rec.autos.simulators

I've been playing GP2 for some time now and the times I'm producing are
(I like to think) pretty good...but then I look at the top times posted
on the web and I'm at least 2-3 seconds out each time! So, I want to
know...do these guys just put in 50 laps a day to get this good or is it
just a matter of me not having the natural ability :-( ?
--
Jared J Robinson

If you're using the default setups, you'll never be close to the record
times.  Most if not all of them limit your top speed, as well as other
aspects of the racing.  I do believe that GP2 requires more practice than
Nascar, since there are alot more corners to remember, etc.  As long as you
have fun trying to beat the records, I wouldn't worry about the natural
ability part.  :)

--
Brian Fox

Geocities' MotorCity Community Leader
Get your own free homepage at http://www.geocities.com

The Fox Den:  Nascar 1 and 2, ICR2, GP2 and my Streetrod.
http://www.4w.com/pages/fox AND/OR
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/1238

Practice, practice, practice...

Marc

: I've been playing GP2 for some time now and the times I'm producing are
: (I like to think) pretty good...but then I look at the top times posted
: on the web and I'm at least 2-3 seconds out each time! So, I want to
: know...do these guys just put in 50 laps a day to get this good or is it
: just a matter of me not having the natural ability :-( ?

If you want the brutal honest truth, it might actually be BOTH.  Mostly it
is in the setup, but if you don't know how to drive, then you won't get
near the times others are posting.  Then again, it may be because of the
frame rate and other variables.

Ok, it's probably a LOT of things, but practice always helps a little bit.

Hi Jared!

Hmm.. this was one of those messages that would be relevant on the HOF2.5
maillist. :-)

All I can say is:

-first of all you absolutely need excellent setups (which shouldn't be such a
problem :-)  ) The current records exploit those setups to the (almost, and
sometimes even total) absolute maximum. So even when the setup you use is only
_slightly_ worse, there's NO way to get close to those times.

- learn to drive without F7 when you use the keyboard; you'll probably need
about a month of intense practice to _fully_ adapt to it; expect to loose
0.5s-1s if you keep F7.

- take the absolute minimum of fuel (3 or even only 2 laps of fuel) when you get
out of the pits, and save the game one corner before the start of the lap =>
start all attempts from this saved game, and you'll be able to do many more laps
than when you always have to start from the pits.

- keep track of your best splittimes, and estimate (or calculate) what the
"ideal" time would be if you would be able to combine all your best sections
into one lap. After a while, you'll be surprised how _modest_ this on the first
look "great" lap is when you compare it to what is _possible_ on the basis of
your best sections. It will encourage you to go on.

- be prepared to spend at least 2-3hours (not necessarilly in one go) with the
same setup to get the maximum out of it. Spend MORE time if you want to go nr1
;-)

At this point, you should be able to get within 0.5s of the toptimes with the
same setup, if you are reasonably talented.  

For those who don't know them yet, here they are: the keyboard records for GP2:
(http://www.geocities.com/motorcity/9326  for more info)

