rec.autos.simulators

Some GrandPrix3 News

MIlic102

Some GrandPrix3 News

by MIlic102 » Tue, 15 Dec 1998 04:00:00

Taken from www.gp2.com

A guy from the Microprose GP3 crew has told some things of the new F1
simulation. The fact is that GP3 exist, but Microprose won't make it official
because Geoff doesn't want it. He was pissed off during the GP2 developement
due to enormous pressure from the press. He wanted to finish the game by
enhancing the crashes which took extra eight months.

Some GP3 features:
- Official FIA season 1997 license including all teams, drivers and rules
(without tobacco adverts, of course)
- Jump starts
- Pitlane speeding
- Safety car
- Formation lap
- Voodoo 2 support
- Force feedback support
- 22 player network support
- Changeable weather conditions
- Car editor and paint program

A working beta version of the game exists, but at this point they won't show it
to anyone (PC Gamer mag and others will have to wait). The estimated release
date is September 1999.

Zonk

Some GrandPrix3 News

by Zonk » Tue, 15 Dec 1998 04:00:00


>Path:
>Taken from www.gp2.com

>A guy from the Microprose GP3 crew has told some things of the new F1
>simulation. The fact is that GP3 exist, but Microprose won't make it official
>because Geoff doesn't want it. He was pissed off during the GP2 developement
>due to enormous pressure from the press. He wanted to finish the game by
>enhancing the crashes which took extra eight months.

>Some GP3 features:
>- Official FIA season 1997 license including all teams, drivers and rules
>(without tobacco adverts, of course)
>- Jump starts
>- Pitlane speeding
>- Safety car
>- Formation lap
>- Voodoo 2 support
>- Force feedback support
>- 22 player network support
>- Changeable weather conditions
>- Car editor and paint program

Not quite the tale i've been reading, which is that the Car models are in
place- but they lack (so far) the F1 license to show them to a third party.

Can't help but think that by the time they get the thing published, 1997 will
be so horrificly out of date......

i'm a bit dubious about the feature list, however. "Voodoo2 support?" are we
to take it it's native glide? Not Opengl or D3D? oh dear... for a game that's
shipping late next year......

I'm thinking (hoping?) your feature list is just pure speculation, which one
would hope. Especially, as the feature list reads a lot like MGPRS2.

Z.

Ruud van Ec

Some GrandPrix3 News

by Ruud van Ec » Tue, 15 Dec 1998 04:00:00



> >Path:
> >Taken from www.gp2.com

> >A guy from the Microprose GP3 crew has told some things of the new F1
> >simulation. The fact is that GP3 exist, but Microprose won't make it official
> >because Geoff doesn't want it. He was pissed off during the GP2 developement
> >due to enormous pressure from the press. He wanted to finish the game by
> >enhancing the crashes which took extra eight months.

> >Some GP3 features:
> >- Official FIA season 1997 license including all teams, drivers and rules
> >(without tobacco adverts, of course)
> >- Jump starts
> >- Pitlane speeding
> >- Safety car
> >- Formation lap
> >- Voodoo 2 support
> >- Force feedback support
> >- 22 player network support
> >- Changeable weather conditions
> >- Car editor and paint program

> Not quite the tale i've been reading, which is that the Car models are in
> place- but they lack (so far) the F1 license to show them to a third party.

> Can't help but think that by the time they get the thing published, 1997 will
> be so horrificly out of date......

> i'm a bit dubious about the feature list, however. "Voodoo2 support?" are we
> to take it it's native glide? Not Opengl or D3D? oh dear... for a game that's
> shipping late next year......

> I'm thinking (hoping?) your feature list is just pure speculation, which one
> would hope. Especially, as the feature list reads a lot like MGPRS2.

> Z.

I'm sure GP3 will outrule ALL F1 Sims/games as did GP2 (well sofar there was any at that time!!)
--
      Greetings :)RuuD?      
+------------------------------+

J M. Hort

Some GrandPrix3 News

by J M. Hort » Tue, 15 Dec 1998 04:00:00


If this late surely they will try for the 1999 licence!

