rec.autos.simulators

Has anyone noticed....

Don

Has anyone noticed....

by Don » Sat, 07 Sep 2002 12:15:03

Maybe I'm overstepping my bounds since I suck at N4 and have no more than
20-30 minutes at a time experience with it; but I submit that N4 is
**VASTLY** superior to ANY previous version of Nx. Sure it's got bugs: name
ONE piece of software in its price range with its complexity that doesn't.
All in all, though, I further submit that given the expense of the game and
its enjoyment payback it's WAY worth the money spent on it.
Go to a movie - even alone. $7 for the ticket, gas money, munchies and all
for - what, 2 1/2 hours?
I agree: I've actually spent close to $500 to get N4 to run properly; but
some of that money is also helping me in other ways. Now my computer is
faster in EVERYTHING. I bought surround sound speakers and card for N99, so
that was an expense already. I figure I've spent PENNIES for hours of
enjoyment.
Bottom line: N4 is still "better" than anything previous. "Better," of
course, is relative... but don't forget to take in EVERYthing in its
class...

Gunner
(just trying to stir up thought, not fights...)


>   Good point Bill.



> > Randy?  The guy who put multiplayer on the map for Papy IMHO, was
Charlie
> > Heath.  Where is Charlie now?  BTW, the ship started to sink prior to
N3.



> > >   Not sure Tom, but I think Randy Cassidy is the multiplay genuis at
> Papy.

> > > John



> > > > Dave Kaemmer, who?

> > > > What did he do for the Papy NASCAR series?

> > > > Dave gets "major-league" kudos from me (and probably the rest of the
> > > world,
> > > > at least he deserves to) on his GPL genre'........that's just a
given.
> > > But,
> > > > he didn't do anything for the NASCAR series at Papyrus....not even
the
> > > > conversion of the GPL physics engine to N4.  Although, maybe that
was
> > just
> > > a
> > > > *** rumor?

> > > > And, by the way.....wasn't Ed Martin around when the Papy "Hawaii"
> > online
> > > > beta was running/developing?  Isn't he considered the "father of MP"
> at
> > > > Papyrus?  Isn't he also, now at EA doing the pc "full simulation"
> NASCAR
> > > > Thunder -2003?  Or, is that a different guy?

> > > > And, when someone surely says, "Yeah....but look what Ed did with
> > > > Heat.....it had crappy mp too!"

> > > > Then I will say, "Heat was short changed by Hasbro when they got
> notice
> > of
> > > > the impending sale......just ask the guys at MGI about that.  Seems
to
> > me
> > > > the mp in Viper Racing was dang good, no?  But it never got into
Heat
> > > > because Hasbro shut the project down and banged it out the
> door....only
> > > > about 80% finished, remember?"  Is Rich Garcia still at MGI?

> > > > I thought one word in the Sierra press release was of interest:
> "NASCAR
> > > > series finale" - yep, I know that's three words.  Here's three more
> > words:
> > > > Bye, bye Papy!

> > > > TP

> > > > PS:  Before some of you start flaming me for anti-papy
> > sentiments.......I
> > > > admit I don't like the corporate culture at Papyrus....I think
that's
> > been
> > > > bad for the sim community, in general...for too many years now (they
> > > stifled
> > > > creativity in the user group....or tried to in a heavy-handed
> > way......as
> > > > in, Havas legal was "dialing for dollars" to my phones pretty
> regularly
> > a
> > > > couple years ago).  But, I'd like to see them cut free of the NASCAR
> > > series
> > > > to do a more creative racing sim.  Even GPL-2 would be to my liking.
> > But
> > > it
> > > > ain't going to happen.  Hopefully, the talent still left there will
> find
> > > its
> > > > way over to EA (ISI) and we can keep on going with cool NASCAR
racing
> > sims
> > > > (with good mp, too).  Let's hope "GPL lives" in Racing
> > Legends......many,
> > > > many more eons!  Okay, Chris and Tony....."La puerta esta abierta!"
> Or
> > > > something like that?



> > > > >   That in all the press releases, all the sysop statements, all
the
> > > > > newsgroup rantings...not a single MENTION of Dave Kaemmer???

> > > > > dave henrie

Steve Smit

Has anyone noticed....

by Steve Smit » Sat, 07 Sep 2002 22:04:52

Agree.  I spent $50 on GPL software...and about $5000 (over 3 years)
upgrading the hardware (which I've used for a lot of other purposes).  For
my entertainment dollars, that puts GPL in the same league as "War and
Peace" ... and miles ahead of a bodysurfing vacation, say, at Poipu on Kuai.



