rec.autos.simulators

by **Joel Willstei** » Mon, 14 Jun 1999 04:00:00

>Great job Alison! I have to admit I was sceptical at first,
>since I don't usually like low rider setups myself. But
>when I tried your Spa setup I found that yes, you do have
>the rideheight set higher than I did, and yes, it does
>indeed make the car much nicer! I guess I was bouncing off
>the bump ***s and didn't know it. Maybe Papy should have
>included some silly sound to let you know the car is on the
>bump ***s, since a real driver can feel it with his butt.
> Haven't matched my times with my old setup yet, but I think
>once I tweek it to suit my style under acceleration I can
>only get faster, since it already feels much better when
>braking. You can trail brake like crazy with this thing!
>Thanks, Alison. I highly reccomend the new setups to
>anyone!

> -A

You bring up a very good point. Just how to you know if you are hitting
the bump stops? I've gotten so use to low riders,that I've most likely just
got use to my Lotus handling a certain way at each track. But now I've
started to raise the ride height and increase the springs and sway bars a
great deal. The effect is that the car handling is much more controlled
without sudden changes.

Joel Willstein

by **Graeme Nas** » Mon, 14 Jun 1999 04:00:00

I never got on with them. They're excellent setups but I need a lot of
front end and these setups don't have that.

--
Cheers!
Graeme Nash

http://www.karisma1.demon.co.uk
ICQ# 11257824
________________________________________________________________________________
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want"

(Calvin & Hobbes)

by **John Bod** » Mon, 14 Jun 1999 04:00:00

On Sat, 12 Jun 1999 20:02:53 -0400, "Joel Willstein"

>>Damn you, Alison! The Pacers play tonight, and tomorrow's the Texas
>>IRL race -- now that you've given us these new setups, my wife's
>>REALLY going to be ticked at me this weekend! <G>

>>;-)

>>-- JB

>JB,

> Guess I'm really lucky. My wife is going to Atlantic City for the
>weekend. So after work,I'll be checking out Alisons' Ferrari setups till the
>early morning hours.

>Joel Willstein

Turns out I was fairly lucky, too -- the Pacers played so badly that I
just listened while playing with Alison's Ferrari setups! The Pacers
lost, but the Ferrari setups are real winners! <G>

-- JB

by **Joel Willstei** » Mon, 14 Jun 1999 04:00:00

>Joe your either close to me or your wife is making a long trip
>to AC aka Atlantic City!! I live about 40 minutes from "The
>Donald's AC"..lol. I'm not a nite-lifer nor a *** person
>so I havent been to AC since the Steel Pier was there in the
>early 60s! <g> But many love all that gold & glitter because
>its packed most of the time!
>Cheers Thom_j.
>P.S. I hope your wife wins big & then you'll be set for life!

I'm not really that close,as we live on Long Island. If she wins
big,it's a hypersimulator for me :)

Joel Willstein

by **J M Tinne** » Mon, 14 Jun 1999 04:00:00

I have waited for these (Ferrari) set-ups for a long time. I first
'discovered' your work on the BRM set-ups and was (almost) instantly a
success in a car I had until then been very poor in at best. Thanks for all
your hard work! Now, at long last the Ferrari is eminently drivable...

Yes Amon liked the handling of the Ferrari and as you say it was just not
competitive in the straights.

"The Ferrari handled nicely, but we were not very competitive on horsepower,
and the thing was terribly heavy. That was my first season with Ferrari,
and for nearly all of it I was the only driver. I kept telling Mauro
Foghieri that we were slow in a straight line, and it was a long time before
he believed me. That's the trouble with 12-cylinder engines: they make a
lovely loud, powerful noise! But that doesn't mean they are shoving much
out..."

Which fits exactly with what you say in the sidebar of the Advanced Setup
Guide.

Matthew.

> Are you ready for this?

> My new collection of setups for GPL's Ferrari exploits a radical new
> approach to chassis setup which I stumbled upon a few weeks ago. The
> gorgeous red cars from Maranello are stunning: gloriously, sensuously
> responsive, yet forgiving beyond anything I'd imagined possible in GPL.

> At last GPL's Ferrari lives up to Chris Amon's description of the real
> one:

> "That '68 Ferrari was a gorgeous thing to drive...In terms of driving
> pleasure, a fast lap at Spa was a fantastic sensation. Although we were
> down on power...the car was working beautifully. On [my pole] lap, as I
> came down the Masta Straight, after the kink, I caught up to Brian
> Redman, and I can remember going by him on the inside, at the entry to
> Stavelot, with my foot buried right in it, while he was having to brake
> in his Cooper! The thing felt tremendous."

> Here are some comments about my setups and explanation of my new setup
> technique:

> "Your Ferrari article is great! I had never seen Chris Amon's quote
> before--I couldn't believe how good a description it was of the GPL
> Ferrari! [Your new Ferrari] setups do indeed handle better than low
> riders..."

> - Dave Kaemmer

> "I could run comfortable through corners that otherwise gave me a heart
> attack when feeling a bump...With this setup I could accelerate much
> better out of the slow corners; the slides were way easier to
> control....I couldn't believe what I felt and saw....Wonderful, Alison!
> Soooo cool to drive....VERY impressive, it really lead me to rethink my
> setups.

