rec.autos.simulators

by **Haqsa** » Tue, 20 Nov 2001 08:30:20

I noticed at the Atlanta race today that they started to run real well
on a high line later in the race. I remember some co-workers of mine,
who used to work with the race teams, telling me that that was not
uncommon on speedways - if they can gradually clean the marbles off and
lay enough fresh *** down, the higher line gives them higher
straightaway speeds. You could really see this today when Labonte was
trying to pass Dale Jr. Labonte, taking a low line, would nearly catch
Jr. on the turns, but Jr.'s high line allowed him to come out of the
turn faster and Labonte couldn't get by him until he got an aero push
from Nadeau. I haven't really noticed this working in N4 or NH. It
seems like they have a little more grip in the groove, and it stays that
way throughout the race. But then again I haven't tried any really long
races, so maybe that feature is there and I just haven't stayed in long
enough to see it. Does anyone know if N4 or NH has this kind of
dynamically changing track condition? If not, I think that would be a
great thing to have in N5.

by **Philste** » Tue, 20 Nov 2001 13:09:27

I was going to comment on the exact same thing. I experimented with the
line tonight in our online league and found out that it depends on how
the cars are setup. With a loose car, I found you needed to run the high
line. Cars on the low and high grooves were pretty equal in the early
going but the cars didn't run that "Darlington" line.

One other thing: pit crew with hockey helmets: I thought they were
promoting the NHL or some thing! I guess it's new way to add to the
dorkiness factor.

> I noticed at the Atlanta race today that they started to run real well
> on a high line later in the race. I remember some co-workers of mine,
> who used to work with the race teams, telling me that that was not
> uncommon on speedways - if they can gradually clean the marbles off and
> lay enough fresh *** down, the higher line gives them higher
> straightaway speeds. You could really see this today when Labonte was
> trying to pass Dale Jr. Labonte, taking a low line, would nearly catch
> Jr. on the turns, but Jr.'s high line allowed him to come out of the
> turn faster and Labonte couldn't get by him until he got an aero push
> from Nadeau. I haven't really noticed this working in N4 or NH. It
> seems like they have a little more grip in the groove, and it stays that
> way throughout the race. But then again I haven't tried any really long
> races, so maybe that feature is there and I just haven't stayed in long
> enough to see it. Does anyone know if N4 or NH has this kind of
> dynamically changing track condition? If not, I think that would be a
> great thing to have in N5.

--
Philippe "Philster" Sergerie

by **Gerald Moo** » Wed, 21 Nov 2001 00:12:50

I don't think the groove ever changes in N4. I agree a dynamic track
surface would make an excellent addition to any racing simulator. Of
course, in your typical 20-40 lap sprint you get online, all this
would be wasted.

Gerald

> I noticed at the Atlanta race today that they started to run real well
> on a high line later in the race. I remember some co-workers of mine,
> who used to work with the race teams, telling me that that was not
> uncommon on speedways - if they can gradually clean the marbles off and
> lay enough fresh *** down, the higher line gives them higher
> straightaway speeds. You could really see this today when Labonte was
> trying to pass Dale Jr. Labonte, taking a low line, would nearly catch
> Jr. on the turns, but Jr.'s high line allowed him to come out of the
> turn faster and Labonte couldn't get by him until he got an aero push
> from Nadeau. I haven't really noticed this working in N4 or NH. It
> seems like they have a little more grip in the groove, and it stays that
> way throughout the race. But then again I haven't tried any really long
> races, so maybe that feature is there and I just haven't stayed in long
> enough to see it. Does anyone know if N4 or NH has this kind of
> dynamically changing track condition? If not, I think that would be a
> great thing to have in N5.

by **Eldre** » Thu, 22 Nov 2001 00:23:40

>One other thing: pit crew with hockey helmets: I thought they were
>promoting the NHL or some thing! I guess it's new way to add to the
>dorkiness factor.

Given the incident at the last race, I'm glad they had SOME headgear. But DAMN
- couldn't they afford *real* helments??? Sad...

Eldred
--
Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
GPLRank - under construction...

Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

by **Eldre** » Thu, 22 Nov 2001 00:23:39

How many people would even RUN a full-length race in N4?

Eldred
--
Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
GPLRank - under construction...

Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

by **Haqsa** » Thu, 22 Nov 2001 07:35:41

I like the feature that ISI puts in its games which allows you to
increase fuel usage and tire wear so that you can cause pitstops even in
short races. A similar feature could be used to accelerate the build up
of *** on the track.

> I don't think the groove ever changes in N4. I agree a dynamic track
> surface would make an excellent addition to any racing simulator. Of
> course, in your typical 20-40 lap sprint you get online, all this
> would be wasted.