> Maybe I'm overstepping my bounds since I suck at N4 and have no more than
> 20-30 minutes at a time experience with it; but I submit that N4 is
> **VASTLY** superior to ANY previous version of Nx. Sure it's got bugs:
name
> ONE piece of software in its price range with its complexity that doesn't.
> All in all, though, I further submit that given the expense of the game
and
> its enjoyment payback it's WAY worth the money spent on it.
> Go to a movie - even alone. $7 for the ticket, gas money, munchies and all
> for - what, 2 1/2 hours?
> I agree: I've actually spent close to $500 to get N4 to run properly; but
> some of that money is also helping me in other ways. Now my computer is
> faster in EVERYTHING. I bought surround sound speakers and card for N99,
so
> that was an expense already. I figure I've spent PENNIES for hours of
> enjoyment.
> Bottom line: N4 is still "better" than anything previous. "Better," of
> course, is relative... but don't forget to take in EVERYthing in its
> class...

> Gunner
> (just trying to stir up thought, not fights...)



> >   Good point Bill.



> > > Randy?  The guy who put multiplayer on the map for Papy IMHO, was
> Charlie
> > > Heath.  Where is Charlie now?  BTW, the ship started to sink prior to
> N3.



> > > >   Not sure Tom, but I think Randy Cassidy is the multiplay genuis at
> > Papy.

> > > > John



> > > > > Dave Kaemmer, who?

> > > > > What did he do for the Papy NASCAR series?

> > > > > Dave gets "major-league" kudos from me (and probably the rest of
the
> > > > world,
> > > > > at least he deserves to) on his GPL genre'........that's just a
> given.
> > > > But,
> > > > > he didn't do anything for the NASCAR series at Papyrus....not even
> the
> > > > > conversion of the GPL physics engine to N4.  Although, maybe that
> was
> > > just
> > > > a
> > > > > *** rumor?

> > > > > And, by the way.....wasn't Ed Martin around when the Papy "Hawaii"
> > > online
> > > > > beta was running/developing?  Isn't he considered the "father of
MP"
> > at
> > > > > Papyrus?  Isn't he also, now at EA doing the pc "full simulation"
> > NASCAR
> > > > > Thunder -2003?  Or, is that a different guy?

> > > > > And, when someone surely says, "Yeah....but look what Ed did with
> > > > > Heat.....it had crappy mp too!"

> > > > > Then I will say, "Heat was short changed by Hasbro when they got
> > notice
> > > of
> > > > > the impending sale......just ask the guys at MGI about that.
Seems
> to
> > > me
> > > > > the mp in Viper Racing was dang good, no?  But it never got into
> Heat
> > > > > because Hasbro shut the project down and banged it out the
> > door....only
> > > > > about 80% finished, remember?"  Is Rich Garcia still at MGI?

> > > > > I thought one word in the Sierra press release was of interest:
> > "NASCAR
> > > > > series finale" - yep, I know that's three words.  Here's three
more
> > > words:
> > > > > Bye, bye Papy!

> > > > > TP

> > > > > PS:  Before some of you start flaming me for anti-papy
> > > sentiments.......I
> > > > > admit I don't like the corporate culture at Papyrus....I think
> that's
> > > been
> > > > > bad for the sim community, in general...for too many years now
(they
> > > > stifled
> > > > > creativity in the user group....or tried to in a heavy-handed
> > > way......as
> > > > > in, Havas legal was "dialing for dollars" to my phones pretty
> > regularly
> > > a
> > > > > couple years ago).  But, I'd like to see them cut free of the
NASCAR
> > > > series
> > > > > to do a more creative racing sim.  Even GPL-2 would be to my
liking.
> > > But
> > > > it
> > > > > ain't going to happen.  Hopefully, the talent still left there
will
> > find
> > > > its
> > > > > way over to EA (ISI) and we can keep on going with cool NASCAR
> racing
> > > sims
> > > > > (with good mp, too).  Let's hope "GPL lives" in Racing
> > > Legends......many,
> > > > > many more eons!  Okay, Chris and Tony....."La puerta esta
abierta!"
> > Or
> > > > > something like that?



> > > > > >   That in all the press releases, all the sysop statements, all
> the
> > > > > > newsgroup rantings...not a single MENTION of Dave Kaemmer???

> > > > > > dave henrie

Samm

Has anyone noticed....

by Samm » Sun, 08 Sep 2002 08:36:30

So, Pabst said it might have been a *** rumor, guess it was.

S.


