N4 Unstable cars, bad online racing, may be realistic but does not = good racing...

I cant take it anymore. I raced a zilliion laps at N3. Won many races online, pick ups, leagues etc... I cant take N4. I had been waiting for this and now the cars are so unstable and just slide out from under ya without any (or little) warning... Is it just me? I taught I was a decent/good N3 driver...I just cant take N4 and the fact that the cars are so unstable makes for a 1000X more crashes then N3 online racing...No wonder wall riders can do good!!!! I wish the cars were more stable. I wish the pull to the left (stagger) was not in there even if it's the way real cars like this react. I wish the racing would be as good as N3. It's not. I dont think it ever will be. I wish it had a chase view like N3 (far chase) I wish I had as much fun with N4 than N3. I don't I am sad. Am I alone? Claude [email hidden]

I've had excellent on-line racing with N4.

there is no more N3 or Heat im my book..N4 rocks in muliplayer!..you just gotta get better is all.

>"Claude" <[email hidden]> wrote > I wish the cars were more stable. Racing is difficult. -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.ymenard.com/ -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez Corporation - helping America into the New World...

> -- > -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> > -- May the Downforce be with you... > -- http://www.ymenard.com/ > -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez > Corporation - helping America into the New World... Snuh?? -- Fester

N3 was based on a pretty simple physics model. NASCAR 4 is based on the Grand Prix Legends physics model. I have had some of the best online racing of my life in N4 with GPL drivers, I think it's a tradeoff between "stability" and depth. You just have to put in the time to learn how cars behave at speed. Yes it sucks that all the time spent on N3 won't help you in N4 but if you learn N4 or GPL any decent sim of the future will have a VERY short learning curve. Papy marketed N3 as a Sim but it really wasn't close to the realism most of us GPLers would consider necessary for that title. > I wish the racing would be as good as N3. It's not. I dont think it > ever will be. It will be better. Once you learn how to drive these cars you will have a much better time. If not there is always the arcade mode and the <easy> setups to make things a bit easier(and get rid of the pull). Practice is the only way to go faster. "Claude" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> I cant take it anymore. > > I raced a zilliion laps at N3. Won many races online, pick ups, > leagues etc... > > I cant take N4. I had been waiting for this and now the cars are so > unstable and just slide out from under ya without any (or little) > warning... > > Is it just me? I taught I was a decent/good N3 driver...I just cant > take N4 and the fact that the cars are so unstable makes for a 1000X > more crashes then N3 online racing...No wonder wall riders can do > good!!!! > > I wish the cars were more stable. > > I wish the pull to the left (stagger) was not in there even if it's > the way real cars like this react. > > I wish the racing would be as good as N3. It's not. I dont think it > ever will be. > > I wish it had a chase view like N3 (far chase) > > I wish I had as much fun with N4 than N3. I don't > > I am sad. Am I alone? > > Claude > [email hidden]

i've been waiting for this to start. lol! <G> Kirk House <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:987796$2ep$[email hidden]... > N3 was based on a pretty simple physics model. NASCAR 4 is based on the > Grand Prix Legends physics model. I have had some of the best onlineracing > of my life in N4 with GPL drivers, I think it's a tradeoff between > "stability" and depth. You just have to put in the time to learn how cars > behave at speed. Yes it sucks that all the time spent on N3 won't helpyou > in N4 but if you learn N4 or GPL any decent sim of the future will have a > VERY short learning curve. > Papy marketed N3 as a Sim but it really wasn't close to the realismmost