Matthew
     ###########################
    |#|     [~~~~   #########
    | |_[]__[_    [~~~~~~~~] [~~~~~~
   |  ------ ]  ] [http://rrtii.future.easyspace.com
   |  ------ ]  ] [http://dspace.dial.pipex.com/urc.yorkshire/index.htm
   { ------- ]__] [http://www.NetcomUK.co.uk/~jmhorton/index.html
  _|____________]-[________]-[______
 /_o o  O O  o o   o o  o o    o o

Martin Urs

Some GrandPrix3 News

by Martin Urs » Wed, 16 Dec 1998 04:00:00


        If this is true, then I'd estimate the addition of rain would
have taken two years!

        And I thought simulating '94 for a '96 release was bad, what
with the differences in engine size and downforce...  But now we'll
have to drive wide-track, slick-shod F1 cars in late-1999?  

        Maybe Geoff Crammond's taken a page from Papyrus and decided
to simulate "historical" F1!  :-)

Martin
Nigel Mansell RIP!

Robin Lor

Some GrandPrix3 News

by Robin Lor » Wed, 16 Dec 1998 04:00:00

simulating the 94 season was good 'cause we got to drive the un-butchered
version of imola! :o)

--

Robin.

http://www.oppositelock.freeserve.co.uk

Nurburgring and Grand Prix Legends

Remove nospam from e-mail address to reply



>>due to enormous pressure from the press. He wanted to finish the game by
>>enhancing the crashes which took extra eight months.

> If this is true, then I'd estimate the addition of rain would
>have taken two years!

>>- Official FIA season 1997 license including all teams, drivers and rules

> And I thought simulating '94 for a '96 release was bad, what
>with the differences in engine size and downforce...  But now we'll
>have to drive wide-track, slick-shod F1 cars in late-1999?

> Maybe Geoff Crammond's taken a page from Papyrus and decided
>to simulate "historical" F1!  :-)

>Martin
>Nigel Mansell RIP!

Iain Mackenzi

Some GrandPrix3 News

by Iain Mackenzi » Fri, 18 Dec 1998 04:00:00

What is it that we want from GP3 that MGPRS2 doesn't have?
Iain



>>Path:
>>Taken from www.gp2.com

>>A guy from the Microprose GP3 crew has told some things of the new F1
>>simulation. The fact is that GP3 exist, but Microprose won't make it
official
>>because Geoff doesn't want it. He was pissed off during the GP2
developement
>>due to enormous pressure from the press. He wanted to finish the game by
>>enhancing the crashes which took extra eight months.

>>Some GP3 features:
>>- Official FIA season 1997 license including all teams, drivers and rules
>>(without tobacco adverts, of course)
>>- Jump starts
>>- Pitlane speeding
>>- Safety car
>>- Formation lap
>>- Voodoo 2 support
>>- Force feedback support
>>- 22 player network support
>>- Changeable weather conditions
>>- Car editor and paint program

>Not quite the tale i've been reading, which is that the Car models are in
>place- but they lack (so far) the F1 license to show them to a third party.

>Can't help but think that by the time they get the thing published, 1997
will
>be so horrificly out of date......

>i'm a bit dubious about the feature list, however. "Voodoo2 support?" are
we
>to take it it's native glide? Not Opengl or D3D? oh dear... for a game
that's
>shipping late next year......

>I'm thinking (hoping?) your feature list is just pure speculation, which
one
>would hope. Especially, as the feature list reads a lot like MGPRS2.

>Z.

Tadej Krev

Some GrandPrix3 News

by Tadej Krev » Fri, 18 Dec 1998 04:00:00

Hehe,
what we simracers want from a sim that ships after GPL is the same or better
physics model,
excellent graphics, variable weather (not just plain rain, but also puddles,
streams of water
over the track, track drying out faster on the racing line and slower in
shades), team
management :o), full TCP/IP,IPX support, maybe some innovative method for slow
internet connections (better extrapolating to reduce warping), I remember
Christer Andersson worked on that a while ago. We don't want a game (sorry, but
it feels like it after playing
GPL for few weeks) like MGPRS2 or GP2 (GP2 was the best in it's time, but it's
time is gone,
sorry) we want simulation.

    That's why I seriously doubt GP3 will be such a big success as GP2, because
one man just
can't do all the work for himself.

What I'd like to see is that Geoff would start working at Papyrus, and started
making GP3 with already developed great GPL physics.

