rec.autos.simulators

Jim: OFF Road....

Neil Yeatma

Jim: OFF Road....

by Neil Yeatma » Wed, 26 Mar 1997 04:00:00



> It continues to boggle my mind--people buy a game from a company and
> think from that moment on that the company "owes" them something for
> years to come.

I think *most* computer game customers feel only that the product
they bought should be "completed", not "rushed out the door in a nearly
complete state that'll help us balance the books come fiscal year-end".  

If the game ships in an unfinished form, then, yes...the company
owes them something.  A patch.  Or a series of patches until it's
a finished product.

My only suggestion is that when SODA comes out, make sure it's done
right.  Don't just get it out the door for Christmas.  That's all
the majority of us want.  

SODA sure sounds like it might be fun, and a track editor to boot!

Neil
--

Neil Yeatman          
Ajax, Ontario, CANADA

My REAL email address is:

Steven Trave

Jim: OFF Road....

by Steven Trave » Fri, 28 Mar 1997 04:00:00




>>Well, I'm done blabbing. If anyone has any constructive criticisms or
>>suggestions, I'm more than anxious to read them and respond to them.
>>If you have a "you-better-do-it-this-way-or-else" demand, please
>>re-phrase it or keep it to yourself.

>My heart bleeds ;o)  Games aren't the least bit like movies anyway, games
>are much more like the latest CD from your favourite (major label) band. A
>much more emotive issue. You may be artists but you are constrained by
>commercialism and the need to satisfy your audience.

>How about these for starters:-

>Punters do not have to buy a new CD player to play the latest upcoming
>title from their favourite band as it was meant to be heard. This is after
>buying a different one a few months ago to hear the last album in all it's
>glory.

>Bands do not release an album knowing side two is incomplete and promising
>they'll fix that sometime "soon".

>Who ever heard of a album that had an appallingly complicated, manual menu
>system if more than one person wanted to listen to it at the same time?

>If you want to hold yourself up as an artist comparable with a successful
>film director or similar then you really ought to make sure your production
>values are up to the high standards we enjoy from these other media. From
>where I stand they fall woefully short of Hollywood, and are light years
>away from the music business.

>--
>Derek James

Nice post, but totally irrelevant. First of all, neither I nor the
person I was responding to said one single thing about patches or
incomplete software. The original poster simply said "No no no. 8
players not 6. Do it this way." In my post which you responded to, I
talked about people demanding every-feature-under-the-sun-or-else, and
demanding that sequels should cost little or nothing if you bought the
original game, etc. So, you're way off-topic.

Why you bring up the idea of music albums being incomplete, I don't
know.  Where in this discussion thread were we talking about
incomplete games? Of course one should be upset if they get a game
home and a listed, advertised feature isn't present. But, what does
that have to do with anything that I said???

Same answer. Why are you typing this in response to my post? Different
topic entirely. (I didn't know audio CDs had user interfaces, either.
:-)

I was making an *indirect* comparison about creative output. Not about
defective or difficult-to-use products. It's not really possible for
CDs and movies to contain bugs or a complicated user interface. By the
very nature of the media, manufacturers don't have to be concerned
about producing for hundreds of different incompatible pieces of
equipment--it's all standard. Not so, of course with computers. Ask
100 engineers if they've ever seen a totally bug-free game, and 100 of
them will say no. So, extending the analogy in that direction is
pointless, with regard to my post. We were talking about other stuff!

Steven Travers
Producer, SODA Off-Road Racing
Papyrus Design Group

Steven Trave

Jim: OFF Road....

by Steven Trave » Fri, 28 Mar 1997 04:00:00

On Tue, 25 Mar 1997 19:57:45 -0500, Neil Yeatman




>> It continues to boggle my mind--people buy a game from a company and
>> think from that moment on that the company "owes" them something for
>> years to come.

>I think *most* computer game customers feel only that the product
>they bought should be "completed", not "rushed out the door in a nearly
>complete state that'll help us balance the books come fiscal year-end".  

>If the game ships in an unfinished form, then, yes...the company
>owes them something.  A patch.  Or a series of patches until it's
>a finished product.

Hi Neil, I agree with what you said here. But, I was talking about
other demands. See my other post, sent a few minutes before this one.

Steven Travers
Producer, SODA Off-Road Racing
Papyrus Design Group

Steven Trave

Jim: OFF Road....

by Steven Trave » Sun, 30 Mar 1997 04:00:00




...

>I could go for the cheap shot and wonder why you chose to ignore that
>opportunity but I prefer to make a constructive suggestion that may help.
>Why not open out the beta and play testing program with this release? Get
>more average punters playing the game, as well as the usual crew of die
>***-line racers, and address those interface, hardware requirements,
>feature and production issues that matter to the casual player before the
>game hits the streets.

>--
>Derek James

Hm,

What is it that makes you think we aren't doing all that already? :-)

Steve

Steven Trave

Jim: OFF Road....

by Steven Trave » Tue, 01 Apr 1997 04:00:00



>I could go for the cheap shot and wonder why you chose to ignore that
>opportunity but I prefer to make a constructive suggestion that may help.
>Why not open out the beta and play testing program with this release? Get
>more average punters playing the game, as well as the usual crew of die
>***-line racers, and address those interface, hardware requirements,
>feature and production issues that matter to the casual player before the
>game hits the streets.

>>What is it that makes you think we aren't doing all that already? :-)

>The smile at the end of your sentence, and the awkward interface in N2. It
>really isn't simple to add your own name and set up multiplayer games
>properly.

>--
>Derek James

Derek, we already do all of these things and more. Have been for some
time. This is a totally different game than NASCAR 2, being developed
by an outside development house, Software Allies Inc. I'm not sure
what my smile could have had to do with your reasoning. The smile was
there because I'm amused at the huge assumptions you're making about a
product that isn't going to be released until the fall.

Steven Travers
Producer, SODA Off-Road Racing
Papyrus Design Group


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