Interlagos:                    
POS     ID      Score   Time
1       IMI     100,00  1:13,108
2       ANTD    99,81   1:13,115
3       JOH     97,21   1:13,213
4       RALLE   97,03   1:13,220
5       STEVE   94,32   1:13,328
Aida:                  
1       JOH     100,00  1:08,308
2       RAFA    98,47   1:08,361
3       RALLE   92,02   1:08,604
4       STEVE   90,92   1:08,649
5       MIMI    89,92   1:08,691
Imola:                  
1       RALLE   100,00  1:17,695
2       JOH     92,02   1:18,032
3       RAFA    92,00   1:18,033
4       IMI     91,80   1:18,042
5       STEVE   90,20   1:18,117
Monaco:                
1       JOH     100,00  1:14,934
2       STEVE   97,91   1:15,014
3       RAFA    92,63   1:15,232
4       SM      91,88   1:15,265
5       LEO     88,10   1:15,440
Barcelona:                      
1       STEVE   100,00  1:18,152
2       RAFA    97,58   1:18,249
3       SM      92,08   1:18,488
4       JOH     91,48   1:18,516
5       ARTUR   91,22   1:18,528
Montreal:                      
1       STEVE   100,00  1:18,444
2       SOFTY   91,46   1:18,810
3       IMI     89,00   1:18,929
4       RAFA    88,57   1:18,950
5       JOH     88,53   1:18,952
Magny Cours:                    
1       JIMMY   100,00  1:13,764
2       ALEX    98,85   1:13,807
3       STEVE   97,21   1:13,870
4       JOH     96,72   1:13,889
5       SM      94,76   1:13,968
Silverstone:                    
1       IMI     100,00  1:21,491
2       LEO     97,96   1:21,576
3       RAFA    97,51   1:21,595
4       AN      96,06   1:21,658
5       STEVE   93,27   1:21,785
Hockenheim:                    
1       IMI     100,00  1:40,150
2       STEVE   96,01   1:40,358
3       WILLY   95,79   1:40,370
4       MIMI    94,96   1:40,416
5       RALLE   94,83   1:40,423
Hungaroring:                    
1       RAFA    100,00  1:14,859
2       STEVE   90,04   1:15,273
3       IMI     86,14   1:15,461
4       WILLY   83,64   1:15,591
5       RALLE   80,60   1:15,760
Francorchamps:                  
1       RALLE   100,00  1:46,653
2       MIMI    97,98   1:46,763
3       AN      96,26   1:46,860
4       ALEX    93,45   1:47,027
5       STEVE   91,74   1:47,133
Monza:                  
1       PDN     100,00  1:20,460
2       RALLE   98,75   1:20,511
3       WILLY   98,31   1:20,529
4       ALEX    95,31   1:20,658
5       STEVE   95,15   1:20,665
Estoril:                        
1       RALLE   100,00  1:17,569
2       MIMI    96,23   1:17,721
3       STEVE   95,61   1:17,747
4       JOH     91,72   1:17,919
5       MARKG   89,05   1:18,046
Jerez:                  
1       JOH     100,00  1:19,618
2       STEVE   92,65   1:19,934
3       IMI     85,82   1:20,276
4       AN      84,31   1:20,359
5       DUNH    83,15   1:20,425
Suzuka:                
1       AN      100,00  1:32,729
2       RALLE   88,04   1:33,359
3       MIMI    84,45   1:33,583
4       ALEX    84,11   1:33,605
5       KAFRE   81,55   1:33,778
Adelaide:                      
1       JOH     100,00  1:11,572
2       AN      90,86   1:11,932
3       STEVE   86,66   1:12,123
4       ANTD    84,23   1:12,242
5       MIMI    83,23   1:12,293

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
When everything else failed, we can still become im-
mortal by making an enormous blunder....

                             John Kenneth Galbraith
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

On Wed, 20 Aug 1997 17:47:59 +0100, Jared J Robinson

http://infoweb.magi.com/~ericcote/gp2menu.html

known as "SPY's GP2 WEBSITE

You'll find all kind of guides for setups, tracks, telemetry, how to
approach and decides on setting-up a car for a "new track". And
of course some fine race/qual setups to start with. I'm always in
favour of those who defines/creates their own setups within
physical parameters.

Take care, Eric

-DG-

Maybe not 50 laps a day, but 50 laps for training, setup (good setups for  
qualifying and race give You a few seconds!), short races on every track  
are really necessary. I drive in the Semi-Pro-Level with the driving help  
F2, F5 and F6 and after "50 laps" I'm able to win a Non-Championship-Race.

Axel

--------------------------------------------------------------
           - Axel Schlueter - Fax: (02361) 374058 -

No, you drive different. Your setup is unique.

I can only recommend to read "The fine art of car-setup" from Sim Racing.
This helped me to cut 5 seconds from my fastest lap on Interlagos, and get
close to 1 tenth to the pole on Estoril.

Understand the mechanics of the car, learn the behaviour, feel how it
drives, experiment with your setup. If you don't, your times will stick
around a certain value and you might take of a few thousands or maybe
one-hundred of a second.

I don't spend hours in testing. I test, try a setup, drive a few laps, or
even get back to the pits right after leaving it, when I feel the car runs
worse.

I'll continue with a change until it starts to make the car run worse, then
I go back.