If the physics remains the same in GP3 as it is in GP2, then I just don't think
it will be worth buying.
(we already have Ubisoft's games for that ;o)

Tadej Krevh
// 1.26.91 at Silverstone GPL


> What is it that we want from GP3 that MGPRS2 doesn't have?
> Iain


Richard G Cleg

Some GrandPrix3 News

by Richard G Cleg » Fri, 18 Dec 1998 04:00:00

: Hehe,
: what we simracers want from a sim that ships after GPL is the same or better
: physics model...  <snippage>

  Hmm...  not what I would want from a "next" sim - I'm already put off
GPL by the "too hard" and the high systems requirements.  I'll probably
buy it when the price comes down.  What I'd like to see is more
attention spent on the "non-driver" figures.  

  From what I've seen in GPL, the bit that is maximally unrealistic is
the set-ups.  No driver would work on all that himself without advice.
To me it would be really important for realism in a sim to have pit
figures who would say "Hmm... looks a bit loose at the front, could we
change some of these springs."  

  For me, GP2 was realistic enough on-track (although I'm sure there is
room for improvement and I'm sure GPL provides some of that improvement)
but off-track it became totally unrealistic.  No driver climbs out of
his car and says "inflate the left front by 10% and stiffen the off-rear
spring by 20".  It's a discussion process with the mechanics, tyre guys
and other crew.  That's where, for me, racing sims really lack realism.
It shouldn't be too hard to build some kind of expert system which can
recognise understeer, oversteer, poorly adjusted dampers or the "wrong"
gear settings.  Also, I don't know about GPL but in GP2 you could make
any number of adjustments to the settings in a practice session.
("OK mechanics, I'd like to try my eighth set of new gear rations in the
warm-up hour - off ya go boys").  Also, once you had a "right" set-up,
it would remain "right" for the next day and the next.  (Unless, of
course it rains).  It's not particularly realistic to arrive at a
race "knowing" you have a precisely correct set up because you've done
1000s of practice hours to obtain them.  Could it be too hard to have
something where varying track temperatures mean that the "ideal" set up
changes a bit.  For me, it would be great to play a sim where you're
told by a "senior engineer" character what to expect from the track and
make guesses towards a better set up in a limited number of laps - with
"expert" help in looking at telemetry etc afterwards (rather than just
having to scroll through it all yourself).  This would make "set up"
a more interesting and vital skill.  At the moment, in most sims I've
seen, set up is a question of driving 1000s of laps to find the optimum
for each course for your style.  In real life you don't have that
opportunity - you have to "know" which way to go and how far after a
limited series of laps and you have to "gamble" on how far you need to
go.

--
Richard G. Clegg     Only the mind is waving
Dept. of Mathematics (Network Control group) Uni. of York.

www: http://manor.york.ac.uk/top.html

Michael E. Carve

Some GrandPrix3 News

by Michael E. Carve » Fri, 18 Dec 1998 04:00:00


<snip>
%     That's why I seriously doubt GP3 will be such a big success as GP2, because
% one man just
% can't do all the work for himself.

I understand from my sources that Geoff has hired a "team" of
programmers to work on the program while his personal team concentrates
on the "simulation" part of the program.  Hopefully we will see a better
optimized release this time around.

<snip>
--
**************************** Michael E. Carver *************************
     Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./.  [-  < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

Dave Bower

Some GrandPrix3 News

by Dave Bower » Fri, 18 Dec 1998 04:00:00



One word - drivability.

--
Dave Bowers

Ronald Stoe

Some GrandPrix3 News

by Ronald Stoe » Sat, 19 Dec 1998 04:00:00




> >What is it that we want from GP3 that MGPRS2 doesn't have?

> One word - drivability.

Eh, yes, I'm smashing into the walls at Monaco, too! All the time... ;^)
Any other complaints?

l8er
ronny

--
How to get rid of censorship in German game releases
<http://www.gamesmania.com/german/maniac/freedom/freedom.htm>

          |\      _,,,---,,_        I want to die like my Grandfather,
   ZZZzz /,`.-'`'    -.  ;-;;,_              in his sleep.
        |,4-  ) )-,_. ,\ (  `'-'     Not like the people in his car,
       '---''(_/--'  `-'\_)            screaming their heads off!

Torgeir Fos

Some GrandPrix3 News

by Torgeir Fos » Sat, 19 Dec 1998 04:00:00

I think I read, some time ago, that a sim was going to have a car setup that
worked just like that.
You specified what you wanted to change about the behavior of the car in a non
technical way and your crew would attempt to adjust your car accordingly.
Maybe it was a rumor about GP3. Let's hope.