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> of us GPLers would consider necessary for that title. > > > I wish the racing would be as good as N3. It's not. I dont think it > > ever will be. > > It will be better. Once you learn how to drive these cars you will have a > much better time. If not there is always the arcade mode and the <easy> > setups to make things a bit easier(and get rid of the pull). > > Practice is the only way to go faster. > > > > "Claude" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > I cant take it anymore. > > > > I raced a zilliion laps at N3. Won many races online, pick ups, > > leagues etc... > > > > I cant take N4. I had been waiting for this and now the cars are so > > unstable and just slide out from under ya without any (or little) > > warning... > > > > Is it just me? I taught I was a decent/good N3 driver...I just cant > > take N4 and the fact that the cars are so unstable makes for a 1000X > > more crashes then N3 online racing...No wonder wall riders can do > > good!!!! > > > > I wish the cars were more stable. > > > > I wish the pull to the left (stagger) was not in there even if it's > > the way real cars like this react. > > > > I wish the racing would be as good as N3. It's not. I dont think it > > ever will be. > > > > I wish it had a chase view like N3 (far chase) > > > > I wish I had as much fun with N4 than N3. I don't > > > > I am sad. Am I alone? > > > > Claude > > [email hidden] > >

N4 is easier in a way really cause you can controll the car much better and its much easier to predict what your control inputs will do since its more realistic. "Kirk House" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:987796$2ep$[email hidden]... > N3 was based on a pretty simple physics model. NASCAR 4 is based on the > Grand Prix Legends physics model. I have had some of the best onlineracing > of my life in N4 with GPL drivers, I think it's a tradeoff between > "stability" and depth. You just have to put in the time to learn how cars > behave at speed. Yes it sucks that all the time spent on N3 won't helpyou > in N4 but if you learn N4 or GPL any decent sim of the future will have a > VERY short learning curve. > Papy marketed N3 as a Sim but it really wasn't close to the realismmost

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> of us GPLers would consider necessary for that title. > > > I wish the racing would be as good as N3. It's not. I dont think it > > ever will be. > > It will be better. Once you learn how to drive these cars you will have a > much better time. If not there is always the arcade mode and the <easy> > setups to make things a bit easier(and get rid of the pull). > > Practice is the only way to go faster. > > > > "Claude" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > I cant take it anymore. > > > > I raced a zilliion laps at N3. Won many races online, pick ups, > > leagues etc... > > > > I cant take N4. I had been waiting for this and now the cars are so > > unstable and just slide out from under ya without any (or little) > > warning... > > > > Is it just me? I taught I was a decent/good N3 driver...I just cant > > take N4 and the fact that the cars are so unstable makes for a 1000X > > more crashes then N3 online racing...No wonder wall riders can do > > good!!!! > > > > I wish the cars were more stable. > > > > I wish the pull to the left (stagger) was not in there even if it's > > the way real cars like this react. > > > > I wish the racing would be as good as N3. It's not. I dont think it > > ever will be. > > > > I wish it had a chase view like N3 (far chase) > > > > I wish I had as much fun with N4 than N3. I don't > > > > I am sad. Am I alone? > > > > Claude > > [email hidden] > >

"Claude" <[email hidden]> ha scritto nel messaggio news:[email hidden]...

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> I cant take it anymore. > > I raced a zilliion laps at N3. Won many races online, pick ups, > leagues etc... > > I cant take N4. I had been waiting for this and now the cars are so > unstable and just slide out from under ya without any (or little) > warning... > > Is it just me? I taught I was a decent/good N3 driver...I just cant > take N4 and the fact that the cars are so unstable makes for a 1000X > more crashes then N3 online racing...No wonder wall riders can do > good!!!! > > I wish the cars were more stable. > > I wish the pull to the left (stagger) was not in there even if it's > the way real cars like this react. > > I wish the racing would be as good as N3. It's not. I dont think it > ever will be. > > I wish it had a chase view like N3 (far chase) > > I wish I had as much fun with N4 than N3. I don't > > I am sad. Am I alone? > > Claude > [email hidden]

Have you ever played GPL instead of Nascar 1,2,3? :)) Bye

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>"Uncle Fester" <[email hidden]> wrote > > -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> > > -- May the Downforce be with you... > > -- http://www.ymenard.com/ > > -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez > > Corporation - helping America into the New World... > > > Snuh??

Buh? (new .signature file, got tired after 3years of the old one. It's a movie quote)

"ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:4fQp6.359591$[email hidden]...

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> >"Uncle Fester" <[email hidden]> wrote > > > -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> > > > -- May the Downforce be with you... > > > -- http://www.ymenard.com/ > > > -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez > > > Corporation - helping America into the New World... > > > > > > Snuh?? > > Buh?