> "Thanks, Alison, for giving me some really new perspectives on setting
> up the cars! :))"

> - Wolfgang Woeger

> "Holy moly! That's the finest setup I've ever driven in GPL, my own
> included. It's as easy to drive as an F2. A keeper. Congratulations."

> - Steve Smith

> Be careful! Reading my Ferrari article and trying my setups may shatter
> some of your most fundamental assumptions about GPL. If you'd rather
> keep thinking about setups the way you always have - if you want to keep
> thinking of GPL as "hard to drive" - read no further.

> Click here only if you dare:

> http://eaglewoman.maximumspeed.com/gpl/

> Go to News, and then Sweet Red Candy.

> Alison

> http://eaglewoman.maximumspeed.com

by Jo » Mon, 14 Jun 1999 04:00:00

> You bring up a very good point. Just how to you know if you are hitting
>the bump stops?

Sounds like something the game needs to produce a semi-*** sound
far, at the very least.

Joe McGinn
==========================================
Staff Writer for the Sports *** Network
http://www.racesimcentral.net/***.com/
==========================================

by **Thom j** » Mon, 14 Jun 1999 04:00:00

Graeme you too? I like all Alison's setups Especially the Hondas
{& Tim Wheatly's are a 'tad' better for me}but I expected these
to be as easily adjustable when I hopped into the***pit as her
other setups! I guess its probably me & I prefer more front'end
myself.. I'll see if I can fine-tune them as I do with Wolf's Lotus
setups... ;O) "O" Well..
Cheers Thom_j.

> >Am I the only one who just cannot get on with any of Alison's setups and
> >have terrible results with all of them?

> I never got on with them. They're excellent setups but I need a lot of
> front end and these setups don't have that.

> --
> Cheers!
> Graeme Nash

> http://www.racesimcentral.net/
> ICQ# 11257824

____________________________________________________________________________
____

by **Ian Hil** » Mon, 14 Jun 1999 04:00:00

>> You bring up a very good point. Just how to you know if you are
hitting
>>the bump stops?

>Sounds like something the game needs to produce a semi-*** sound
>far, at the very least.

How about a comical "boing" sound.

by **Richard G Cleg** » Tue, 15 Jun 1999 04:00:00

: Am I the only one who just cannot get on with any of Alison's setups and
: have terrible results with all of them? Don't get me wrong. I admire and
: respect all that she had done for a great many people and I'm not trying to
: trash all her hard work, but see nothing in them myself. I have read how
: much more stable they are compared with others, yet for these responses I
: can only read chronic understeer. I'm no rail rider but the barriers at the
: Curva Grande and Lesmos are now pretty well covered in *** deposits. The
: best that I could do at Monza after 25 laps was a 1:33.56 compared with my
: own setup returning 1:28.90. I found the same thing with the Cooper and
: Brabham setups where I average 3 to 4 seconds faster.

Monza is the wrong place to try the cooper set ups - you're never
going to be fast in the Cooper at Monza anyway. Try the Glen instead
where stability and handling is more important than power.

--
Richard G. Clegg Only the mind is waving
Dept. of Mathematics (Network Control group) Uni. of York.

www: http://www.racesimcentral.net/

by **Marc Collin** » Tue, 15 Jun 1999 04:00:00

You are all heretics!!!!!!!! The real drivers in 1967 had no such sounds
emanating from their beasts. Therefore we cannot have them in our 1999
simulation!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Seriously, I agree that an indicator for the bump stops would be very
helpful, just as several other indicators have been proposed over the past
few months that would have been helpful. They could always be turned off
for those who don't want or need them.

I think these recent threads demonstrate exactly why an indicator would
prevent us from "going astray" and would, in fact, make the simulator itself
more realistic and the enjoyment of the simulator "more realistic."

Also, I hope my sarcastic rant will prevent the real ranters from making the
same point, as they always do, when someone suggests a way to make GPL more
accessible.

Marc.

> >> You bring up a very good point. Just how to you know if you are
> hitting
> >>the bump stops?

> >Sounds like something the game needs to produce a semi-*** sound
> >far, at the very least.

> How about a comical "boing" sound.

by **J M Tinne** » Tue, 15 Jun 1999 04:00:00

At the risk of continuing a pointless rant :)... I have to agree, Sim
developers seem to have created for themselves a 'false purity' that
prevents them from adding simple touches (that could indeed be optionally
disabled) that would increase accessibility in order to make the 'game' more
real. As some guy I saw interviewed on TV who designed Flight Sims for the
RAF said, "If my brief was to make a 100% real simulation at the end of the
day I would have ended up making an aeroplane."

Matthew.

> You are all heretics!!!!!!!! The real drivers in 1967 had no such sounds
> emanating from their beasts. Therefore we cannot have them in our 1999
> simulation!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

> Seriously, I agree that an indicator for the bump stops would be very
> helpful, just as several other indicators have been proposed over the past
> few months that would have been helpful. They could always be turned off
> for those who don't want or need them.

