rec.autos.simulators

Just thought I'd point out that although ICR may be a better 'simulation'
visually, it is sadly lacking in many areas, some of which are: Really poor
race statistics (fastests laps, rankings, etc...), Lack of a save feature at
any point other than in the Championship is really poor (it is so hand for
practicing in F1GP to hop into the***pit of your previously gridded car
and start a race), Lack of a inside-cockpit view (with instruments) this comes
in very useful when watching other drivers race F1GP and learn approximate
shift points and cornering speeds, The computer cars in ICR seem incredibly
vunerable a slight tap will cause them to spin and even at low speeds they
will 'crash' out of the race which is totally unrealistic, When watching a
replay in ICR the sounds are an approximation of your shift points, I have
heard it downshift twice when I know I only went into 5th gear and multiple
6th to 2nd downshifts are heard as one downshift. Finally ICR's keyboard
routines for car control are inexcusable, they are pathetic in comparison to
F1GP (even with steering and traction help OFF)

Just a few opinions in support of F1GP

Also, ICR will most likely pale in comparison to F1GPII (due soon?)

Certainly no arguement on this. Papyrus appaerntly refuses to address this
as a problem. I guess they know how their program should be formatted, better
than the users.

THis should point to how realistic ICR is. Since when does everyone get to
practice with Nigel, Paul Tracy or Emmo. We are supposed to find these things
out for our selves. I personaly find this one of the fun aspects of ICR. I never
did go for the "free ride" option in F1GP.

Absolutely no arguement here.

F1GP (if I remember correctly) was intended to be used with the steering
help on. After many complaints they allowed the user to re-define more aspects
of the steering control (lock is one example). Still... I think steering help
(then the OPTIONS MENU) is intended to be on *UNLESS* you have a steering
wheel device. THis is what the Steering Help-> OFF was supposed to be for.
You use a j-stick... Leave it on. I use alot of the keyboard keys in ICR
for control. To be exact they are programed with/thru my WCS II. I notice no
problems. I'm sure if you are trying to control ICR with keyboard only, there
will be problems.

The one undeniable advantage of ICR over F1GP, is the modeling physics
used for driving/racing the car around the track. ICR uses more actual
physics (this is one of the things that made INDY 500 such a big hit).
Basicly totaly lacking in F1GP as far as I can tell. If not totaly lacking,
then certainly greatly reduce from what it probably should be.

We all have them... Pro & Con...

                                                Mark

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Comments?

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Bill Mette         | "People are personally responsible for keeping themselves

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A couple more:
Better framerate (expected as ICR has the far superior graphics detail)
Formula 1 (hey, my bias :-))

For all of ICR's advantages, I just haven't gotten into it as much as
WC/F1GP.  I've played ICR a decent amount, but have never considered a
championship season.  I did at least 3 with WC/F1GP.

Another vote for having both on your HD.

Dave

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        Ayrton Senna (1960-1994)        Roland Ratzenberger (1962-1994)

With ICR you can fuel your car to any amount before, practice, qual, pre-race
practice or before the race. You can start with a lighter load & get a quick
jump on the field. You will have to pit before everyone else thought :-)
This was shown VERY will in a ICR h2h modem race I had with a friend. I
out qualified & out practiced him. Then in the race he was anywhere from
5-2 secs per lap faster (in Hew Hampshire). Finially I realized that he must
have started with a lighter fuel load. Sure enough, in a few laps I took
the lead as he went in to pit. I was laughing pretty good on that one.

It does show to some extent how realistic ICR is.

At least in ICR you can hit Shift-R to start again instantly.

I have absolutely no idea how anyone can play F1GP or ICR without a
joystick or wheel. You have to be able to gently feed the throttle out
of corners (like that hairpin at Portland) in ICR, as well as apply brakes
with some control. I can't see how you can do this with a keyboard.
Still lots of people seem to do it! BTW I use a CH FSPro joystick (and
used a CH FS joystic before that). My worse problem is getting used to
not over-controlling when I jump into the***pit after a while of not
playing ICR.

I turned off steering and traction help off in F1GP early on. I hated
the fact you  couldn't spin up the wheels under acceleration and how
the car seemed to stick to the road. I think F1GP feels much more
realistic with all of this stuff turned off (nowhere near as good as
ICR though).

Amen - and in addition you see the car body move around which is good
feedback. The gradual onset of tyre squeal in ICR is also very useful
in determining when you are just starting to lose traction.
I love sliding the car around corners on the edge of control, ICR
feels really good when you are doing this.

As I mentioned above I think that turning off steering help etc makes
the car feel more realistic in F1GP. You just have to watch how often
the F1 drivers leave the track to see how difficult the cars are to
drive (even before the 'safety' changes this year).

And f1gp ii will pale in comparison with ICR 2 (whenever that comes
out).

I don't play f1gp except on slow machines. I greatly prefer
ICR but I can only play it on a friend's DX2/66 local bus machine -
anything slower just does not cut it (Well - a DX50 is OK).

Bill.