Wah?

Claude wrote:

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> I cant take it anymore. > > I raced a zilliion laps at N3. Won many races online, pick ups, > leagues etc... > > I cant take N4. I had been waiting for this and now the cars are so > unstable and just slide out from under ya without any (or little) > warning... > > Is it just me? I taught I was a decent/good N3 driver...I just cant > take N4 and the fact that the cars are so unstable makes for a 1000X > more crashes then N3 online racing...No wonder wall riders can do > good!!!! > I wish the cars were more stable. > I wish the pull to the left (stagger) was not in there even if it's > the way real cars like this react. > I wish the racing would be as good as N3. It's not. I dont think it > ever will be. > I wish it had a chase view like N3 (far chase) > I wish I had as much fun with N4 than N3. I don't > I am sad. Am I alone? > > Claude > [email hidden]

Coming from GPL, I have a hard time coping with the vague, wallowing default setups that come with N4. (At least at the few tracks I've run.) For beter or worse, my N4 setups seem to gravitate toward a GPL-like feel: firm (not quite stiff) springs, medium+ dampers, soft to medium roll bars. The resulting setups may not be near the absolute fastest, but I can relate to them and drive them closer to the limit w/o getting bitten. IMO, you need to look around for some stiffer, better damped setups. I'm afraid you're going to have to live with the leftward pull. You can reduce it by setting more symetric camber/caster/stagger, but it will cost you significant cornering speed (and control). Get Viper Racing. It's a forgiving yet challenging intro to N4-like physics. Like Kirk says, find a league to join. Enter the beginner class, share setups, ask questions and PRACTICE! $0.02 -Greg

On Thu, 08 Mar 2001 16:11:25 GMT, "Ronnie Bigwhip" <[email hidden]> wrote: > N4 is easier in a way really cause you can controll the car much better and >its much easier to predict what your control inputs will do since its more >realistic. Exactly what I was going to say. I actually had a hard time playing N3 after playing GPL and Viper because the N3 cars lack of body roll felt very wrong. It's weird, but even some sim/action games like Porsche Unleashed and SCGT (w/advanced options editor) felt better to me. Having that roll axis is critical. Tim

Another prediction of mine come true....N3 degaheads will HATE N4. look it up. I suspect we will see some N4 backlash from those who learned simracing with N99/N3. Greatest single feature in N4 for online play is the FORCED COCKPIT....I love to see the tailgunners whine about NOT BEING ABLE TO SEE....guess everyone else drives with the Braille method. Get rid of the Pull, get rid of the forced cockpit, get rid of the physics...and what do you have? N3....Get over it. dave henrie "Matteo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:bTPp6.19234$[email hidden]... > > "Claude" <[email hidden]> ha scritto nel messaggio > news:[email hidden]... > > I cant take it anymore.

Play GPL for a couple of weeks, then try N4 again. I found it pretty easy after being initiated by fire....:) -Phasor "Claude" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> I cant take it anymore. > > I raced a zilliion laps at N3. Won many races online, pick ups, > leagues etc... > > I cant take N4. I had been waiting for this and now the cars are so > unstable and just slide out from under ya without any (or little) > warning... > > Is it just me? I taught I was a decent/good N3 driver...I just cant > take N4 and the fact that the cars are so unstable makes for a 1000X > more crashes then N3 online racing...No wonder wall riders can do > good!!!! > > I wish the cars were more stable. > > I wish the pull to the left (stagger) was not in there even if it's > the way real cars like this react. > > I wish the racing would be as good as N3. It's not. I dont think it > ever will be. > > I wish it had a chase view like N3 (far chase) > > I wish I had as much fun with N4 than N3. I don't > > I am sad. Am I alone? > > Claude > [email hidden]

ymenard wrote:

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> > >"Uncle Fester" <[email hidden]> wrote > > > -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> > > > -- May the Downforce be with you... > > > -- http://www.ymenard.com/ > > > -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez > > > Corporation - helping America into the New World... > > > > > > Snuh?? > > Buh? > > (new .signature file, got tired after 3years of the old one. It's a movie > quote)