TF



> : Hehe,
> : what we simracers want from a sim that ships after GPL is the same or better
> : physics model...  <snippage>

>   Hmm...  not what I would want from a "next" sim - I'm already put off
> GPL by the "too hard" and the high systems requirements.  I'll probably
> buy it when the price comes down.  What I'd like to see is more
> attention spent on the "non-driver" figures.

>   From what I've seen in GPL, the bit that is maximally unrealistic is
> the set-ups.  No driver would work on all that himself without advice.
> To me it would be really important for realism in a sim to have pit
> figures who would say "Hmm... looks a bit loose at the front, could we
> change some of these springs."

>   For me, GP2 was realistic enough on-track (although I'm sure there is
> room for improvement and I'm sure GPL provides some of that improvement)
> but off-track it became totally unrealistic.  No driver climbs out of
> his car and says "inflate the left front by 10% and stiffen the off-rear
> spring by 20".  It's a discussion process with the mechanics, tyre guys
> and other crew.  That's where, for me, racing sims really lack realism.
> It shouldn't be too hard to build some kind of expert system which can
> recognise understeer, oversteer, poorly adjusted dampers or the "wrong"
> gear settings.  Also, I don't know about GPL but in GP2 you could make
> any number of adjustments to the settings in a practice session.
> ("OK mechanics, I'd like to try my eighth set of new gear rations in the
> warm-up hour - off ya go boys").  Also, once you had a "right" set-up,
> it would remain "right" for the next day and the next.  (Unless, of
> course it rains).  It's not particularly realistic to arrive at a
> race "knowing" you have a precisely correct set up because you've done
> 1000s of practice hours to obtain them.  Could it be too hard to have
> something where varying track temperatures mean that the "ideal" set up
> changes a bit.  For me, it would be great to play a sim where you're
> told by a "senior engineer" character what to expect from the track and
> make guesses towards a better set up in a limited number of laps - with
> "expert" help in looking at telemetry etc afterwards (rather than just
> having to scroll through it all yourself).  This would make "set up"
> a more interesting and vital skill.  At the moment, in most sims I've
> seen, set up is a question of driving 1000s of laps to find the optimum
> for each course for your style.  In real life you don't have that
> opportunity - you have to "know" which way to go and how far after a
> limited series of laps and you have to "gamble" on how far you need to
> go.

> --
> Richard G. Clegg     Only the mind is waving
> Dept. of Mathematics (Network Control group) Uni. of York.

> www: http://manor.york.ac.uk/top.html

Richard G Cleg

Some GrandPrix3 News

by Richard G Cleg » Sat, 19 Dec 1998 04:00:00

: I think I read, some time ago, that a sim was going to have a car setup that
: worked just like that.
: You specified what you wanted to change about the behavior of the car in
: a non-technical way and your crew would attempt to adjust your car
: accordingly. Maybe it was a rumor about GP3. Let's hope.

  That would be really excellent.  Perhaps "non-technical" is too
strong - but some guidance and suggestions.  The current sims where the
player is driver, pit crew, telemetry guy, chief mechanic and
aerodynamicist are a little.... unrealistic.  I'm sure that no current
racing team sets gear ratios by peering at telemetry and saying "how
long are we in each gear... hmm... that trace in third looks a little
long."  At the very least, they know what % of time you've been in each
gear and whether, at that part of the gear you are getting good
acceleration.

  Maybe in a sim like GPL, an awful lot more of the set-up was down to
the driver...  (in the absence of telemetry)...  but I'm willing to bet
that there was a lot of expert help and mechanics/engineers spotting
drivers understeer/oversteer or tell-tale worn patches on springs/engine
parts indicating particular set up problems.

--
Richard G. Clegg     Only the mind is waving
Dept. of Mathematics (Network Control group) Uni. of York.

www: http://manor.york.ac.uk/top.html

Jo Hels

Some GrandPrix3 News

by Jo Hels » Sat, 19 Dec 1998 04:00:00



><snip>
>%     That's why I seriously doubt GP3 will be such a big success as GP2, because
>% one man just
>% can't do all the work for himself.

>I understand from my sources that Geoff has hired a "team" of
>programmers to work on the program while his personal team concentrates
>on the "simulation" part of the program.  Hopefully we will see a better
>optimized release this time around.

What about sucking a screenshot out of your sources? Wouldn't that be a great
Xmass present? <G>

JoH
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