rec.autos.simulators

Hello all,

After installing the 1.02 PATCH, I'm seeing a problem at LongBeach!  As the
AI cars are pulling out of their pit stall and coming down pitroad, they turn
left into the wall on the left side of pitroad and stay on the grass area
where all the trees are between pitroad and the track!  Anyone else seen
this?  It happens every time I race there!  I checked the new LONGBCH.TXT
file and it's the same as the original as far as I can tell but after that I
copied the original LONGBCH.DAT file from the CD and the problem went away.  
This would indicate that the new LONGBCH.DAT file is wacky!  Right?  

Also, after e-mailing Sierra Tech Support to try and find out info on the
PATCH (this was the other day, before I DL'd it from the internet)A guy by
the name of Bob responded to me today and said "the patch hasn't been
released yet".  

OK, now I'm confused!?!?

Sal V.

: After installing the 1.02 PATCH, I'm seeing a problem at LongBeach!  As the
: AI cars are pulling out of their pit stall and coming down pitroad, they turn
: left into the wall on the left side of pitroad and stay on the grass area
: where all the trees are between pitroad and the track!  Anyone else seen
: this?  It happens every time I race there!  I checked the new LONGBCH.TXT
: file and it's the same as the original as far as I can tell but after that I
: copied the original LONGBCH.DAT file from the CD and the problem went away.  
: This would indicate that the new LONGBCH.DAT file is wacky!  Right?  

I am not sure if the problem is in the .dat file or the .txt file.  They
did make a change the .txt file relating to the pits.  You might want to
try loading the patched .dat file and the original 1.00 version of the
.txt file.  If this makes things behave, let us know.

: Also, after e-mailing Sierra Tech Support to try and find out info on the
: PATCH (this was the other day, before I DL'd it from the internet)A guy by
: the name of Bob responded to me today and said "the patch hasn't been
: released yet".  

That's because Sierra hasn't released the patch yet.  It may be that
some employee of Papyrus mistakenly put the patch file in the wrong
directory on Hawaii.  It sorta just leaked out, like the Pentagon Papers
;-)  Well, that's the story and I'm sticking to it!  If you ask me
again, I'll just say I can't recall...
: OK, now I'm confused!?!?

: Sal V.

--
**************************** Michael E. Carver *************************
     Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./.  [-  < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

I too noticed this wacko feature happening.. an AI car was driving on
the grass inbetween the two walls along pits straight and then
proceeded down the straight and hit the corner at the end and bounced
off the wall with no damage.. Oh well, maybe its just a bug at the
beginning.. ??

[snip]

: I too noticed this wacko feature happening.. an AI car was driving on
: the grass inbetween the two walls along pits straight and then
: proceeded down the straight and hit the corner at the end and bounced
: off the wall with no damage.. Oh well, maybe its just a bug at the
: beginning.. ??

Nope the AI can pull this off any time they come out of the pits.  I
think they are trying to avoid the radar guns for pit speed violations
;-)

--
**************************** Michael E. Carver *************************
     Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./.  [-  < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

thanx,

Sal V.

!>
!> >
!> > Hello all,
!> >
!> > After installing the 1.02 PATCH, I'm seeing a problem at LongBeach!  As the
!> > AI cars are pulling out of their pit stall and coming down pitroad, they turn
!> > left into the wall on the left side of pitroad and stay on the grass area
!> > where all the trees are between pitroad and the track!  Anyone else seen
!> > this?  It happens every time I race there!  I checked the new LONGBCH.TXT
!> > file and it's the same as the original as far as I can tell but after that
!> >SNIP....
!> > I didn't explain this correctly!  What I did to get LONGBEACH working
!> correctly was to copy ALL OF THE ORIGINAL LONGBEACH FILES from the CD back
!> into the longbch directory to overwrite what the 1.02 patch had written.  In
!> other words I just put the old 1.0 files back into Longbeach and the AI cars
!> now drive down pitroad correctly.  Meanwhile I don't know what I'll be
!> missing from the 1.02 Longbeach but I guess it'll be traction for one thing.
!>  I don't care after seeing all of the AI cars driving through the grass &
!> trees.  Anyone else seen this or what???
!>
!> thanx,
!>
!> Sal V.

