rec.autos.simulators

> > P.S., Mats tests just illustrated to me that the wheel had decent
response
> > to low-level forces, but that they there was a big difference between
the
> > smallest force you could feel with the wheel still compared to if it was
> > turning.  This seems to precisely mirror the situation in GPL.  I
believe
> > that if you could implement such a test on a MS-based wheel, you would
not
> > experience the disparity--the smallest forces can be felt equally
(although
> > maybe not so smoothly) whether the wheel is turning or stationary.  I
have
> > no idea why IForce would intentionally design things this way????  Any
> > ideas?

> It is not by design as in 'desired behaviour', it is just an effect
> from having to design with a tolerable price in mind combined with
> the fact that most consumers believe that stronger forces are
> equivalent to better forces. A cheap and strong engine is likely
> to be very notchy and a very notchy engine implies high static
> friction in the wheel. High static friction in turn hides subtle
> forces when the wheel is stationary.

> If it were not for the pedals I would have bought the logitech wheel
> to begin with since it seems to be a lot smoother. I.e. its forces are
> weaker, but the internal friction is even smaller so when you add
> things up it is capable of sending more information to the driver.
> (Kind of like it being easier to hear what someone is whispering in
> a quite room than it is to hear what someone is screaming in a bar.
> It is not signal strength that counts but signal to noise ratio.)

> > > Ya, I tried the tests. Had to turn the Direction to 90 first at any
> > > magnitude to feel anything.

> Not very suprising since most ff wheels are not capable of
> generating forwards - aft forces :-)

> > > Also, I wasn't convinced that the test actually
> > > proved dynamic range at all. He used a very low frequency which of
course
> > > doesn't transmit well at lower magnitudes or volumes (which is what
this
> > > really is). That's why you have a Bass Boost (Loudness on some) on
your
> > > stereo amplifier that kicks off at higher volume settings.

> The frequency has not much to do with it, use whatever frequency(s) that
> match the signals you want to percieve in the game. Few of the signals
> I want from the game are high frequency, hence I used 10Hz for the tests.

> (Of course for the complete test you have to test the ratio between the
> strongest force available and the weakest force you can feel at
> 1/ a large number of frequencies and
> 2/ both with a moving wheel and with a stationary wheel.)

> And loudness isn't there to compensate for a lousy frequency curve
> in your amplifier, it is there to compensate for variation sensitivity
> of the human ear at different sound levels and frequencies. Afaik, my
hands
> don't have that kind of non linear sensitivy to force input at different
> force levels and frequencies.

> > > [snip]
> > > Still, I don't see dynamic range in this at all (no offense to Mats).
When
> > > you turn the wheel (motor) you collide with the wave pulses as each
> > > armature pole passes by the magnets, so the force is stronger.
> > > [snip]

> You don't mean this is a good thing I hope? I'd rather have a ff wheel
> that is transmitting the force programmed by the game to my hands instead
> of adding friction, notches and other kinds of distorsions that makes
> it feel much less like the wheel of a real life car.

>       _
> Mats Lofkvist