> Gerald

by **Haqsa** » Thu, 22 Nov 2001 07:47:00

I kind of thought it would take a different setup. Not so much because
of the higher line in the corner itself, but more because you are
hitting the transition from the low bank of the straight to the higher
bank of the corner a lot harder when you take the high line. From what
I've seen in real world races, when the drivers are running a low line
they turn in before the track starts climbing up so that they cross the
transition at the lowest part of the track on entry, and they also take
a similar line on exit. I've seen this on enough different tracks to
make me think that it is not just for the sake of optimizing the turn
in, but also to reduce the uneven loads on the suspension going over the
transition. It seems like you would need to soften the front springs or
stiffen the rear a bit in order to handle that transition, which would
translate into more oversteer. But if I'm right about the reasons for
that then you should be able to get back to a more stable balance by
adjusting the bars in the opposite direction.

by **Gerald Moo** » Thu, 22 Nov 2001 23:21:34

Yeah, I guess you're right. I certainly never have. I've done a
handful of 50% races on the superspeedways. I think most leagues run
about 50%... on some tracks, this would be long enough for moderate
changes in temperatures, weather, amount of *** on the track
(groove AND marbles), etc.

This is all nitanoid stuff, to be sure. I'd much rather see them fix
the collision physics, aerodynamics, damage modeling, client
prediction, etc. before they ever bothered thinking about this kind of
stuff, since we'd all probably need Pentium 7's or something to run it
anyway.

Gerald

> (Gerald Moore) writes:

> >I don't think the groove ever changes in N4. I agree a dynamic track
> >surface would make an excellent addition to any racing simulator. Of
> >course, in your typical 20-40 lap sprint you get online, all this
> >would be wasted.

> How many people would even RUN a full-length race in N4?

> Eldred

by **Eldre** » Wed, 05 Dec 2001 05:52:49

(Gerald Moore) writes:
>Yeah, I guess you're right. I certainly never have. I've done a
>handful of 50% races on the superspeedways. I think most leagues run
>about 50%... on some tracks, this would be long enough for moderate
>changes in temperatures, weather, amount of *** on the track
>(groove AND marbles), etc.

>This is all nitanoid stuff, to be sure. I'd much rather see them fix
>the collision physics, aerodynamics, damage modeling, client
>prediction, etc. before they ever bothered thinking about this kind of
>stuff, since we'd all probably need Pentium 7's or something to run it
>anyway.

>Gerald

>> (Gerald Moore) writes:

>> >I don't think the groove ever changes in N4. I agree a dynamic track
>> >surface would make an excellent addition to any racing simulator. Of
>> >course, in your typical 20-40 lap sprint you get online, all this
>> >would be wasted.

>> How many people would even RUN a full-length race in N4?

>> Eldred

Sorry, this is a late response(downloaded on different computer). I've run
full length races in just about every sim I've owned, and I tend to think that
others do the same. However, my experience running servers for GPL tels me
that most people don't want the hassle of running one. You just need to find a
group of like-minded people who have the time in general, who all have the SAME
time...

Eldred
--
Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001
Homepage - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~epickett
GPLRank - under construction...

Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

by **Larr** » Thu, 06 Dec 2001 04:04:28

I do it too...

I have over 40,000 Laps logged at Talladega!

Of course that started way back with N2/NROS and before. I think I had
close to 20,000 laps logged on NROS when it shut down.

Damn, I get all teary-eyed thinking about that place :(

-Larry

> (Gerald Moore) writes:

> >Yeah, I guess you're right. I certainly never have. I've done a
> >handful of 50% races on the superspeedways. I think most leagues run
> >about 50%... on some tracks, this would be long enough for moderate
> >changes in temperatures, weather, amount of *** on the track
> >(groove AND marbles), etc.

> >This is all nitanoid stuff, to be sure. I'd much rather see them fix
> >the collision physics, aerodynamics, damage modeling, client
> >prediction, etc. before they ever bothered thinking about this kind of
> >stuff, since we'd all probably need Pentium 7's or something to run it
> >anyway.

> >Gerald

> >> (Gerald Moore) writes:

> >> >I don't think the groove ever changes in N4. I agree a dynamic track
> >> >surface would make an excellent addition to any racing simulator. Of
> >> >course, in your typical 20-40 lap sprint you get online, all this
> >> >would be wasted.

> >> How many people would even RUN a full-length race in N4?

> >> Eldred

> Sorry, this is a late response(downloaded on different computer). I've
run
> full length races in just about every sim I've owned, and I tend to think
that
> others do the same. However, my experience running servers for GPL tels
me
> that most people don't want the hassle of running one. You just need to
find a
> group of like-minded people who have the time in general, who all have the
SAME
> time...

> Eldred
> --
> Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001
> Homepage - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~epickett
> GPLRank - under construction...

> Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats
you
> with experience...
> Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

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