OK, you *are* the super genius. You got exactly what it was I was getting at. -- Fester

Well said! so far the only thing I miss from N3 is all the short tracks from the BGN/Truck tracks On Fri, 09 Mar 2001 00:16:29 GMT, "Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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> Another prediction of mine come true....N3 degaheads will HATE N4. look >it up. >I suspect we will see some N4 backlash from those who learned simracing with >N99/N3. > Greatest single feature in N4 for online play is the FORCED COCKPIT....I >love >to see the tailgunners whine about NOT BEING ABLE TO SEE....guess everyone >else >drives with the Braille method. > Get rid of the Pull, get rid of the forced cockpit, get rid of the >physics...and what do you >have? N3....Get over it. >dave henrie

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Claude wrote... > I cant take it anymore. > > I raced a zilliion laps at N3. Won many races online, > pick ups, leagues etc... Judging from the rest of your post that speaks volumes about the game. > I cant take N4. I had been waiting for this and now the > cars are so unstable and just slide out from under ya > without any (or little) warning... On the contrary... N4 is the first game in the series where I can tell where the car is going without nescessarily having to look. > Is it just me? I taught I was a decent/good N3 driver... You probably still are... won't help you much unfortunately. > I just cant take N4 and the fact that the cars are so > unstable makes for a 1000X more crashes then N3 online > racing...No wonder wall riders can do good!!!! The why don't you guys start showing the cars a little more respect and learn to take it easy with the loud pedal. If you can't keep it pointing the right way down the track: SLOW DOWN!! > I wish the cars were more stable. A car on the edge of traction will always be unstable <bad Scotty accent>Ya cannit chainge the lows of physics"</bad Scotty accent>. More physics means less liberties... i.e. the need to drive the cars properly becomes more acute. Try a similarly scary amount of power on bias ply, threaded tyres in a 1000lbs chassis sometime and learn to be thankfull for the inertia 3000lbs of dry weight provides. Not to mention the effect of modern racing slicks and chassis aerodynamics. > I wish the pull to the left (stagger) was not in there > even if it's the way real cars like this react. Didn't even notice it anymore after about 3 hours with the game. Look at the track, not the wheel. > I wish the racing would be as good as N3. It's not. I > dont think it ever will be. Needs time... I bet the early days with N3 weren't that great either when people were inexperienced and didn't have their connections sorted. You've got a lot of people "having a go" now... they won't stick around and only those who can competently drive the tracks and have good connections will remain over time. > I wish it had a chase view like N3 (far chase) Hmmm... I guess a case can be argued, lack of peripheral vision and what have you. Then again... the real guys have their head strapped down, don't they? So even the look buttons in cockpit view could be considered "unrealistic".<g> All I can say is... one gets used to it. Sound is a big clue. > I wish I had as much fun with N4 than N3. I don't Put in the effort, get the reward. Try ReVolt for instant fun. > I am sad. Am I alone? Don't know... depends who you choose to identify yourself with. Bottom line... Papyrus created a game for us to practise getting to grips with this new simulation technology on (which, apparently, they lost money on) two years ago. More than time enough to get used to it's quirks and sort out any online problems. You being caught behind the times today can hardly be considered to be either their or N4's fault. Jan. =---

Good post Jan. "Jan Verschueren" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> Claude wrote... > > I cant take it anymore. > > > > I raced a zilliion laps at N3. Won many races online, > > pick ups, leagues etc... > > Judging from the rest of your post that speaks volumes about the game. > > > I cant take N4. I had been waiting for this and now the > > cars are so unstable and just slide out from under ya > > without any (or little) warning... > > On the contrary... N4 is the first game in the series where I can tell

where

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> the car is going without nescessarily having to look. > > > Is it just me? I taught I was a decent/good N3 driver... > > You probably still are... won't help you much unfortunately. > > > I just cant take N4 and the fact that the cars are so > > unstable makes for a 1000X more crashes then N3 online > > racing...No wonder wall riders can do good!!!! > > The why don't you guys start showing the cars a little more respect and > learn to take it easy with the loud pedal. If you can't keep it pointing

the > right way down the track: SLOW DOWN!! > > > I wish the cars were more stable. > > A car on the edge of traction will always be unstable <bad Scottyaccent>Ya > cannit chainge the lows of physics"</bad Scotty accent>. More physicsmeans > less liberties... i.e. the need to drive the cars properly becomes more > acute. Try a similarly scary amount of power on bias ply, threaded tyresin > a 1000lbs chassis sometime and learn to be thankfull for the inertia3000lbs

