rec.autos.simulators

by **Schlom** » Wed, 16 Feb 2000 04:00:00

Theres no website I know of that does this but I can give you MY opinion of
what they are. I'll go in order from easiest to hardest (mind you there is no
easy track).

1. Monza- Only has four real turns and all are relatively high speed
2. Kyalami- turns are tricky but as soon as you figure them out you will start
going VERY fast here
3. Watkins Glen- American track so being a yank I spend alot of time here.
4. Silverstone- The turns are all fairly similar in the line through
them...turn in early..apex late.
4. O'ring- Drive the car like you hate it...this track begs for you to hang the
rear end out
5. Spa- Easier than it seems at first. Problem i found is it doesnt take well
to Newbie tendancies for under driving the car. Try running the BRM here and
just flog it through the corners...then drive every other car the same way.
6. Rouen- Hard but once again...when you get the rythem youll start going fast.
7. Mexico- Ok...so the rythem section is hard...but you can take it easy
through there and still get a respectable lap time.
8. Mosport- Its tough...ill say that. Watch ALOT of replays here to get the
idea of how to drive here.
9. Brand Hatch- I dont know...I just cant get a handle on the car here.
10. Zandvoort- I'm sorry...but I hate this track. Some people find it easy...I
dont. Never ran under a 1:35 here in any car. It has a certian rythem that I
just cant get.
11. Nurburgring- Long, hard, and near impossible to remember. I ran this track
exclusively for a whole month before I started running in the 8 minute range.
12. Monaco- Easier than the Ring to remember...but I find it harder to drive.
Its a totally different style of driving than any other track.

Well thats my list. Just run the tracks alot and they will all eventually come
to you. Good Luck.

Chris
"Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold
that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass."--Mark Twain

by **Arne Marti** » Thu, 17 Feb 2000 04:00:00

> Hi, another newbie question. Is there a website anywhere that rates the
> tracks for difficulty? I am curious what people's opinions are.

OK, here's my try then:
(5 being most difficult, 1 being easiest)
Kyalami: 2 - A few tricky corners but otherwise fairly easy
Monaco: 5 - the chicane and braking for the final corner being the most
difficult, the rest of the track isn't all that hard
Zandvoort: 3 - the fast corners at the backside requires some
co-ordination, but not that hard
Spa: 2 - mostly fairly easy, but a few tricky corners
Rouen: 3 - braking for the hairpin is hard, but rest of the track is
fairly straight forward
Silverstone: 3 - Those left kinks are hard to get right!
Nrburgring: 5 - do i need to explain? :-)
Mosport: 4 - the mini ring
Monza: 1 - the easy track :-)
Watkins Glen: 3 - some difficult downhill braking going on there
Mexico: 3 - That first tightening turn being the only really difficult
turn here, except for having to avoid the tires
Brands Hatch: 4 - no camber to help you...
?sterreichring: 3 - elevations play up a little, but the corners aren't
all that hard.

--
Arne Martin

by **David** » Thu, 17 Feb 2000 04:00:00

And here's my opinion (only for the original tracks - I haven't played
the O-ring or Brands enough yet). 1 is easy, 5 is hard:

Kyalami - 3. I just cannot get to grips with this place to the
extent that I can get a rhythm going.
Monaco - 4. It's really not (quite) as hard as it looks, except for
that ***y chicane.
Zandvoort - 3. Not too difficult, but so featureless that it's
extremely hard to remember. Probably my least favourite track.
Spa - 2. Ah, bliss. I can really get into a groove here. It might
even rate a 1 if it wasn't for Malmedy.
Rouen - 3. The downhill is a lot harder than the uphill, because of
tricky braking areas.
Silverstone - 1. I find this the easiest of the lot - maybe being
British helps. Only Abbey causes any real trouble.
Nrburgring - 5. Obvious, really. Sub-8? Sub-9 would do me.
Mosport - 4. You think you've got it sussed, and then...
Monza - 1 (2 if Surtees is behind you!). Flat and boring. Only Curva
Grande and the Lesmos keep the interest.
Watkins Glen - 2. Fairly straightforward, but gets very crowded in a
race, and you need to concentrate hard.
Mexico - 4. Horrible, horrible first corner, and the back section is
very hard to remember.
--
David.
"After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, really."
(Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh)

by **The Mighty Puc** » Thu, 17 Feb 2000 04:00:00

Thanks all. I'm heading back to the O'ring to paint some rails.

Chris

>Theres no website I know of that does this but I can give you MY opinion of
>what they are. I'll go in order from easiest to hardest (mind you there is
no
>easy track).