I have not seen Long Beach AI cars DRIVING on the grassy area, but I HAVE seen
them *parked* there, in ICR2 Version 1.0.0.  I have briefly played the 1.0.2
version and seem to remember seeing a lot of cars in the grassy area, but didn't
take the time to investigate.

ken

I have done some checking on the Long Beach longbch.txt file.  The
changes made to this file only seem to relate to the spacing of the cars
on pit road.  It does not seem to have any bearing on the behavior of
the AI cars using the grass between the outside pit walls.  The really
odd (bad) thing about this is the date stamps on the files.  LONGBCH.DAT
was last modified/patched 3/25/96.  The txt file was patched 6/5/96.
For this bug to sit around plainly visible for 3 months and not be
addressed for such a bally-hooed patch is beyond me.  Not only was this
supposed to be a major patch (7 months in the making), it was to be the
next major step in the release of the DOS/Win95/Mac version.

Then again, I guess it wasn't really a major patch since it was only a
move from 1.00 to 1.01!

--
**************************** Michael E. Carver *************************
     Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./.  [-  < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

I'll say it was a major patch- it was the patch that destroyed
Papyrus' and Sierra's reputation for many here. Both the wait for it,
and the realization that apparently  nobody really paid attention
peoples complaints for 8 months at Papyrus. This was a true "patch
job."

It sure seems IndyCar Sim fans lost when Sierra bought Papyrus. The
local software salesman I talk to says that from their point of view,
IndyCar sales amount to almost nothing, and thus we are totally
expendable. NASCAR will probably be given proper attention, because it
is a real seller, for NASCAR racing popularity reasons.

As I see it, the path the history of Papyrus has taken seems to be
this. Papyrus originally intended to make the greatest IndyCar sim,
started with Indy 500 the Sim. They  did moderately well in sales, and
so moved on to ICR, figured out that to really go all the way with the
IndyCar sim, they needed to make a truly saleable product, something
with mass appeal... and came up with NASCAR. That made them secure to
go ahead with their quest, the ultimate  Indy sim, ICR2... finally got
toward the end of that project, and pressure of corporate buyout
began, and the rest is what we see today.

The bottom line seems to me to be that Papyrus was founded on an
indycar dream, and, ironically, got bought out finally because NASCAR
did so amazingly well, and now that Indycar dream gone. But I think we
can be sure NASCAR will be well supported, and if the new
Microsoft-like corporate malaise Sierra has set Papyrus ever relaxes,
Papyrus might indeed finish that "NASCAR2."

On the other hand, it may be in Sierra's best interest to just keep
the copyright on NASCAR and make sure nobody else makes anything
similar, so it can with no effort just continue to collect NASCAR
profits for the next 2 or so years it will be valuable. You see that a
lot in the music buisness; corporate suffocation of bands they sign. I
think they'll definitely do this with IndyCar; they clearly have no
reason to make ICR sims, and they have the legal power to make sure
nobody else makes them. All so they can collect the meager income from
ICR2, squeezing whatever is left in the sponge.

[snip]
: On the other hand, it may be in Sierra's best interest to just keep
: the copyright on NASCAR and make sure nobody else makes anything
: similar, so it can with no effort just continue to collect NASCAR
: profits for the next 2 or so years it will be valuable. You see that a
: lot in the music buisness; corporate suffocation of bands they sign. I
: think they'll definitely do this with IndyCar; they clearly have no
: reason to make ICR sims, and they have the legal power to make sure
: nobody else makes them. All so they can collect the meager income from
: ICR2, squeezing whatever is left in the sponge.

You mean like getting the suckers to fork over $15.00 to "upgrade" to
the something they were promised would be had for free?  It is sad, but
I think alot of what you had to say has merit.  The real core of the
original Papyrus Design Team was Indycar enthusiasts.  The only real
hope we have is that CART can continue to expand their TV market over
the next couple of years.  Just a few years ago NASCAR wasn't as big as
it is now (though it was for me).  NASCAR has made GIANT strides in
marketing itself.  Hopefully CART can take lessons from what NASCAR has
done.  This way Sierra can make their "bean-counter" decisions and
really support their Papyrus Design Team in producing the "dream"
IndyCar simulation.  Of course by then Papyrus may have been Dynamix'ed.

Sierra had better be careful.  Take a look at the F1 simulations coming
out this fall.  They may have a corner on the USA racing sims at the
moment.  But they could very well loose this lead if they don't clean up
their act now.

--
**************************** Michael E. Carver *************************
     Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./.  [-  < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=