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> of dry weight provides. Not to mention the effect of modern racing slicks > and chassis aerodynamics. > > > I wish the pull to the left (stagger) was not in there > > even if it's the way real cars like this react. > > Didn't even notice it anymore after about 3 hours with the game. Look at

the

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> track, not the wheel. > > > I wish the racing would be as good as N3. It's not. I > > dont think it ever will be. > > Needs time... I bet the early days with N3 weren't that great either when > people were inexperienced and didn't have their connections sorted. You've > got a lot of people "having a go" now... they won't stick around and only > those who can competently drive the tracks and have good connections will > remain over time. > > > I wish it had a chase view like N3 (far chase) > > Hmmm... I guess a case can be argued, lack of peripheral vision and what > have you. Then again... the real guys have their head strapped down, don't > they? So even the look buttons in cockpit view could be considered > "unrealistic".<g> > > All I can say is... one gets used to it. Sound is a big clue. > > > I wish I had as much fun with N4 than N3. I don't > > Put in the effort, get the reward. Try ReVolt for instant fun. > > > I am sad. Am I alone? > > Don't know... depends who you choose to identify yourself with. > > Bottom line... Papyrus created a game for us to practise getting to grips > with this new simulation technology on (which, apparently, they lost money > on) two years ago. More than time enough to get used to it's quirks and

sort > out any online problems. You being caught behind the times today canhardly > be considered to be either their or N4's fault. > > Jan. > =--- > >

> Greatest single feature in N4 for online play is the FORCED COCKPIT....I >love >to see the tailgunners whine about NOT BEING ABLE TO SEE....guess everyone >else >drives with the Braille method. Well, f*ck you too! :) Why should I not be allowed to use my damn Roof-cam view if I'm HORRIBLE in the cockpit? Okay, BEYOND horrible. I'm a hazard! Oh, like it even matters. I can't race online because of the damn copy protection problem requiring me to use a noCD hack! ----------------------------------------- Dan Belcher Team Racing Unlimited http://simcrash.00game.com

In or out...doesn't matter with me...I'm a moving roadblock..nothing more... :) once I crack the top 1000 at the Heat IRF site, I'll wander back to N4.... dave henrie "Dan Belcher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > > Greatest single feature in N4 for online play is the FORCED COCKPIT....I > >love > >to see the tailgunners whine about NOT BEING ABLE TO SEE....guesseveryone > >else > >drives with the Braille method. > > > Well, f*ck you too! :) Why should I not be allowed to use my damnRoof-cam > view if I'm HORRIBLE in the cockpit? Okay, BEYOND horrible. I'm ahazard!

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> > Oh, like it even matters. I can't race online because of the damn copy > protection problem requiring me to use a noCD hack! > > ----------------------------------------- > Dan Belcher > Team Racing Unlimited > http://simcrash.00game.com

"George Lewis" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Well said! > so far the only thing I miss from N3 is all the short tracks from the > BGN/Truck tracks I agree 100 percent. Love the BGN short tracks.

