rec.autos.simulators

Mr Nobody, did a dang fine post...  here is a copy of the text, but you
should check out the link too...  :)

Well, I got really curious after I started to get mad about the "ALL NEW
GAME ENGINE" claim that EA specifically emulsed on the contents packaging.
So I decided to find out if in fact it really was an "all new game engine."
I downloaded a reader to take a peek at the EA pm suspension file. I took
the mercy of not including the entire thing, but I think after ya'll notice
exactly what it says... well, you'll get the picture. EA wasn't even smart
enough to change the dates and actually this is on the verge of consumer
fraud.

Enjoy the buggy Thunder 03 "game" guys. I'll enjoy using both CDs for new
coasters. At least it's "all new" in that regard.
zx11

Nascar Thunder 2004 Suspension File - Developed By Doug Arnao 05-21-03
// Revised 5/21-03 A-Arm placement to reflect a more relaistic in-garage
static camber setting
// Revised 5/22/03 Shortened Torque Tube length to 60 inches (was 100")
// Revised 6/06/03 Incresed length of steering arm
// Roll center height = 3.14" with lower arm parallel to the ground
// There is -0.96 degree camber GAIN per 1" of bump travel
// Roll center moves linearly (more or less) with bump travel - IE if the
chassis moves down 1 inch the RC moves down 1 inch
// With roll, the RC height doesn't move up or down any appreciable amount
(1/8" max over 2 deg roll)
// With roll, the RC moves to the left (while turning left) .43" (11mm) per
degree of roll
// For every degree of roll we LOSE +.64 deg of camber on the loaded side
and GAIN -.69 on the unloaded side

http://www.onlineracin.com/forum/tm.asp?m=41811

hope that clears it up a bit for ya JTS

-Will

It's no big deal that the suspension file is the same, since it's not like
Cup cars have undergone a big redesign since then.  Doug certainly knows
what he's doing, and if it was right then it's fine to keep that file the
same.  No value in reinventing the wheel (or rather the suspension it
connects to).

Some of the other files, though, DO make you scratch your head...

SB

  Kind of, no, actually, exactly, like when N3 was released  :)

    I'm liking it more and more, but one little "options" button on the ui
would solve a lot of problems.

It's pure conjecture on my part, but it's almost as if the physics end of
this project is the neglected stepchild.  You get the feeling Tiburon was
focusing elsewhere and assumed their middleware physics solution was solid.
How else could they have missed something as obvious and easy to fix as the
rear diff issue?  It doesn't make the cars that much harder to drive, only a
touch less forgiving and in need of a bit more care with the right foot.
But as delivered, it's unarguably not a SIMulation of a Cup car rear end.
There are some other questions in the HDV and TBC files as well, like some
of the aero values and the increased low-speed grip for road course tires
vs. oval ones.

Interesting to note that you can tweak the diff values in the SVM files
(values that are inaccessible in the game setup menu) and race online with
no problem.  Not that it's any advantage, mind you.  I actually spun off T4
in an online race at Kansas last night using a locked diff, when I could've
just flat-tracked it with the LS one.  I guess some folks might gripe about
the cars being less forgiving like that, but the thing is I SHOULD have spun
then, so I didn't mind it happening.  Having to stay more focused when
you're on the limit just adds to the game in my opinion.

But then "floor it and steer" obviously has appeal; what else would explain
the pre*** of plate tracks on race servers over the years...  ;-)

SB

I was online with this again, for a few minutes, I swear to gosh almighty...
but 1st, why is it that about the only track anyone ever sets up, is
Dega-tona...  Jeebus, especially now that just about eveyone agree's that
this is x10 easier to drive, it seems?  Well, at least the lobbies in NR03
are less conjested with typists...  heheheh.

What is the deal with allowing "modified .exe" files on the servers?  Nah I
dont care, supposedly it is "just the no CD patch" but Im sorry after the
last few years of people cheating, It made me go back to here
http://www.racesimcentral.net/

and then back to Richard Burns Rally to get my game & Sim-Fix.  LOL!

Great link!  As a former TY250 owner, I can attest that the ones he says are
really hard - really ARE!

Think I may have injured myself... ;-)

SB

Bill Bollinger
www.gsxn.com