> Dave worked extensively on both N4 and NR2002, and was responsible for the
> conversion of the GPL physics engine for use in the Nascar products.

> - Eric



> > Which part, Eric?

Samm

Has anyone noticed....

by Samm » Sun, 08 Sep 2002 08:39:27

No, he said, "Although, maybe that was just a
*** rumor?"

Interesting how "selective" your reading becomes when you want to slam
somebody you don't like.  Makes you kind of an ***, in my book.

S.


> But didn't Tom say he wasn't and is that the gospel truth ;)





> > > Kaemmer is working on the physics for 2003.

> > > - Eric

> >     Glad to hear it.  Thanks for the info.
> > dave henrie

Samm

Has anyone noticed....

by Samm » Sun, 08 Sep 2002 08:42:08

Well Wayne, I see Pabst creating new track textures for N2002, helping
people with their video card problems, helping people with lots of hardware
problems.....and I've never seen you post anything in here but "flames" -
usually directed at Pabst.  "Hot air"....that's all you have.  What have you
done for others lately that's even in the same league as Pabst?

S.


> Yeah,

> Tom seems to think he knows alot about sim racing but truthfully he only
has
> the biggest mouth. He seems to think anything spewed from his mouth is
fact,
> though most of the time it's just hot air.



> > I don't know where you got that information, but it's completely false.

> > - Eric



> > > Dave gets "major-league" kudos from me (and probably the rest of the
> > world,
> > > at least he deserves to) on his GPL genre'........that's just a given.
> > But,
> > > he didn't do anything for the NASCAR series at Papyrus....not even the
> > > conversion of the GPL physics engine to N4.  Although, maybe that was
> just
> > a
> > > *** rumor?

Rick Boy

Has anyone noticed....

by Rick Boy » Sun, 08 Sep 2002 10:38:18

Well I've waited a few days and no one brought this up so I'll ask.

We got a d3d patch for GPL because some jasper at Papyrus wanted to use his
nVidia card.  Everyone cheered.

Isn't there anyone around there who wants to run the 'Ring or Spa in N2002
and is willing to do a little extracurriculr work to make that happen, (e.g.
unsupported patch?)  Seems simple to me but then again, I'm an idiot.


> Kaemmer is working on the physics for 2003.

> - Eric



> > That in all the press releases, all the sysop statements, all the
> > newsgroup rantings...not a single MENTION of Dave Kaemmer???

Wayne Bradle

Has anyone noticed....

by Wayne Bradle » Wed, 11 Sep 2002 01:45:00

Well Sammy, I don't need to air my "pats on the back" as others must need
to. Lack of self-respect maybe, you would have to ask Tom.  If you don't
like my "hot air" don't read it. It's up to you Sammy, you're in control of
this one.  Again, I have no need to brag about my past, present or future,
unlike some others. My actions speak for me, not some diluted long winded
post stroking me up.

When someone posts with such authority and basically spews lies, one needs
to call him on it.  It's the nature of News Groups.  Again, if you don't
like it don't read it.


> Well Wayne, I see Pabst creating new track textures for N2002, helping
> people with their video card problems, helping people with lots of
hardware
> problems.....and I've never seen you post anything in here but "flames" -
> usually directed at Pabst.  "Hot air"....that's all you have.  What have
you
> done for others lately that's even in the same league as Pabst?

> S.



> > Yeah,

> > Tom seems to think he knows alot about sim racing but truthfully he only
> has
> > the biggest mouth. He seems to think anything spewed from his mouth is
> fact,
> > though most of the time it's just hot air.



> > > I don't know where you got that information, but it's completely
false.

> > > - Eric



> > > > Dave gets "major-league" kudos from me (and probably the rest of the
> > > world,
> > > > at least he deserves to) on his GPL genre'........that's just a
given.
> > > But,
> > > > he didn't do anything for the NASCAR series at Papyrus....not even
the
> > > > conversion of the GPL physics engine to N4.  Although, maybe that
was
> > just
> > > a
> > > > *** rumor?

Biz

Has anyone noticed....

by Biz » Wed, 11 Sep 2002 05:28:43

And if we don't like it, we can post a reply to your ***and tell you what a jackass you are, as
you said, "It's the nature of News Groups".  He DID end his statement with "Although, maybe that was
just a *** rumor?", or maybe you just "dont' read so good".
--
Biz

"Don't touch that please, your primitive intellect wouldn't understand
alloys and compositions and,......things with molecular structures,....and
the....." - Ash


> Well Sammy, I don't need to air my "pats on the back" as others must need
> to. Lack of self-respect maybe, you would have to ask Tom.  If you don't
> like my "hot air" don't read it. It's up to you Sammy, you're in control of
> this one.  Again, I have no need to brag about my past, present or future,
> unlike some others. My actions speak for me, not some diluted long winded
> post stroking me up.