In article <4fQp6.359591$[email hidden]>, "ymenard" <[email hidden]> writes:

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>>"Uncle Fester" <[email hidden]> wrote >> > -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> >> > -- May the Downforce be with you... >> > -- http://www.ymenard.com/ >> > -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez >> > Corporation - helping America into the New World... >> >> >> Snuh?? > >Buh? > > > >(new .signature file, got tired after 3years of the old one. It's a movie >quote) >

Running Man, Robocop, or Starship Troopers? Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL F1 hcp. +28.67...F2 +151.26...F3 hcp. +373.73 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

> >I agree 100 percent. Love the BGN short tracks. > > I'm still pissed that BGN is dropping South Boston, Myrtle Beach, and the Nashville half miler this season! :( Those were three great tracks! ----------------------------------------- Dan Belcher Team Racing Unlimited http://simcrash.00game.com

>"EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote > Running Man, Robocop, or Starship Troopers? Pfffffttt... those aren't movies that are quotable-quality ;) it's only found in the Director's Cut of a version of this movie. Ridley Scott directed it. I'm giving you the answer! -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.ymenard.com/ -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez Corporation - helping America into the New World...

On Fri, 09 Mar 2001 22:57:45 GMT, "ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>>"EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote >> Running Man, Robocop, or Starship Troopers? > > >Pfffffttt... those aren't movies that are quotable-quality ;) it's only >found in the Director's Cut of a version of this movie. Ridley Scott >directed it. I'm giving you the answer!

DAts gotta be Blade Runner.... ~dx

They'll be at Nashville next month, at our gorgeous new super speedway. -- Don Burnette D Burnette in N4 Some people do nothing wrong. The problem is, they do nothing. And THAT is wrong. "Dan Belcher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > > > >I agree 100 percent. Love the BGN short tracks. > > > > > > > I'm still pissed that BGN is dropping South Boston, Myrtle Beach, and the > Nashville half miler this season! :( Those were three great tracks! > > ----------------------------------------- > Dan Belcher > Team Racing Unlimited > http://simcrash.00game.com

Actually, the caster turning the car left makes for a faster car and it's easier to turn. As you probably well know, the speed in the laptimes is achieved in the turns... I found N4 more natural to drive than N1, N2 and N3 put together. The chassis adjustments give you alot of control to change things to make them more your speed. Take the caster out if you like. it won't "turn left" on you. of course, you won't be very fast, but you can't have it all :) The looser the car, the faster it can go! On Thu, 08 Mar 2001 04:51:20 GMT, [email hidden] (Claude) wrote:

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>I cant take it anymore. > >I raced a zilliion laps at N3. Won many races online, pick ups, >leagues etc... > >I cant take N4. I had been waiting for this and now the cars are so >unstable and just slide out from under ya without any (or little) >warning... > >Is it just me? I taught I was a decent/good N3 driver...I just cant >take N4 and the fact that the cars are so unstable makes for a 1000X >more crashes then N3 online racing...No wonder wall riders can do >good!!!! > >I wish the cars were more stable. > >I wish the pull to the left (stagger) was not in there even if it's >the way real cars like this react. > >I wish the racing would be as good as N3. It's not. I dont think it >ever will be. > >I wish it had a chase view like N3 (far chase) > >I wish I had as much fun with N4 than N3. I don't > >I am sad. Am I alone? > >Claude >[email hidden]

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Now if we can just fix the wall-riders and the Martinsville bugs... sigh... hey, at least the cars "turn left" the way they're supposed to :) On Fri, 09 Mar 2001 00:16:29 GMT, "Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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> Another prediction of mine come true....N3 degaheads will HATE N4. look >it up. >I suspect we will see some N4 backlash from those who learned simracing with >N99/N3. > Greatest single feature in N4 for online play is the FORCED COCKPIT....I >love >to see the tailgunners whine about NOT BEING ABLE TO SEE....guess everyone >else >drives with the Braille method. > Get rid of the Pull, get rid of the forced cockpit, get rid of the >physics...and what do you >have? N3....Get over it. >dave henrie >"Matteo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:bTPp6.19234$[email hidden]... >> >> "Claude" <[email hidden]> ha scritto nel messaggio >> news:[email hidden]... >> > I cant take it anymore. > >

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In article <[email hidden]>, daxe <[email hidden]> writes: >>Pfffffttt... those aren't movies that are quotable-quality ;) it's only >>found in the Director's Cut of a version of this movie. Ridley Scott >>directed it. I'm giving you the answer! > > >DAts gotta be Blade Runner.... I never saw it... Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett F1 hcp. +28.67...F2 +151.26... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.