>1. Monza- Only has four real turns and all are relatively high speed
>2. Kyalami- turns are tricky but as soon as you figure them out you will
start
>going VERY fast here
>3. Watkins Glen- American track so being a yank I spend alot of time here.
>4. Silverstone- The turns are all fairly similar in the line through
>them...turn in early..apex late.
>4. O'ring- Drive the car like you hate it...this track begs for you to hang
the
>rear end out
>5. Spa- Easier than it seems at first. Problem i found is it doesnt take
well
>to Newbie tendancies for under driving the car. Try running the BRM here
and
>just flog it through the corners...then drive every other car the same way.
>6. Rouen- Hard but once again...when you get the rythem youll start going
fast.
>7. Mexico- Ok...so the rythem section is hard...but you can take it easy
>through there and still get a respectable lap time.
>8. Mosport- Its tough...ill say that. Watch ALOT of replays here to get
the
>idea of how to drive here.
>9. Brand Hatch- I dont know...I just cant get a handle on the car here.
>10. Zandvoort- I'm sorry...but I hate this track. Some people find it
easy...I
>dont. Never ran under a 1:35 here in any car. It has a certian rythem
that I
>just cant get.
>11. Nurburgring- Long, hard, and near impossible to remember. I ran this
track
>exclusively for a whole month before I started running in the 8 minute
range.
>12. Monaco- Easier than the Ring to remember...but I find it harder to
drive.
>Its a totally different style of driving than any other track.

>Well thats my list. Just run the tracks alot and they will all eventually
come
>to you. Good Luck.

>Chris
>"Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold
>that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass."--Mark Twain

by **Michael Youn** » Thu, 17 Feb 2000 04:00:00

and

I don't know if it makes much sense to do this. They're all freaking
difficult if your setup isn't working for you. Maybe that would be a more
relevant ranking: which tracks are more challenging to setup well. For me,
tracks with interesting vertical elements and off-camber curves give me the
most difficulty. Of course, this is coming off a serious bout of self-doubt
at O'ring. :-)

On another note, I found almost 3 whole seconds in the gearbox at Spa. (When
was the last time you made a change that netted 3 seconds? :-) I would kill
them in the curves, but lose it right back on the following straight.
Dropping the rear-end one click was all it took to even things out. I think
I put in taller gears when the engine started blowing up. Things are happy
again; top end on the big straights are consistently over 190, which takes
quite a bit of the heat off. Now to see what that did to reliability...

Michael.

by **Leo Landma** » Thu, 17 Feb 2000 04:00:00

There are no easy tracks in GPL. If you think one is easy, you're not
going fast enough. It's far more important to use a car you feel
comfortable with. Ferrari and Cooper are the easiest to drive, Alison
has good setups for both. And don't worry about trail braking yet. You
still have seconds to gain before that comes into play.

--
Bye,
Leo

by **Michael Youn** » Fri, 18 Feb 2000 04:00:00

> >Is there a website anywhere that rates the
> > tracks for difficulty?

> There are no easy tracks in GPL. If you think one is easy, you're not
> going fast enough.

I'm not so sure about that. :-) When is "fast enough" fast enough? The fun
ones -- Spa, Zandvoort, and Monza, for me in that order -- are also where I
happen to be fastest (read: closest behind the leaders). Maybe I'm mistaking
fun for ease, or maybe I'm just "better" there because I spend more time
driving the "fun" ones. Or maybe they're fun cuz I'm almost in the running;
I guess Monza's presence on the list makes this a definite (there's your
answer: Monza is boringly simple and easy, but a necessary step in your
education). Anyway, I'm finding hot-lap times are not good measures of GP
race pace. I consistently qualify mid-pack, cut my way up to 8th or so
within the first few laps, and finish 5th or 6th. I point this out because
even my PB is always more than a full second behind the leaders' qual times,
but I pass them easily in the race.

I find the Eagle to be the most responsive *and* forgiving. To each their
own. Alison's Eagle setups were good starting points for me, also.

Maybe. I think transitioning from brake to gas is first or second among the
important skills to master. If I had to pick a time to begin paying
attention to this, it would be from the very beginning. Also, threshold
braking isn't all that it's made out to be in terms of lap times, but it's
also among the fundamental skills. Learn the basics first, I say, and
integrate them on the race track. Lap times won't come down without good car
control basics. Once you learn them, each track's unique challenges become
opportunities, and not something to be fretted over. Easy tracks would be no
fun at all!

All the same, there are few games compelling enough to make two hours of
knuckle busting, wrist straining labor seem like fun. There's always a
chance today might be the day I make a podium finish, but right now, the
voyage is the thing. Easy? What's that got to do with it?

Michael.

by **David Er** » Fri, 18 Feb 2000 04:00:00

(
snip )

Nicely put indeed. It is the challenge of GPL that has given it such
longevity on my hard drive while several easier games have come and gone in
the meantime.