> When someone posts with such authority and basically spews lies, one needs
> to call him on it.  It's the nature of News Groups.  Again, if you don't
> like it don't read it.



> > Well Wayne, I see Pabst creating new track textures for N2002, helping
> > people with their video card problems, helping people with lots of
> hardware
> > problems.....and I've never seen you post anything in here but "flames" -
> > usually directed at Pabst.  "Hot air"....that's all you have.  What have
> you
> > done for others lately that's even in the same league as Pabst?

> > S.



> > > Yeah,

> > > Tom seems to think he knows alot about sim racing but truthfully he only
> > has
> > > the biggest mouth. He seems to think anything spewed from his mouth is
> > fact,
> > > though most of the time it's just hot air.



> > > > I don't know where you got that information, but it's completely
> false.

> > > > - Eric



> > > > > Dave gets "major-league" kudos from me (and probably the rest of the
> > > > world,
> > > > > at least he deserves to) on his GPL genre'........that's just a
> given.
> > > > But,
> > > > > he didn't do anything for the NASCAR series at Papyrus....not even
> the
> > > > > conversion of the GPL physics engine to N4.  Although, maybe that
> was
> > > just
> > > > a
> > > > > *** rumor?

Wayne Bradle

Has anyone noticed....

by Wayne Bradle » Wed, 11 Sep 2002 06:28:37

Biz,
You better wipe some of Tom off your chin.

I never said you couldn't, so go nuts big guy.  I hope you feel better now.
I am glad that you could join in the fun.

Wayne Bradley
"Although, maybe that was just a *** rumor?"

I should use that as my sig, then I can basically say any BS I want and be
covered.


what a jackass you are, as
"Although, maybe that was

> just a *** rumor?", or maybe you just "dont' read so good".
> --
> Biz

> "Don't touch that please, your primitive intellect wouldn't understand
> alloys and compositions and,......things with molecular structures,....and
> the....." - Ash




> > Well Sammy, I don't need to air my "pats on the back" as others must
need
> > to. Lack of self-respect maybe, you would have to ask Tom.  If you don't
> > like my "hot air" don't read it. It's up to you Sammy, you're in control
of
> > this one.  Again, I have no need to brag about my past, present or
future,
> > unlike some others. My actions speak for me, not some diluted long
winded
> > post stroking me up.

> > When someone posts with such authority and basically spews lies, one
needs
> > to call him on it.  It's the nature of News Groups.  Again, if you don't
> > like it don't read it.



> > > Well Wayne, I see Pabst creating new track textures for N2002, helping
> > > people with their video card problems, helping people with lots of
> > hardware
> > > problems.....and I've never seen you post anything in here but
"flames" -
> > > usually directed at Pabst.  "Hot air"....that's all you have.  What
have
> > you
> > > done for others lately that's even in the same league as Pabst?

> > > S.



> > > > Yeah,

> > > > Tom seems to think he knows alot about sim racing but truthfully he
only
> > > has
> > > > the biggest mouth. He seems to think anything spewed from his mouth
is
> > > fact,
> > > > though most of the time it's just hot air.



> > > > > I don't know where you got that information, but it's completely
> > false.

> > > > > - Eric



> > > > > > Dave gets "major-league" kudos from me (and probably the rest of
the
> > > > > world,
> > > > > > at least he deserves to) on his GPL genre'........that's just a
> > given.
> > > > > But,
> > > > > > he didn't do anything for the NASCAR series at Papyrus....not
even
> > the
> > > > > > conversion of the GPL physics engine to N4.  Although, maybe
that
> > was
> > > > just
> > > > > a
> > > > > > *** rumor?

mark jeangerar

Has anyone noticed....

by mark jeangerar » Thu, 12 Sep 2002 16:00:20

Wait a minute...

I thought you worked on the GPL project?

...and they burned you for an extra 15 bucks over what we paid? That's
gratitude for ya.

--

"Nothing gets closer!" - Crammond

mark


> Agree.  I spent $50 on GPL software...and about $5000 (over 3 years)
> upgrading the hardware (which I've used for a lot of other purposes).  For
> my entertainment dollars, that puts GPL in the same league as "War and
> Peace" ... and miles ahead of a bodysurfing vacation, say, at Poipu on
Kuai.