> I think these recent threads demonstrate exactly why an indicator would
> prevent us from "going astray" and would, in fact, make the simulator
itself
> more realistic and the enjoyment of the simulator "more realistic."

> Also, I hope my sarcastic rant will prevent the real ranters from making
the
> same point, as they always do, when someone suggests a way to make GPL
more
> accessible.

> Marc.

> > >> You bring up a very good point. Just how to you know if you are
> > hitting
> > >>the bump stops?

> > >Sounds like something the game needs to produce a semi-*** sound
> > >far, at the very least.

> > How about a comical "boing" sound.

by **Wolfgang Prei** » Tue, 15 Jun 1999 04:00:00

>My new collection of setups for GPL's Ferrari exploits a radical new
>approach to chassis setup which I stumbled upon a few weeks ago. The
>gorgeous red cars from Maranello are stunning: gloriously, sensuously
>responsive, yet forgiving beyond anything I'd imagined possible in GPL.

I am absolutely amazed. And I didn't expect to be, to be honest: your
Coventry setups, which were so fervently applauded here some months
ago didn't do anything for me, since I belong to the "get your braking
done before you steer" school (has also something to do with my
controller - still no split axis). Those setups had way too much
understeer for my liking.

But the Ferrari setups are brilliant! A tad too much mid-corner
understeer, maybe, but otherwise, they really feel like cheating. :)
No fighting just to stay on the track, no more problems when applying
throttle out of slow corners, braking is much easier, etc. Finally, I
even have a chance to overcome "driver induced oscillations" without
ending up in the wrong direction. And I am much faster than before:
Within a few laps, I egalized my personal best (in the Eagle) in
Monza! With a Ferrari! And was two seconds faster than ever before in
the Ferrari on that track. (I generously attribute one of those
seconds to my improved skills since I last drove the beast from
Maranello, but anyway.)

Randy, is there still time to replace the new default setups in ver
1.1 and use Alison's?

--
Wolfgang Preiss \ E-mail copies of replies to this posting are welcome.

by **Peter Nilss** » Tue, 15 Jun 1999 04:00:00

>> You bring up a very good point. Just how to you know if you are hitting
>>the bump stops?

>Sounds like something the game needs to produce a semi-*** sound
>far, at the very least.

>Joe McGinn
>==========================================
>Staff Writer for the Sports *** Network
>http://www.racesimcentral.net/***.com/
>==========================================

I'd like to hear the crunching sound of molars being smashed to pieces
when you hit the bump stops. :-)

/petern

by **Neil Rain** » Thu, 17 Jun 1999 04:00:00

I don't mean to be churlish about these new setups, but it does seem a
bit odd to me that, even if there is no tell-tale sign for us to know
when we've hit the bump-stops, that Alison, as a member of the Papy beta
testing team, didn't have access to some sort of debugging version of
the program so that she could tell whether this (and other unwanted
effects) was happening.

After all, when testing the physics model they must have produced this
kind of data just to check that it was behaving more or less how they
expected.

It's a bit late now to say that their setups have been screwed up from
the beginning!

Maybe they were just having fun watching everyone struggling in online
races, guffawing to themselves...

Seriously, though, it does show that it's just as important for them to
tune the default setups as it is to tune the actual physics model
itself.

by **Joel Willstei** » Thu, 17 Jun 1999 04:00:00

>>> You bring up a very good point. Just how to you know if you are
hitting
>>>the bump stops?

>>Sounds like something the game needs to produce a semi-*** sound
>>far, at the very least.

>>Joe McGinn
>>==========================================
>>Staff Writer for the Sports *** Network
>>http://www.racesimcentral.net/***.com/

This certainly is one of the big drawbacks of sim racing in general. You
really can't feel what the car is doing,when it's doing it. We assume,and
that's the problem,other than reading and evaluating tire temps. Alison Hine
figured out the latest method of setups based on more than a year of driving
GPL,and in the process,spending most likely 1000s of hours.

And the direction of sims now is to increase the amount of options that
we have to play with. While in reality,the vast majority of sim
racers,search for setups to download and modify the best they can. In other
words,most of us,can't setup a car.

Joel Willsten

rec.autos.simulators

New! Sweet Red Candy: Alison's Ferrari setups

New! Sweet Red Candy: Alison's Ferrari setups

New! Sweet Red Candy: Alison's Ferrari setups

New! Sweet Red Candy: Alison's Ferrari setups

New! Sweet Red Candy: Alison's Ferrari setups

New! Sweet Red Candy: Alison's Ferrari setups

New! Sweet Red Candy: Alison's Ferrari setups

New! Sweet Red Candy: Alison's Ferrari setups

New! Sweet Red Candy: Alison's Ferrari setups

New! Sweet Red Candy: Alison's Ferrari setups

New! Sweet Red Candy: Alison's Ferrari setups

New! Sweet Red Candy: Alison's Ferrari setups

New! Sweet Red Candy: Alison's Ferrari setups

New! Sweet Red Candy: Alison's Ferrari setups

New! Sweet Red Candy: Alison's Ferrari setups

New! Sweet Red Candy: Alison's Ferrari setups