rec.autos.simulators

SCGT is pretty good for a day or two.  The tracks
and cars are great, maybe better than anything
else out there.  In the end, though, I can't get
past two things.  One, the way the car seems to
be balanced on the head of a pin, that is, you
can put half the car off the track before
anything bad happens.  Two, the speeds of the
AI cars are too inconsistent to have fun.  If
there was a "Nim's AI" type of update for it, I
think I could get more into it.

Viper is great!  I'd only played the demo before,
and thought it was good.  After driving the car
on more tracks, I have to say it's seriously
rivals GPL.  The FF runs a close second to GPL
too.  It's by far better than the FF in any
other sim I've tried.

Unfortunately, the tracks kind of stink, and
probably won't hold my attention much longer.
If only we had the SCGT tracks in Viper!

Seems to me that Viper would be a great
candidate for third-party development.  New
tracks and cars could make this sim an equal
to GPL.  N3 would be great if it had Viper's
physics model.

Oh well, I'll probably be back on VROC in a
few days :)

--
Pat Dotson
IMPACT Motorsports
http://www.racesimcentral.net/

Todd

--
Brian Fox
http://www.geocities.com/~foxman
Pobody's Nerfect
Warranty void if tagline removed.

<snip>

Even if it was only Vipers to race, it would be awesome if we had actual
race circuits along with a better multiplayer implementation.

Scott
PA-Scott

--
Scott B. Husted
"PA-Scott"
COO
MMMGI
ICQ# 4395450

http://www.MMMGI.com
http://www.Acrotech.net
http://www.Powersims.com
http://www.InternetMotorsports.net

Sounds like your just getting into Viper. The game
really starts when you get into Career mode. Don't give
up on it till you win in Career mode with max difficulty
settings, it's a real challenge.  I've had more exciting
races with the AI in Viper than I have so far in gpl.

--
Don Scurlock
Vancouver,B.C.

After about 4 hours last night, and 3 hours tonight,
I've won some pro races in career mode.  I was
hoping that at higher levels, the tracks would
get better, but they just get more NFS-like.  That
kills the fun for me.

What I want out of a sim is a realistic experience.
Ideally, it would enhance my real-world driving
ability, and teach me something about car
control that I didn't know before.  Driving 150 mph
through a road runner cartoon isn't my idea of
realism.

It's too bad, because the physics of the sims is
really really good.  It's disappointing that there
isn't some more realistic pavement to drive on.

Guess I'll have to wait on Skip Barber, and WSC!

--
Pat Dotson
IMPACT Motorsports
http://www.impactmotorsports.com/pd.html

  I think you are expecting too much from a "GAME".  Although we call
them sims because they simulate setting up race cars and some what
simulate what driving one "might be like" there is no way in hell that
you can get a real simulation of what driving a real race car is like
since you base everything on visual feedback from a flat computer
screen.
  As far as the Viper tracks go, they more closely simulate what you
would, in your real world driving, be likely to drive on.  They are very
close to the open road races held in Nevada (and a few other states I
guess) every year.  Yes I fully agree that VR was in dire need of some
real world tracks like SCGT.
  If after just a couple of sessions you are regularly beating the AI at
the max settings then I guess you need to go back to GP2 and GPL.  Wish
I was that good,  It took me weeks to finally win the Career season at
the GT level. Although I have not played it in months it was one of the
most challenging sims available.  
  Just my opinions, Paul

(viper racing)

Does anybody know of ANY attempts whatsoever
of third-party development beyond car-painting for Viper Racing ,
such as  new tracks/track modificatons/new cars (models) ?

--
Robert S?derberg

If replying by mail,remove the word  INGENSPAM from the adress.

I pretty much completely disagree.  Of course,
you can't completely prepare to drive a real car
by driving a sim.  Despite that, many aspects of
car control can be simulated on a computer, and
a sim can give you a very good idea of what to
expect when you do get into a real car.

The key is to study, and understand, how the
sim experience relates to what happens in a real
car.

For instance, I went to a driving school last
fall.  They run SCCA spec cars - Formula Renault
is the proper name I think.  Other than karts,
a bit of auto-x'ing, and a few laps in a midget
sprint car, this is the only time I've been in
a race vehicle.  GPL and the other sims I used,
combined with a lot of studying about race car
handling, really prepared me for driving those
cars.  Driving them was totally natural
from the start.  Interestingly, the biggest
problem I had going fast was with shifting,
because that has been poorly modeled by sims
in the past.  Once we get RS shifter support
for GPL, I'll have that wired too! :)

I'll grant you that, but I'm not likely to be
going 170 mph on an interstate :)

I think Viper is really as challenging to drive
as GPL.  That fact is masked by the tracks in
Viper.  If we had the chance to take a lap at
GPL's Rouen in Viper, it would be apparent to
all.

That said, I think having a good handle on
GPL would allow someone to be competitive
in Viper right away.  I made it through the
first two classes and into Pro within about
the first four hours with the sim.

--
Pat Dotson
IMPACT Motorsports
http://www.impactmotorsports.com/pd.html

That I cannot more agree with.  I still say Viper Racing, even if praised,
is under-estimed.  It was a little ahead of it's time, and flaws like
acceptable sound and fantasy tracks are the only reason why it somehow
failed to keep the attention.  Oh and the closed-architecture MGI created
it.

But for a first title (well even if they were from Papyrus) ? Excellent.
The game engine has potential, it just stinks that it's already been more
than a year and we haven't seen any news from them. Not even a press release
of their upcoming sim, if they will ever do one. I really hope they do.

Just imagine Viper Racing with more *** cars (Porsches, McLaren F1 and
Mercedes CLK, etc...), on real tracks around the world.  Laguna,
Nurburgring, Elkhart Lake, etc..

Put the name "Need for Speed" and get published by EA so they can fund the
licensing.  Incredible seller.  Well they would have to make it open
architecture and possibility give us Online community tools (multiplayer
racing is not enough anymore).

--
-- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard>
-- May the Downforce be with you...

"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realise
how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."

--
Pat Dotson
IMPACT Motorsports
http://www.impactmotorsports.com/pd.html

Fire! Fire!!
 ;)

--
* rrev at mindspring dot com

        These tracks are not real?  Maybe you should have rephrased this and
said something in the order of.. "I'd rather drive in Cities rather then
race tracks."  The tracks mentioned by YManard are real tracks.  Driving
in Cities or out in the desert and such would be fun but would still be
almost the same as now...  Viper Racing would have died (so to speak) as
quick as it did before.

just my opinion,
Mike
--
=========================================
Mike Barlow of Barlow Racing?
=========================================
http://www.racesimcentral.net/

Racing online with the help of......

Race Communications Association
Holodyne Engineering
Mystic Music
(have Your !!Name/Address!! placed here)