This is how you improve your times dramatically. Not by keeping running
around the circuit. For instance, if you habe learned to ease off the
throttle in a corner because otherwise you spin of, instead of learning to
ease-off, start thinking WHY do I spin off, and most important, how can I
take that corner faster.

And people, a setup that lasts only 1 or 2 laps... Set your carheight
higher. A hotlap is not a racelap.

What makes you think that? Have you got any evidence?

Every now & then some idiot will think it's "cool" to post a lap with a
1000BHP engine, but none of the serious hotlappers would ever attempt
something as crass as that. Besides, it is easy enough to tell that a lap
has been made with hacked values.

Many of the really fast laps are driven with opposite lock help which
allows unrealistic driving and hence very low times. No aids laps are
usually 0.5 to 2 seconds slower, depending on the track and how many
chicanes can be taken flat out with opp lock ;-)

Here are the top no aids laps from F1SA and I can guarantee that they are
all genuine & legal with no intentional use of grass or gravel:

 Adelaide    1:11.323  
 Barcelona   1:16.323  
 Estoril     1:16.494  
 Hockenheim  1:38.195  
 Hungaroring 1:13.644  
 Imola       1:17.344  
 Interlagos  1:12.354  
 Jerez       1:18.555
 Magny-Cours 1:12.248  
 Monaco      1:13.217
 Montreal    1:17.222
 Monza       1:19.920
 Silverstone 1:20.287
 Spa         1:44.532  
 Suzuka      1:32.180
 TI Aida     1:07.021  

Cheers,
Richard

Hi Phillip

(btw, isn't it so much better using the CSi (or at least the better parts
of CSi) "hi" convention. Helps reminds people that they are talking to
other people rather than their PCs <g>. A major contributor to the flame
free zone that can be found in F1SA & similar parts of CSi, IMHO. Pity it
isn't prevalent on r.a.s.....)

Yep, it's still great. I only joined after GP2 was released so I can't
compare it to the "old" days <g> but the competition is strong and always
friendly & honest.

No, we don't have any special authentication utility. But the
commisioners do verify the hotlaps - HoF2lap shows the BHP & weight
recorded in the hotlap file & if those values have been hacked within the
.HL* file then it won't replay properly. In my 13 months with F1SA, I've
never come across an illegal lap in that sense.

Of course, some people will try and cut out chicanes and that becomes a
matter for judgement (only applies to the non-WW laps though - WW drivers
don't even consider such a thing <g>). With the top hotlappers uploading
their laps to the forum for all to see, this hasn't been a major problem
yet. A few laps have been disqualified, but the drivers involved have
usually gone on to record a faster, legal, lap in any case!

Yep, we're still the best <vbg>. Personally I've never seen a WW lap that
can match those set in F1SA (not that I've really looked that hard to be
honest though).

Of the top WWers you may remember Mark Guest (used to be one of the best
keyboard drivers & is now using a GP1 since he can't use pedals) and Rob
Shearer (the smoothest GP2 driver I've ever seen). Mark is really taking
the WW charts by storm since he got the GP1 and I think has the thrones
at all the circuits where he has driven seriously. Other WW throne
holders are Achim Trensz, Georg Naujoks & myself.

Thanks. I'll pass your message on to those in F1SA, so maybe you'll get
the odd email from those who remember you.

The cost is an issue, but I decided it was worth it for F1SA alone. R.A.S
may be "free", but Sprtsims section 14 is better value for money for
anyone interested in racing sims <vbg>

Cheers,
Richard

What software would this be and what leagues use this software. GP
editor makes
it to easy for even Win95 newbies to turn up the property values. Dont
get me wrong,
I like GP2 edit for its ease of use in importing car sets, helmets, and
manipulating track
objects and textures features. On the other hand dont kid yourself Jo,
there are plenty
of other ways to hack a file that could easily slide past any
"detection" program.
If you remember a few months back all the mouthing off of "Cheating on
Hawaii".
Check your sources. What type of security program did they use? Not a
good enough
one. Ive been to several league sites and havent seen mention of
software to detect cheating.
Also some of the most popular ICR2, GP2, N2 leagues have rules based on
"Honesty".
Can someone else veryfy this?

And BTW, It does help your times by having the fastest computer possible
to handle the framerate
during a race.

Ta Ta,

-DG-