez, I thought my going about 100 was too fast...

Eldred
--
Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
GPL hcp. +85.99

Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

by **Ben Valdevaron** » Sat, 24 Jun 2000 04:00:00

> Last night I stumbled across a tape of "The Ringmasters - 1967"
> that I had made over a year ago off of a Speedvision broadcast.
> In watching the real cars travel around the 'Ring, one thing
> notably struck me.

> Very few cars were shown taking to the air over Flugplatz.

> For example, Dan Gurney, who won the race <snip>

IIRC, Gurney's only win in 67 was Spa and Denny Hulme won at the'ring.

by **Stephen Ferguso** » Sat, 24 Jun 2000 04:00:00

Too bad there is no "prejump" feature for Formula One racing. (downhillers
jump before the bump...)

Stephen

> > If you are in the air, you are braking. If you are braking, you are
slowing
> > down. The more time you spend in the air, the slower you go.

> > The trick to the Flugplatz is to go fast enough, but not too fast. The
real
> > drivers certainly got air there, but the FAST one's never got too high,
or
> > too out of control when they landed again.

> > If you're trying to control the twitch when you land, you arn't on the
gas
> > either.

by **Bruce Kennewel** » Sat, 24 Jun 2000 04:00:00

Correct.
--
Regards,
Bruce Kennewell,
Canberra, Australia.
---------------------------

> > Last night I stumbled across a tape of "The Ringmasters - 1967"
> > that I had made over a year ago off of a Speedvision broadcast.
> > In watching the real cars travel around the 'Ring, one thing
> > notably struck me.

> > Very few cars were shown taking to the air over Flugplatz.

> > For example, Dan Gurney, who won the race <snip>

> IIRC, Gurney's only win in 67 was Spa and Denny Hulme won at the'ring.

by **MichaelJ** » Sat, 24 Jun 2000 04:00:00

Go on then - start it:-)

- Michael (Nothing wrong with another Ring thread!)

rec.autos.simulators

Airborne at Flugplatz?

Airborne at Flugplatz?

Airborne at Flugplatz?

Airborne at Flugplatz?

Airborne at Flugplatz?

Airborne at Flugplatz?

Airborne at Flugplatz?

Airborne at Flugplatz?

Airborne at Flugplatz?

Airborne at Flugplatz?

Airborne at Flugplatz?

Airborne at Flugplatz?

Airborne at Flugplatz?

Airborne at Flugplatz?

Airborne at Flugplatz?