David

by **GTX_SlotCa** » Sun, 20 Feb 2000 04:00:00

I'm glad to see someone finally put this into perspective. I'm afraid that
some people confuse trail braking with applying brake and gas in a corner to
squat the car for better traction. There certainly is a place for trail
braking but it should not be over used. If you find yourself trail braking
all the time, you're not finding the line. For beginner drivers, and as a
reminder to the experienced, I find my once again going to one of my
favorite (Tom Pabst ?) quotes: "The fastest way to go slow is to brake too
late."
From my own experience with MTM2, for which there are hundreds of tracks
and new ones being made every day, I can caution newer drivers with this:
on a track that you haven't driven before, the extensive use of trail
braking will decrease your initial lap times (make you faster). But if you
continue to depend on trail braking instead of learning the lines, everyone
will soon go past you.

Slot

> > How do you know when you at the point where you *need* trailbraking?

> When you've run out of all other options to go faster (like driving
> smoother, adapting the setup to your style etc.) and you still can't
tackle
> the corners the way you see the hotshoes do. But looking at Wolfgang
> Woeger's laptimes, I'd say you never really *need* trail braking <g>

> Bye,
> Leo

by **Eldre** » Mon, 21 Feb 2000 04:00:00

>BTW. If you do not use a cut squash ball under the brake pedal, I strongly
>advice you to do so immediatly. That half ball does wonders to lap times and
>consistency.

>Learning trailbraking made me cut 2 sec off my previous Monza times.

I have a TSW2mod. There's a spring behind the pedals, so I don't think that
would work. I could use another 2 sec. though...<g>

Eldred
--
Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999
Own Grand Prix Legends? Goto http://gpl.gamestats.com/vroc

Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

by **Eldre** » Mon, 21 Feb 2000 04:00:00

>> Debatable, I think.

>Ofcourse, that's what this forum is for <g>

>> I'd much rather do consistent, comfortable 3:23s laps (at Spa) than
>> bust a gut for a 3:20 and have to retire on lap 4.

>That's my point: you're not going fast enough <g> But seriously, any track
>will be easy if you're happy with comfortable lapping. And every track will
>be difficult when you're trying to drive at the limit.
>When Senna had a setup that he felt comfortable with, he asked his engineer
>to make it more 'agressive'. Because he knew he was losing time. The same
>applies to GPL (which also shows how great this sim is).

So I'm at least 10 seconds back. I can do a 3:33 fairly comfortably. PB is
only 3:29... :-( I have a looong way to go

Eldred
--
Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999
Own Grand Prix Legends? Goto http://gpl.gamestats.com/vroc

Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

by **Eldre** » Mon, 21 Feb 2000 04:00:00

>> How do you know when you at the point where you *need* trailbraking?

>When you've run out of all other options to go faster (like driving
>smoother, adapting the setup to your style etc.) and you still can't tackle
>the corners the way you see the hotshoes do. But looking at Wolfgang
>Woeger's laptimes, I'd say you never really *need* trail braking <g>

Ok - I've given up on adapting setups, so I'll never need trailbraking...<g>

Eldred
--
Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999
Own Grand Prix Legends? Goto http://gpl.gamestats.com/vroc

Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

by **Maps** » Sat, 26 Feb 2000 04:00:00

<...>

I have this inconsistent-between-tracks issue too. I wonder what it is
about my style and some tracks. The GLenn, Monza, Zandvoort are all
easy for me. But I've never done a satisfying lap at Mosport, Rouen,
Kyalami, Mexico, or even really Silverstone. I love the new track-
Osterring (or however it is spelled)- i think it could become my
favorite of the month.

Spa used to be one of these "bears" for me- but I proved, after much
effort, that I could do the occasional sub 3:20 lap. But I still have
to admit that it isn't a natural one for me, for some reason- like
Watkins or Monza.

Oh, I love it. GPL rules. And I love online racing so much that I am
considering looking in to Nascar3- any advice from some fellow GPL
fans as to the simulation quality and online quality of N3? For
starters, I don;t know if they have such an evolved thing as VROC yet-
which is what makes GPL racing doable in my book.

rec.autos.simulators

GPL:Rating the tracks for difficulty

GPL:Rating the tracks for difficulty

GPL:Rating the tracks for difficulty

GPL:Rating the tracks for difficulty

GPL:Rating the tracks for difficulty

GPL:Rating the tracks for difficulty

GPL:Rating the tracks for difficulty

GPL:Rating the tracks for difficulty

GPL:Rating the tracks for difficulty

GPL:Rating the tracks for difficulty

GPL:Rating the tracks for difficulty

GPL:Rating the tracks for difficulty

GPL:Rating the tracks for difficulty

GPL:Rating the tracks for difficulty