> > Maybe I'm overstepping my bounds since I suck at N4 and have no more
than
> > 20-30 minutes at a time experience with it; but I submit that N4 is
> > **VASTLY** superior to ANY previous version of Nx. Sure it's got bugs:
> name
> > ONE piece of software in its price range with its complexity that
doesn't.
> > All in all, though, I further submit that given the expense of the game
> and
> > its enjoyment payback it's WAY worth the money spent on it.
> > Go to a movie - even alone. $7 for the ticket, gas money, munchies and
all
> > for - what, 2 1/2 hours?
> > I agree: I've actually spent close to $500 to get N4 to run properly;
but
> > some of that money is also helping me in other ways. Now my computer is
> > faster in EVERYTHING. I bought surround sound speakers and card for N99,
> so
> > that was an expense already. I figure I've spent PENNIES for hours of
> > enjoyment.
> > Bottom line: N4 is still "better" than anything previous. "Better," of
> > course, is relative... but don't forget to take in EVERYthing in its
> > class...

> > Gunner
> > (just trying to stir up thought, not fights...)



> > >   Good point Bill.



> > > > Randy?  The guy who put multiplayer on the map for Papy IMHO, was
> > Charlie
> > > > Heath.  Where is Charlie now?  BTW, the ship started to sink prior
to
> > N3.



> > > > >   Not sure Tom, but I think Randy Cassidy is the multiplay genuis
at
> > > Papy.

> > > > > John



> > > > > > Dave Kaemmer, who?

> > > > > > What did he do for the Papy NASCAR series?

> > > > > > Dave gets "major-league" kudos from me (and probably the rest of
> the
> > > > > world,
> > > > > > at least he deserves to) on his GPL genre'........that's just a
> > given.
> > > > > But,
> > > > > > he didn't do anything for the NASCAR series at Papyrus....not
even
> > the
> > > > > > conversion of the GPL physics engine to N4.  Although, maybe
that
> > was
> > > > just
> > > > > a
> > > > > > *** rumor?

> > > > > > And, by the way.....wasn't Ed Martin around when the Papy
"Hawaii"
> > > > online
> > > > > > beta was running/developing?  Isn't he considered the "father of
> MP"
> > > at
> > > > > > Papyrus?  Isn't he also, now at EA doing the pc "full
simulation"
> > > NASCAR
> > > > > > Thunder -2003?  Or, is that a different guy?

> > > > > > And, when someone surely says, "Yeah....but look what Ed did
with
> > > > > > Heat.....it had crappy mp too!"

> > > > > > Then I will say, "Heat was short changed by Hasbro when they got
> > > notice
> > > > of
> > > > > > the impending sale......just ask the guys at MGI about that.
> Seems
> > to
> > > > me
> > > > > > the mp in Viper Racing was dang good, no?  But it never got into
> > Heat
> > > > > > because Hasbro shut the project down and banged it out the
> > > door....only
> > > > > > about 80% finished, remember?"  Is Rich Garcia still at MGI?

> > > > > > I thought one word in the Sierra press release was of interest:
> > > "NASCAR
> > > > > > series finale" - yep, I know that's three words.  Here's three
> more
> > > > words:
> > > > > > Bye, bye Papy!

> > > > > > TP

> > > > > > PS:  Before some of you start flaming me for anti-papy
> > > > sentiments.......I
> > > > > > admit I don't like the corporate culture at Papyrus....I think
> > that's
> > > > been
> > > > > > bad for the sim community, in general...for too many years now
> (they
> > > > > stifled
> > > > > > creativity in the user group....or tried to in a heavy-handed
> > > > way......as
> > > > > > in, Havas legal was "dialing for dollars" to my phones pretty
> > > regularly
> > > > a
> > > > > > couple years ago).  But, I'd like to see them cut free of the
> NASCAR
> > > > > series
> > > > > > to do a more creative racing sim.  Even GPL-2 would be to my
> liking.
> > > > But
> > > > > it
> > > > > > ain't going to happen.  Hopefully, the talent still left there
> will
> > > find
> > > > > its
> > > > > > way over to EA (ISI) and we can keep on going with cool NASCAR
> > racing
> > > > sims
> > > > > > (with good mp, too).  Let's hope "GPL lives" in Racing
> > > > Legends......many,
> > > > > > many more eons!  Okay, Chris and Tony....."La puerta esta
> abierta!"
> > > Or
> > > > > > something like that?



> > > > > > >   That in all the press releases, all the sysop statements,
all
> > the
> > > > > > > newsgroup rantings...not a single MENTION of Dave Kaemmer???

> > > > > > > dave henrie


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